Originally Posted by JurySimply because Trinitarians under-estimate the efficacy of the Holy Scriptures. They rather choose to believe in a "mystery" which humans had incorporated more than two hundred years after the demise of Christ's desciples than to believe in God's proclamation that He is alone the True God... and Jesus' declaration that the Father ALONE is the True God.
And the fact that Christ told his diciples to baptize them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit does not apply to your analogy of the Trinity.
Re: Re: The Holy Trinity, Why people don't undestand it?
Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
That's crap. That would mean they aren't christians. Unless you're trying to condemn Catholocism while reamining relevant to the words of christs that followed the reformation. Bottom line, if you consider yourself a christian, then you have to believe that Jesus is god. Otherwise, you're wasting you time. And to imply anything else is a lie.
Not necessarily....
Many Christians are simply Christian because thier parents were...many Christians ( especially young Christians) do not even go to Church, pray, or follow any of the rituals....
And when asked if they beleive that Christ is savior, they go "oh sure, yeah i beleive that".....then ask them what they know about Jesus, and they go, "oh...he like died on the cross, right ?"
But they still identify as Christian, therefore they belong to the Christian community, whether the Church likes it or not.
Re: Trinity or not.
Originally posted by Bicnarok
The catholic Trinity cult is based on the Verses in John 1.1 which goes something like "and word is GOD".But there are numerous occasions where Jesus prays to his father, this plus the fact that no one can see god and live tends to contradict this direction of though.
What do you all think?
Difficult to understand really. I think the trinity will always be one of those aspects of God that is "beyond understanding."
Re: Re: Trinity or not.
Originally posted by ThundarThis is only true in this context due to man's interpretation. It is evidence of the flaw of Trinitarianism because the Bible tells us that God is not the author of confusion. Yet Trinitarian views are more confusing than nearly anything in existence. Rather than admit the confusion they state, it is "beyond understanding" or a "mystery."
Difficult to understand really. I think the trinity will always be one of those aspects of God that is "beyond understanding."
* i do not believe in Trinitarian concept and doctrines, but i do believe in the Godhead (The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit)...
* about John 1:1, 14... let's ask Saint John, who the heck is he talking about in his whole freakin' book (excuse the term)? 🙄
"This is the disciple that beareth witness of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his witness is true.
And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself would not contain the books that should be written."
John 21:24-25
* according to the last two verses, the whole freakin' book is all about Jesus... all... about... J... E... S... U... S... so what is the relevance of stating "The Word" in the introductory verse if "The Word" is not Jesus? makes sense? okay, let's try it the other way... the author of the Gospel of Saint John is also the author of the Book of Revelation / Apocalypse... let us explore there and see what we can find...
"And he is arrayed in a garment sprinkled with blood: and his name is called The Word of God."
Revelation 19:13
* so, "The Word" is not a word... but an entity... "The Word" is a name of an existing entity... and if we shall read the preceding verses particularly on verses 7 and 9, "The Word" is also "The Lamb"... and who is that "Lamb"? let us jump back to the Gospel of Saint John again...
"On the morrow he seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold, the Lamb of God, that taketh away the sin of the world!"
John 1:29
* "The Lamb" is Jesus... do the math... another approach...
"And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.
John beareth witness of him, and crieth, saying, This was he of whom I said, He that cometh after me is become before me: for he was before me."
John 1:14-15
* John the Baptist bore witness of whom? of "Him"... who is "Him"... according to verse 14, John the Baptist bore witness to "The Word"... later but still in the same chapter, who is "The Word" whom John the Baptist bore witness of?
"And John bare witness, saying, I have beheld the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven; and it abode upon him.
And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize in water, he said unto me, Upon whomsoever thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and abiding upon him, the same is he that baptizeth in the Holy Spirit.
And I have seen, and have borne witness that this is the Son of God.
Again on the morrow John was standing, and two of his disciples;
And he looked upon Jesus as he walked, and saith, Behold, the Lamb of God!"
John 1:32-36
* John the Baptist bore witness of Jesus and none other... another approach...
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
The same was in the beginning with God.
All things were made through him; and without him was not anything made that hath been made."
John 1:1-3
* all things are made through whom? again, who is the "Him"? of course, all things are made through "The Word"... but as we study the New Testament, it was revealed later by Saint Paul who is that "Word" whom all things are made through...
"Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;
For in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;
And he is before all things, and in him all things consist."
Colossians 1:15-17
"Yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we unto him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we through him."
I Corinthians 8:6
* all things are made / created through "The Word", Jesus Christ... 😉