Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
Yeah I know...it's sickening. And I wouldn't doubt that he's sort of viewing this as Christianity vs. Islam or whatever....and I knew you didn't actually think he was the devil 😉
There is a girl in my class though that is seriously proposing he might be the anti-Christ.
One of these days people are gonna get a clue and not vote for him come the next election.
Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
I see a couple misunderstandings on both sides here...First thing:
Being a Christian means accepting Jesus as your Lord and your saviour...and trusting that He is the way to God...(the one and only God Jesus speaks of in the bible).
Unfortunately, and believe me I know this might sound harsh, there is no room for other Gods/other explanations of “how” and “why” with Christianity...that's exactly what being a Christian entails...and before I became a believer, I used to demand to know WHY, WHY, WHY it is these "closed-minded" Christians think that way.
Well...now I know why. Because believing there is only ONE way, IS the only way (to come to God and to salvation). It didn't make sense to me until...well...until it made sense to me. It's the only way that works...and it's the only way that was meant to work. We didn't choose it to be so cut and dry. Blame Him! As Christians, we can't say there are others ways...that's not how Christianity works.
And for some reason, it seems popular these days for people to think its SOOOO horrible for anyone to say there's only one truth. It's like..."Well, sorry. But the truth I believe in just so happens to be about believing in ONE truth...I didn't make it like that. But I believe in it...it makes sense to me...so don't start making me look like the bad guy because I'm not willing to be what you call 'open-minded,' and accept there's possibly other God's/explanations/whatever...I just don't. Can't help it."
And I hope non-Christians here appreciate where I'm coming from. Because at the end of the day, I have as much choice to what makes sense to me, as you do to what makes sense to you...don't say I'm being condescending because what makes sense to me just so happens to be about Jesus being the only way.
…does that make sense???
Second thing:
Evangelizing to people isn't something Christians should think they need or have to do...or that it's a requirement of being a Christian.
If anything it should be looked at as a privilege. If you are a Christian, and you believe that Christ died on the cross for the sins of man, and that we are now in the process of the world being redeemed...it’s gonna happen with or without us. That's why God sent His Son...to redeem the world through him. We're just meant to take part by being Christians (and that happens by allowing yourself to become more like Jesus).
We're NOT gonna do it by telling people "this is what will happen to you if you don't accept God NOW!!!"
Would you be drawn to something like that?...or to something like Jesus (who came as a humble, loving, serving example of how we should treat and respect each other). By simply being a Christian, and acting out you faith, you ARE evangelizing.
Question is…is your faith being acted out (meaning, are you becoming more like Jesus?)
So, I'm sorry but painting Christianity as an endless source of love and serenity without mentioning that it teaches its followers to live up to the commandments and whatnot or they will be damned to eternal pain is utterly hypocritical.
All this applies if you believe in the bible, and from what I got from your posts it seems evident you do.
Originally posted by Eis
Saying Christianity isn't about rules is an incredibly fallacious statement...
Thanks so much for reading my post. And thanks for your response. You bring up some fair points regarding rules and salvation.
I'm not sure if you are or aren't a Christian, or how much knowledge you have of the bible in its entirety (and what the whole story of the Bible and Jesus is)...but I'll try and be as succinct as possible to respond to your points.
Unfortunately ther are many people/many Christians who have a very uninformed understanding of the story of the Bible, who Jesus is, and how they should be living their Christian lives. This partly has to do with the cultural popularity of things like the 10 Commandments which can make Christianity into a neat, easy to understand way of approaching things. There are also many Christians who are fortunate to have the knowledge and understanding of the true message of the Bible. And in a nutshell, it is about love. Love being received (from God), love been given (to the world).
In brief, there are two main parts to the book of the bible. The Old Testament (which has a basic focus on God-given law), and the New Testament (which has a basic focus on the time Jesus was on earth, on his disciples, and the spreading of Jesus' word around the "known" world after His death).
So, I was saying that in the New Testament, Jesus and the Holy Spirit were (as promised by God) given so that we could essentially be married to Christ, and no longer to the Law. That way, by accepting Jesus (the proposed perfect example of how we should live) into our lives, God would be loving us like he loves his very son.
To point to a biblical passage, Paul in Romans 7:1-5 said after Christ’s death for man "Do you not know, brothers—for I am speaking to men who know the law—that the law has authority over a man only as long as he lives? For example, by law a married woman is bound to her husband as long as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of marriage...So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit to God."
We are no longer married to the law because we died to it.
Living by religious rules to get in favor with God (called legalism) is the surest way of living a defeated Christian life...because we will always fall short. So by having been given the gift of Christ, we can now be transformed to be Christ-like, all by him. All that Christians have to do is let Jesus be the guide in their lives.
What the passage above is talking about is echoed all throughout the New Testament.
This may be unfamiliar to you, but as I said, I don't know how much knowledge you have of the message of the bible, and what you know form bits and pieces of popular culture Christianity.
Perhaps a misconception you might have is that law and religious rules was meant for Christians...it wasn't at all. It was meant for non-Christians (and this, before Jesus came). Christians have been made righteous through Jesus.
Another passage, Timothy 1:8 exaplains "We know that the law is good if one uses it properly. We also know that law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels..."
Jesus Christ is an amazing phenomenon that transforms people into becoming what ultimately the law says, and what Timothy says is good (loving God, and loving you brother/sister/neighbour).
This may be new to you, but I think what you're talking about is more Judaism.
The message of Christianity is that the way to heaven is Christ, not by living by rules.
Thanks for reading.
Originally posted by ThePittman
Because we didn’t need to, we found out that creation of tools allowed us to do what we need too. If we didn’t evolve our intelligence then we would have died off and others that adapted to the environment would have thrived and multiplied. If God created us then in his image then why do we only use 10% of our brains, does he only use 10% of his brain? Without the use of tools you would have a VERY slim chance of catching a cat, dog, bear, wolf or any other animal for that matter.
Yes, and if we had never evolved to live in the first place we wouldn't die atall, so we didn't have to live and feel pain.
Originally posted by ThePittman
I don’t know where you get this idea at all, why do we need some mystical reason for life. Do animals need a reason to live? We live to reproduce, learn and evolve to become better then we were before through our offspring.
Ok, so you say we live, just so we live/reproduce learn etc. But why? i ask. There is no point, we're all going to die anyway, and we know it, but we just try and avoid it because of the pain. Atleast when you're dead there is no more pain! Personally if i didn't believe God wanted me to live, i would have killed myself ages ago! lol
Originally posted by ThePittman
People also assume that since atheist do not believe in God that we don’t have anything to follow or that we can do anything without consequences, that is farther from the truth. I don’t believe in God yet I don’t kill, not because God tells me to but because it is wrong. This causes pain and suffering to others and I don’t want that to happen to me. I don’t steal because I don’t want that to happen to me, it cause pain and suffering to others. If God didn’t tell you killing is wrong would you kill? If you wouldn’t is it because you know that it would cause pain and suffering to another and taking away the loved one of another.
.
Originally posted by ThePittman
God has set forth many rules and do you live by them all, if not then why do you obey some and not others? Could it be because that some feel more right then others, you do what make you feel better, if you don’t go to church every Sunday because you have work to do or something else you feel that is more important then worshiping God that day. Can you say that even if the Ten Commandments were not written you would live your life breaking them all?
It's hard to follow all the rules because we are not perfect, unlike you make out, you think you're born knowing right and wrong, but you aren't. So the book is there, with intelligent laws, which if properly followed by everyone would actually prevent all sin on earth, and EVERYONE would actually be equal and equally happy.
The commandments would have been written, he would have made them if that's what he thought was right. I don't know what i'd have done if he wouldn't have, because he did write them.
Originally posted by BananaKing
It's hard to follow all the rules because we are not perfect, unlike you make out, you think you're born knowing right and wrong, but you aren't. So the book is there, with intelligent laws, which if properly followed by everyone would actually prevent all sin on earth, and EVERYONE would actually be equal and equally happy.
Hey brother. I don't know where you are in your walk/how much knowledge you have of scripture, but if you haven't already, take a glance at my post above regarding laws and rules. Maybe consider what the scripture I've included is saying...
bless ya
Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
Hey brother. I don't know where you are in your walk/how much knowledge you have of scripture, but if you haven't already, take a glance at my post above regarding laws and rules. Maybe consider what the scripture I've included is saying...bless ya
I've never heard of any Christians having to abide by laws and rules. Might as well be in a cult. I think, personally, each and every man and woman on this earth should be able to live their lives freely instead of having to walk a straight line everyday. You'd get pretty bored and misreable having the same "routine" everyday. The way you live your life definitley shouldnt affect your walk with God. But why should someone have to "go by the book" in order to be accepted by God?
Originally posted by BlackSunshine
But why should someone have to "go by the book" in order to be accepted by God?
Exactly. You don't have to. You're accepted by God just by inviting His son into your life.
Originally posted by BlackSunshine
The way you live your life definitley shouldnt affect your walk with God.
Not quite sure what you mean there. All I can say though is that if a Christian takes time to pray, makes an effort to love their brother/sister/neighbour, and takes scripture into consideration (including the Commandments) by reading the Bible, your walk with God will be that much better (because you've made it possible for the Holy Spirit to do more work in you and make you more Christ-like).
Originally posted by EPIIIBITES
Not quite sure what you mean there. All I can say though is that if a Christian takes time to pray, makes an effort to love their brother/sister/neighbour, and takes scripture into consideration (including the Commandments) by reading the Bible, your walk with God will be that much better (because you've made it possible for the Holy Spirit to do more work in you and make you more Christ-like).
Meaning if you have a drink every once and a while or you have a ciggartte or two it's not gonna effect your walk or at least it shouldnt. I mean your not exactly doing anything that is against "Gods' will"
That's absolutley right. Smoking, for example, in itself isn't a sin.
I think it might pain God if Christians harm themselves by doing something like smoking and not looking after their health, and this is because he loves us and wants what's best for us. We're His children.
The great thing is though, if we submit ourselves to Jesus, and allow Him to lives through us, things like smoking will just become less and less attractive to us (because it's not attractive to Him). Even after they've accepted God into their lives , a Christian may still want to do something like smoke, or even worse, sin (becasue of indweling sin and bad habits), but since our old self has died, and Jesus now lives in us, we're dead to sin, and the sinful as well as non-sinful habits will gradually be of no interest to us...all we gotta do is trust in this truth, trust in Him, and most importantly, not think that we can do it ourselves (becasue He didn't make us to do it ourselves...we were made to need Him).
Originally posted by BananaKing Yes, and if we had never evolved to live in the first place we wouldn't die atall, so we didn't have to live and feel pain.I don’t know what you are trying to say here.
Originally posted by BananaKing Yes Ok, so you say we live, just so we live/reproduce learn etc. But why? i ask. There is no point, we're all going to die anyway, and we know it, but we just try and avoid it because of the pain. Atleast when you're dead there is no more pain! Personally if i didn't believe God wanted me to live, i would have killed myself ages ago! lolBecause it is in our genetic make up, if we don’t have the drive to reproduce then we die off, all species on Earth has this same drive from the lowest form of life to humans. Yes we all are going to die but it is the self-presveration that keeps us going, sometimes this is overridden because of mental health, drugs or whatever. I have also at one time thought of killing myself but I didn’t need God or some divine sprit to keep me from doing it but that I knew that this feeling and troubles in my life will pass and I wanted to see more of life.
Originally posted by BananaKing Yes You are brought up to think that way by your parents, and why? Because it would get you in trouble with the law. God WOULD have said it was wrong to kill, because he did. If someone claimed he changed it i'd question the realisticness, the ten comandments are the big rules that he clearly layed down, so i highly doubt they will change.I was brought up by the laws of man and not God, I was exposed to Christianity when I was growing up and read the bible and even went to church but I also learned that it wasn’t nothing more then fairy tales much like the books I read as a kid. They were moral lessons and ways to live you life but not some divine words, much like the old G.I. Joe cartoons. You would watch a story and see it unfold and at the end you would get a summary of the lesson that you should have learned. “Now you know and that is half the battle” Before the Ten Commandments people already knew the rules, they knew killing was wrong and so forth but they didn’t need God to tell them.
Originally posted by BananaKing Yes It's hard to follow all the rules because we are not perfect, unlike you make out, you think you're born knowing right and wrong, but you aren't. So the book is there, with intelligent laws, which if properly followed by everyone would actually prevent all sin on earth, and EVERYONE would actually be equal and equally happy.As I said it is a book of moral guidelines and not the divine words of God, much like the stories parents would tell their children of the boogie man so that they would keep them in line and to go to bed.The commandments would have been written, he would have made them if that's what he thought was right. I don't know what i'd have done if he wouldn't have, because he did write them.