Dr Strange Vs Rachel Summers

"Classic" Rachel did about as well against Galactus as Strange did. She wasn't nearly powerful enough to even pose a threat to the Beyonder, even after he powered her up. Wolverine nearly killed "classic" Rachel, and she couldn't mentally shut Wolverine down during Enemy of the State. Xavier mentally defeated Phoenix Force Jean, and Xavier was unable to penetrate Strange's psychic defenses at all.

So Rachel at her absolute most powerful is the Phoenix, which as GS said, is the most powerful being in the entire universe or whatever, but Rachel's average and most recent showings are far from that. That's the only version we should be debating, here, for the same reason we shouldn't use Keeper Surfer feats or Blood and Thunder Thor feats on their threads.

"She wasn't nearly powerful enough to even pose a threat to the Beyonder, even after he powered her up."

Of no consequence. That was the same with every other bein in the multiverse. LT included.

"Wolverine nearly killed "classic" Rachel"

Says nothing of her power at all. A phoenixes physical body can be destroyed but its essence cant be. If she had "died" she would have just reformed at a later date. Rachel healed anyway.

"That's the only version we should be debating, here, for the same reason we shouldn't use Keeper Surfer feats or Blood and Thunder Thor feats on their threads."

Nope not necessarily. Its fine to debate about whatever character in any incarnation for the purpose of a thread. Theres nothing wrong with that whatsoever. DrS is very powerfu and is obviously too much for standard rachel which would make for a boring and very short thread. Therefore Rachel in her phoenix incarnation who is considerably less powerful than her mother is just fine to be matched up with Strange.

But Rachel in her Phoenix incarnation is still Phoenix, and thus still "all powerful". Her powers of flucuated wildly over the years, there's no way to debate this unless we settle on one version of her. Her most recent version loses, her most powerful version wins and her average version (80s rachel) is probably the most even matchup. I give it to Strange with any prep whatsoever.

Originally posted by demigawd
But Rachel in her Phoenix incarnation is still Phoenix, and thus still "all powerful". Her powers of flucuated wildly over the years, there's no way to debate this unless we settle on one version of her. Her most recent version loses, her most powerful version wins and her average version (80s rachel) is probably the most even matchup. I give it to Strange with any prep whatsoever.

Rachel as phoenix isnt all powerful at all. She only has a fraction of jeans essence within her. Rachel was also always scared and unwilling to use her powers because not only did they make her lose her memories of her past, but she also feared the power and its capacity for destruction. Strange has battled and held his own against entites such as Galactus, eternity and even LT. Although it wasnt directl applied to him he also managed to negate the effects of the IG. Strange is very capable of defeating rachel. She was scared of using her powers and that lead to her not being very experienced with them. That and the fact that she always held back in the use of phoenix powers are things DS could take advantage of.

Any other version of rachel would lose without a doubt which is why im using phoenix 2. At least that way both characters have a chance of winning making for an easier and fairer argument and therefore a better thread

Strange negated the use of the IG *twice*, and once it WAS directly applied to him. The first time, he negated the use of it by Nebula, which wasn't used directly against him. The second time, he fought an IG-wielding Warlock(with prep), who very much used the IG against him, and countered everything Warlock threw at him. That's pretty uber.

So assuming we settle on mid-80s Rachel (Phoenix 2), I'd say with any amount of prep, Strange wins a pretty good match. His best feats outstrip hers. I believe her best feat was fighting Galactus to a draw, a feat Strange matched.