My main problem with the new ones is that it feels like a forced, small universe.
Star Wars, when I first saw it, was an adventure, into the unknown, and cahracters were picked up along the way, and the plot was pieced together. It was so much more fun for me.
The new ones fill in the gaps. They don't work as stand alone narratives, because they go by what has already been done. Lucas can try and make it a saga you can watch from 1-6, but it just doesn't work in practice.
The OT is the bulk of the story. The PT fills in those gaps, and (tries to) answer the questions we make after seeing the OT. There needs to be the stimulus (OT) and the response (PT). It doesn't work the other way around, it just comes across as clunky, and forced.
Han Solo is one of the finest characters in Star Wars. In fact, even after all these years I am still in awe with the character. The fact that he is like the maverick from the old westerns. A lovable, gunslinging rogue, with a sly wit and isn't afraid to speak his mind.
Han Solo exudes charisma. He is a fantastic character. He was created as one half of Luke Skywalker - the antagonist, who would always argue and bicker and have great banter with the hero.
I am so glad that Han Solo isn't going to be in Episode III. He's the one of the very few characters that has remained largely intact and will still have that "unlikely pairring" with Luke Skywalker. Han Solo will be one of the very few characters left that actually keep the Star Wars Universe wide and open and keep that sense of adventure.
I can't believe people dissed Han Solo. God will punish you when you die, remember that.
I agree with everything you said Superfly! 🤘
Originally posted by darthmaul1
How is the CG overkill?? this is star wars what do you want matt paintings? you can't even tell that the back grounds are CG, unless you are a complete dork and watch the whole movie frame by frame.
I'm not gonna discuss CG in this thread, if you wanna debate with me about it go here: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=335340&goto=lastpost
and who said anything about the backgrounds!?!
Honestly, the dialogue in the prequels are terrible. The films also seem to be more like an excuse to show off pretty visuals. Also, Lucas didn't do that good of a job with letting the audience connect with the characters. There aren't many ways the viewer can relate to characters like Anakin, Obi-Wan, or Qui Gon Jinn. And I don't blame Lucas for "destorying" the Star Wars saga, it's just very difficult to accomplish that with a storyline and world such as this. Although I can admit, it could have been executed a lot better. Better writing and better direction would have improved these films immensely.
Damn good point fezster.
Anakin has many human sides to him, but the fact that hes some sort of chosen one, a slave and has such an odd lifestyle makes him hard to relate to.
Luke and Han had much more tangable, identifyable characters. thats what I think makes them connect on a better level with the audeince.
I agree that the characters are hard to relate to, but I still find myself loving them. I'm still gonna shed a tear during the Obi-One/Anikan fight. I'm still going to get teary eyed when Mace kicks the bucket. Even though I can't relate to them, I still love 'em.
But for the CG, I consider it overkill because i like the cheesy alien masks of the original better. Just my opinion.
Yes thats true. But Lucas wanted to make Starwars as an 12 hour movie (with 6 chapters). I think he didn't accomplish that.
I think he has got 2 movies, both 6 hour because .. well uhh. let me give an example.
In the OT, we met Darth Vader, and he changed during the saga. We get to know him and we loved him. And at the end of the saga he dies.
In the PT we get to know the father of the legendary Boba fet. But 30 minutes later we see his head rolling on the ground in some computer-made blue screen area.
It just isn't good enough for me... Jango could have been such an interesting character. (its just an example) I think Lucas should have introduced Dooku in Episode I at Qui-Gon's funeral.
OT --> "Less is more"
PT --> "OVERKIL!!"
OT --> "Less is more"
PT --> "OVERKIL!!"
Yes, I agree there Banshee. That's been my philosophy forever. Less is always more.
It's apparent in so many films. Alien, Terminator, The Exorcist, all the top films of their genre and all because the audience doesn't see an awful lot, despite the fantastical natures of them. Same thing goes for Star Wars.
The idea of visual effects is to enhance the image, whereas I feel the effects in the new Star Wars movies overwrite everything and anything in the scene, including the actors, trying their best to PRETEND they on a real set and that theres a creature stood in front of them.
I agree with most of the comments made. Superfly you bring up some great points. And while I still LIKE the prequels, there hasn't been any revelations that I was like "woah" and wasn't that the point of the prequels to tell us the missing pieces and things we didn't know. (I loved how people up till NOW still thought that Palpatine was not Sidious......Even though it was the same actor, and it was pretty obvious at many points.... Those people I couldn't debate because they were absolutely stupid.) I think they haven't really introduced anything that amazing. I totally agree that they are mostly just visual movies to (with a mixed bag of good and bad fx) see what happened pre-OT era. Episode 3 looks to be finally what we've been waiting for, as far as plot and story goes, screw Episode 1 and 2. These films are definately also CG overkill, and I prefer and love the old costumes, masks, etc. I'm glad they used some costumes for the prequels (AKA Nute Gunray, etc)...
The OT is definately were things go down. Episode 3, like I said, will also be one that will show what we've been waiting for-Anakin becoming Darth, Palptaine/Sidious becoming Emperor, and the fall of the Jedi. Really all Episode 1 did was introduce Anakin, which didn't need to be the entire movie, and then Episode 2 introduced the Clone Wars, and now we finally get to see the end result......
And I agree with the points made about films like Aliens, Terminator, Exorcist, etc. They used fx when needed, and in small doses, so that it was actually more suspensful. Jaws would be another fine example of this. The new ones, the actors don't really know how to react very well to whats going on around them, besides Ewan McGregor who does a great job of this.
Yes episode 1 introduced anakin but that was only a part of it. it showed how palps was using the trade federation to stir things up and eventually become supreme chancelor. episode 2 did more than show the clone wars it yet again showed more manipulation of palps with the jedi and senate, and padme and of course jar jar (if it wasn't for his stupidity palps wouldn't of got his emergincy powers.) it showed that palps and dooku had a thing going during the phantom menace cause dooku aka tyranus was the one who recrutied jango.
in 3 we will finally see the whole plan come together and the fall of Anakin.
Yes, all these things you mention could have been in one movie and had even more. Even GL said in Premiere magazine recently that he didn't want the first two to be about the fall of Anakin really. He likes to tell fans one thing, then screw them over later and say he never said them.
He originally said that the first three would be about the demise of Anakin Skywalker, where really its mostly in the third, unless you count Anakin's whines in the 2nd as being his fall to the dark side.
I don't think they could of put all of it in one movie
We know Anakin has an anger managment problem.
as I said the first one was his introduction and palps rise to power
the 2nd one with regard to Anakin was his displeasure with Obi-wan and the council and the loss of his mother and the killing of all the tuskens and his falling in love, all of which can potentialy lead to the dark side
Not all of it, but definately more than they did. And then we would have had more of the good stuff such as Anakin falling to the dark side, which will be relatively brief in Episode 3. But you also tried to make it sound like more plot and detail by adding the killing of all the tuskens, which is about five seconds on screen.
Reading the script for the 3rd too, I thought it was definately the best script for the prequels by far too, but it felt a little rushed when he made the final decision to turn to the dark side and a little awkard as to why he did also. But don't get me wrong, its handled very well over all. I think Episode 3 looks to be very promising.
The first one has no purpose, really. Episode II would have been the best place to kick things off. There was no need to see Anakin as a child. Lucas could have just ran a parrelel with Luke and show that he was trained much later in his life (and would show how much of risk Luke was later on, as Yoda and Ben decide to train him knowing full well the path his father took, it would accenuate that risk).
Episode I could have been removed, and nothing would have made a difference. Really - what happens in Episode I? A fake war is started, and Palpatine gets promoted, big deal. As far as Star Wars movies and plotlines go, Episode I is a non-event. Why not just bring it forward and have the Clone Wars, as a much bigger event, that causes Palpatines rise to power, rather than keep it. You'd have more time to pan out events, keep the timeline consistent, keep parrelels between Luke and Anakin. and have more room for the plot to "breathe" with character.
There's no need to have Anakin as a ten year old. It's really unecessary. It would have made more sense for Anakin to stay with his mother as much as Luke stayed with Owen and Beru. To lose her at Lukes age, after knowing her ALL of his life, would have been more heart-rending. You could tie it in to his blame of the Jedi easily too. He blames the Jedi for taking him away from his mother - it could have easily been re-written to accodmodate a better timeline. For instance, Anakin looked after his mother, and when he was on a Jedi mission he didn't agree with, she gets killed, or something. He would blame the Jedi. Maybe Obi-Wan gave him the order, or something. Having Anakin stay with his mother all through his life until she dies would be something the audience could relate to a helluva lot more, mainly because the audience could see Anakins point of view. There's always an easier solution. It would have been interesting if Anakin was a reluctant Jedi, much like Luke was. He didn't want to be a Jedi, but Obi-Wan or Qui-Gon, or whoever, insisted upon it, or something like that, because he knew it was his destiny. You could make Anakin to be a more sympathetic character, more relatable to everyone in the way Luke was, while not needing Episode I, yet still have the important bits.