Originally posted by demigawd
When did he react to Surfer traveling at lightspeed? Don't tell me when Surfer tried to grab the IG, because it never said he went at lightspeed.
To be fair if Surfer was going to grab the IG in an attempt to prevent Thanos from unleashing universal destruction, its safe to assme that he'd be going as fast as he could. But yeah nothings conclusively stated with regards to the speed. 😉
I don't have my copy of IG with me so perhaps someone else can confirm what it says but earlier it mentions Surfer and Warlock are something like a standard lightyear away from where Thanos is, and Surfer manages to travel that distance before Thanos has time to finish throwing a punch...
I'm not sure how far away they say Warlock and Surfer are, but either way Surfer is really moving when he goes for the gauntlet, regardless of if its lightspeed or not, and Thanos reacts, he isn't getting speedblitzed.
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
To be fair if Surfer was going to grab the IG in an attempt to prevent Thanos from unleashing universal destruction, its safe to assme that he'd be going as fast as he could. But yeah nothings conclusively stated with regards to the speed. 😉
True, but given Surfer's close proximity and the fact that he needs to accelerate and factor in a bit of PIS AND factor in the fact that it was more Surfer missing than anything and....that's about as conclusive proof of Thanos' superspeed as saying Batman has superspeed because he dodged Superman's heat vision.
I know this is a bit late but I checked IG last night and Warlock states he and Surfer are "a little more than a lightyear away from Thanos' current position". Surfer travels that distance in the time it takes Thanos to throw a punch, so 3 seconds tops, so I'm sure an estimate can be made about his speed in that scene...
Originally posted by Wally West
I know this is a bit late but I checked IG last night and Warlock states he and Surfer are "a little more than a lightyear away from Thanos' current position". Surfer travels that distance in the time it takes Thanos to throw a punch, so 3 seconds tops, so I'm sure an estimate can be made about his speed in that scene...
Good call. But if that's the case, it's actually an even worse case against Thanos. If a speedblitzing opponent can travel a LIGHTYEAR in the time it takes for Thanos to throw a punch, then Thanos, realistically speaking, should have no chance.
All things considered, Thanos should lose to just about any FTL opponent with enough strength to injure Thanos. And most CL100+ characters have the strength to at least cause Thanos pain. Multiply that by thousands and thousands of attacks per second, and it makes a difficult case for Thanos.
Unless, of course, you're willing to throw speedblitzing out the window as a viable strategy.
Are you?
Originally posted by demigawd
Good call. But if that's the case, it's actually an even worse case against Thanos. If a speedblitzing opponent can travel a LIGHTYEAR in the time it takes for Thanos to throw a punch, then Thanos, realistically speaking, should have no chance.All things considered, Thanos should lose to just about any FTL opponent with enough strength to injure Thanos. And most CL100+ characters have the strength to at least cause Thanos pain. Multiply that by thousands and thousands of attacks per second, and it makes a difficult case for Thanos.
Unless, of course, you're willing to throw speedblitzing out the window as a viable strategy.
Are you?
Yeah but the punch wasnt thrown at Silver Surfer he was engaged in battle with someone else so you cant read too much into that.
Plus Thanos engages FTL characters all the time and his reflexes have proved sufficient. He is after all an Eternal.
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Yeah but the punch wasnt thrown at Silver Surfer he was engaged in battle with someone else so you cant read too much into that.Plus Thanos engages FTL characters all the time and his reflexes have proved sufficient. He is after all an Eternal.
Why would he punch someone at less than full speed? And he's never shown any abilities to punch or react unusually fast. People are using that "feat" to support FTL reflexes, but if you give somebody a lightyear handicap, that's not much of a feat, is it?
Thanos engages FTL characters, but do they use FTL attacks against him? Nope. PIS.
Originally posted by demigawd
Why would he punch someone at less than full speed? And he's never shown any abilities to punch or react unusually fast. People are using that "feat" to support FTL reflexes, but if you give somebody a lightyear handicap, that's not much of a feat, is it?Thanos engages FTL characters, but do they use FTL attacks against him? Nope. PIS.
How can you dismiss all the FTL characters multitude of combat showings against Thanos as PIS yet try and discredit Thanos based on one punch? It doesnt work out that way Demi.
He's fought many heralds and other FTL characters he has proven his ability to hold his own against such characters time and time again. This really isnt good enough.
Originally posted by demigawd
Why would he punch someone at less than full speed? And he's never shown any abilities to punch or react unusually fast. People are using that "feat" to support FTL reflexes, but if you give somebody a lightyear handicap, that's not much of a feat, is it?Thanos engages FTL characters, but do they use FTL attacks against him? Nope. PIS.
1. I'm sure you go all out when you're smashing ants, right? Full speed punches left and right. Full force smashes with your foot. 🙄
Cap is less than an ant relative to thanos, even WITHOUT the infinity gauntlet... why WOULD he go full speed? You use the force that's necessary. You don't shoot an ICBM to fight a squirrel. That doesn't mean you can't shoot an icbm. That means it would be stupid and overkill to do so.
2. When someone travels a light year in an instant, it is impossible to react to unless you have FTL reflexes. A lightyear is not a handicap when you're traveling at speeds that surfer travels. That's like saying one boxer has a "handicap" when dodging because the other boxer threw a punch from a foot away. (except the surfer travels a lightyear faster than the boxer extends his hand a foot)
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
How can you dismiss all the FTL characters multitude of combat showings against Thanos as PIS yet try and discredit Thanos based on one punch? It doesnt work out that way Demi.
You got it backwards, GS. I'm not TRYING to discredit Thanos based on one punch. Rather, someone used that "feat" as an example of Thanos having FTL reflexes, and I just pointed out the dubiousness of it. It's not a particularly good showing of character A's speed when character B is able to move a lightyear in the span of time it takes character A to throw a punch. Just the opposite.
He's fought many heralds and other FTL characters he has proven his ability to hold his own against such characters time and time again. This really isnt good enough.
Wrong. When Thanos has a single showing of reacting against FTL attacks, then I'll accept that he has the ability to do it. As it stands, Thanos got speedblitzed by Captain Marvel (see scan on previous page), and punched so slowly that Surfer was able to travel a lightyear in less time.
Doesn't look good for Thanos against Superman.
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
How can you dismiss all the FTL characters multitude of combat showings against Thanos as PIS yet try and discredit Thanos based on one punch? It doesnt work out that way Demi.He's fought many heralds and other FTL characters he has proven his ability to hold his own against such characters time and time again. This really isnt good enough.
you BOTH are right. he HAS fought many ftl characters and been successful. based on that, the only conclusion you can come to is that he is capable of handling charater's with that level of speed.
but demi's point is well taken. an example is his battle with runner who completely owned thanos to the point where thanos couldn't even hit him. BUT runner did have the gem, so that's a special case i suppose.
we could square it away by allowing for heightened senses on thanos's part, a type of cosmic awareness that enables him to see and deal with ftl opponents. i see no other way to explain away the fact that he has successfully battled all these characters, and because there have been so many, i'm not willing to attribute PIS to all of them.
Originally posted by slade10
1. I'm sure you go all out when you're smashing ants, right? Full speed punches left and right. Full force smashes with your foot. 🙄Cap is less than an ant relative to thanos, even WITHOUT the infinity gauntlet... why WOULD he go full speed? You use the force that's necessary. You don't shoot an ICBM to fight a squirrel. That doesn't mean you can't shoot an icbm. That means it would be stupid and overkill to do so.
2. When someone travels a light year in an instant, it is impossible to react to unless you have FTL reflexes. A lightyear is not a handicap when you're traveling at speeds that surfer travels. That's like saying one boxer has a "handicap" when dodging because the other boxer threw a punch from a foot away. (except the surfer travels a lightyear faster than the boxer extends his hand a foot)
Granted, but when dealing with limited showings against FTL and lightspeed, you take the evidence at hand. what little evidence exists pretty squarely supports Thanos having no ability to react to FTL, or lightspeed attacks. Like I said to GS before he fled, I'm not using that example as proof that Thanos doesn't have lightspeed reflexes....I'm simply showing that it's NOT an example that he does, as people have stated by bringing this example up in the first place.
Originally posted by leonidasbut demi's point is well taken. an example is his battle with runner who completely owned thanos to the point where thanos couldn't even hit him. BUT runner did have the gem, so that's a special case i suppose.
I don't recall him TRYING to hit runner. He just turned him into a baby and teleported away.
Runner did say that he was too fast for thanos. But runner says that to everyone...
Originally posted by demigawdYour a known thanos hater, and an even more known IDIOT, anything you say can be discredited considering you agreed with a man who said that Silver Surfer was more powerful than galactus.
You got it backwards, GS. I'm not TRYING to discredit Thanos based on one punch. Rather, someone used that "feat" as an example of Thanos having FTL reflexes, and I just pointed out the dubiousness of it. It's not a particularly good showing of character A's speed when character B is able to move a lightyear in the span of time it takes character A to throw a punch. Just the opposite.Wrong. When Thanos has a single showing of reacting against FTL attacks, then I'll accept that he has the ability to do it. As it stands, Thanos got speedblitzed by Captain Marvel (see scan on previous page), and punched so slowly that Surfer was able to travel a lightyear in less time.
Doesn't look good for Thanos against Superman.
no, thanos tried eyeblasting him and couldn't even come close. runner was literally toying with thanos. again, he had the gem so that may be a special case.
i agree with the underlying premise demi is establishing. i just believe thanos MUST be able to react ftl based on who he has defeated. to say ss could beat him by moving ftl implies that every one of their fights was pis. it happened too many times for me to say that. the only logical alternative is to say thanos CAN react at ftl and handle ftl opponents.
Originally posted by leonidas
you BOTH are right. he HAS fought many ftl characters and been successful. based on that, the only conclusion you can come to is that he is capable of handling charater's with that level of speed.
Not if the characters have never used any FTL attacks, or even lightspeed attacks. If they don't use it, then you can't say he can react to it.
Batman has dodged heat vision before. He's punched Superman before, who has lightspeed reactions. Can we conclude, then, that Batman has lightspeed reactions? Of course not. The only thing we can conclude is that Superman CHOSE not to make use of his speed.
Ditto with Surfer. When we see Surfer dodging left and right and showing fists and blasts flying from all directions against Thanos and Thanos doing a highspeed punch at precisely where Surfer is, THEN we can conclude that he can deal with FTL attacks. Otherwise, the only conclusion we can accurately make is that those characters didn't attack Thanos at highspeed, for whatever strategic reasons.
but demi's point is well taken. an example is his battle with runner who completely owned thanos to the point where thanos couldn't even hit him. BUT runner did have the gem, so that's a special case i suppose.
But then there's also Captain Marvel, who speedblitzed Thanos and Thanos was unable to react. Hell, even Spider-Man dodged Thanos! SPIDER-MAN.
Whenever speed has been used against Thanos (and there aren't many times), Thanos has been found wanting.
we could square it away by allowing for heightened senses on thanos's part, a type of cosmic awareness that enables him to see and deal with ftl opponents. i see no other way to explain away the fact that he has successfully battled all these characters, and because there have been so many, i'm not willing to attribute PIS to all of them.
It doesn't have to be PIS. It's just as easily CIS, or strategic decisions that backfire, or simple pride. Surfer is a pacifist, he's not a warrior. And he's shown lesser inclination to use his speed than Superman, who IS a warrior and HAS shown speed feat almost every issue.