Onslaught vs Odin

Originally posted by h1a8
Mangog almost killed Odin with physical attacks quickly. Mangog hit Thor many many times more than Odin but wasn't even koed. Why would I lie on purpose?

Originally posted by h1a8

What does it matter if
Onslaught can physically penetrate Juggs then he certainly can Odin.
Nice way to avoid the argument.

Originally posted by nicamarvin

because He DID NOT penetrated Juggernaut Physically..... 😠

To be honest I rather Onslaught had not penetrated Juggs physically because of what I think of Juggernaut. I argued tooth and nail that Juggs is weak to strong enough psionic energy and that Onslaught was a pure psionic being. Thus we got him being penetrated easily.

But nearly everyone wanted to argue with me and I finally conceded (got tired of it). That is why I now say Onslaught did it physically. But if I have others to agree that it wasn't all physical then I can jump back on the psionic non physical bandwagon again.

Dude we all know Asguardians can die of physical attacks and odin is no different, and Yes Juggernaut could kill him, but thats if Odin lets him and guess what He aint gona do that, Onslaught will not even touch him.... 😮‍💨

Originally posted by h1a8
Mangog almost killed Odin with physical attacks quickly. Mangog hit Thor many many times more than Odin but wasn't even koed. Why would I lie on purpose?

official bios are legit if they are not contradicted by on panel evidence.

What does it matter if
Onslaught can physically penetrate Juggs then he certainly can Odin.
Nice way to avoid the argument.

Originally posted by h1a8
Mangog almost killed Odin with physical attacks quickly. Mangog hit Thor many many times more than Odin but wasn't even koed. Why would I lie on purpose?

official bios are legit if they are not contradicted by on panel evidence.

What does it matter if
Onslaught can physically penetrate Juggs then he certainly can Odin.
Nice way to avoid the argument.

I dont know which incident u are referring to and im quite sure u dont either,lol but Odin was already extremely weakened prior to almost being killed by mangog. That is irrelevant here especially when mangog has admitted to being no match for Odin before

Further u havent read anything on panel so u dont know whether official bios contradict it or not (which they do). Thats ur problem u argue without having any knowledge of the characters and end up making a fool of urself. A class 75 being cannot oneshot ulik with a single punch.

And no im not avoiding anything u moron. The whole point is that Odin is more durable than juggernaut and hence whether or not onslaught penetrated juggernaut is irrelevant.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Scans?

I haven't seen the comic in a long time (years ago). All I remember is Mangog holding up Odin seemingly manhandling him. I didn't actually see a physical hit though. But it happened pretty quickly vs.Thor and Mangog fighting for much longer.

Thor is the strongest and most physically durable asgardian. If Thor can lift more than million of tons and Odin only 75 then his durability against physical attacks should reflect the same too. The Mangog thing as well as this reasoning led me to believe that Odin's PHYSICAL durable is as butter compared to Thor's. Now blasts and energy are different. Odin>>>Thor in that respect.

1 thing is undeniable though. That Juggs physical durability exceeds Odin's and thus making Onslaught being able to penetrate him too.

Originally posted by Naija boy
I dont know which incident u are referring to and im quite sure u dont either,lol but Odin was already extremely weakened prior to almost being killed by mangog. That is irrelevant here especially when mangog has admitted to being no match for Odin before

Further u havent read anything on panel so u dont know whether official bios contradict it or not (which they do). Thats ur problem u argue without having any knowledge of the characters and end up making a fool of urself. A class 75 being cannot oneshot ulik with a single punch.

And no im not avoiding anything u moron. The whole point is that Odin is more durable than juggernaut and hence whether or not onslaught penetrated juggernaut is irrelevant.

moron me I guess. Maybe I am but I certainly am not trying to be. You complain to the mods yet u are the one throwing insults. Even if someone is a retard or moron doesn't mean it is right to call them one. Do you believe I lack knowledge on issues or that I purposely say false or misleading things?

So Odin has one-shotted Ulik with a punch? If so then that would contradict the bios. I am reasonable, just prove me wrong by stating or showing relevant feats. Sometimes I agree sometimes I don't.

But there is no way in hell that Odin is more durable than Juggernaut (not physically nor energy based). The only way Odin would have an edge is resistance to magic and that's it. Your statement about Odin>Juggs in durability may be the dumbest thing you have ever said on this forum.

Originally posted by h1a8
moron me I guess. Maybe I am but I certainly am not trying to be. You complain to the mods yet u are the one throwing insults. Even if someone is a retard or moron doesn't mean it is right to call them one. Do you believe I lack knowledge on issues or that I purposely say false or misleading things?

So Odin has one-shotted Ulik with a punch? If so then that would contradict the bios. I am reasonable, just prove me wrong by stating or showing relevant feats. Sometimes I agree sometimes I don't.

But there is no way in hell that Odin is more durable than Juggernaut (not physically nor energy based). The only way Odin would have an edge is resistance to magic and that's it. Your statement about Odin>Juggs in durability may be the dumbest thing you have ever said on this forum.

U lack knowledge of anything comics related in general and instead of simply being silent u go on to make false claims about the characters history. So both. And also being civil with u has honestly gotten nowhere as u have continued to make more and more foolish claims so i quite frankly dont care anymore. There is no form of "debate" possible when u are involved in the first place.

Yes Odin has oneshotted Ulik with a punch. And thats while he was weakened. Once again this is where actually reading comics comes in before making stupid claims about a character.

Moreover, instead of actually presenting some reasonable evidence as to why juggernaut is more durable u go on to make more foolish blanket claims. Odin has taken galaxy busting attacks from high skyfather level beings. This is far above anything juggernaut has endured. Of course inspite of this u will just continue to claim that jugs is more durable or without anything to support it. Thats just how u operate...

Originally posted by h1a8
[B]I haven't seen the comic in a long time (years ago). All I remember is Mangog holding up Odin seemingly manhandling him. I didn't actually see a physical hit though. But it happened pretty quickly vs.Thor and Mangog fighting for much longer.

Thor is the strongest and most physically durable asgardian. If Thor can lift more than million of tons and Odin only 75 then his durability against physical attacks should reflect the same too. The Mangog thing as well as this reasoning led me to believe that Odin's PHYSICAL durable is as butter compared to Thor's. Now blasts and energy are different. Odin>>>Thor in that respect.

How is energy attacks different if Odin just stands there and takes it? Energy attacks does the same damage as blunt force. Blunt force is a type of attack that harnesses the attack's body energy.

It's also funny how you try to pass off Odin's durability as only class 75 when a poisoned Odin K.O.ed Ulik in one punch. There's no instance of Thor ever koing Ulik in one hit but you would like to say Thor is the stronger Asgardian? An amp Thor with the Power Gem got his head pummeled into the ground by Thanos. Next issue we see Odin unmoved by Thanos' punch. How is Thor more durable?

1 thing is undeniable though. That Juggs physical durability exceeds Odin's and thus making Onslaught being able to penetrate him too.

There's nothing to deny because there's nothing to debate here. Odin is more durable than Juggernaut and even an amp Thor.

Originally posted by Naija boy
U lack knowledge of anything comics related in general and instead of simply being silent u go on to make false claims about the characters history. So both. And also being civil with u has honestly gotten nowhere as u have continued to make more and more foolish claims so i quite frankly dont care anymore. There is no form of "debate" possible when u are involved in the first place.

Yes Odin has oneshotted Ulik with a punch. And thats while he was weakened. Once again this is where actually reading comics comes in before making stupid claims about a character.

Moreover, instead of actually presenting some reasonable evidence as to why juggernaut is more durable u go on to make more foolish blanket claims. Odin has taken galaxy busting attacks from high skyfather level beings. This is far above anything juggernaut has endured. Of course inspite of this u will just continue to claim that jugs is more durable or without anything to support it. Thats just how u operate...

You forgot that energy based attacks are not the same as physical ones. What galaxy busting attack did Odin take? Issue number or scans? You can post a poll on who's more durable with the exception of magic and it would be clear that Juggernaut is the winner. I have agreed with you on certain debates after disagreeing yet you seem to forget. Implying that it is impossible to debate with me.

Originally posted by nicamarvin
penetrated Juggernaut Physically

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
How is energy attacks different if Odin just stands there and takes it? Energy attacks does the same damage as blunt force. Blunt force is a type of attack that harnesses the attack's body energy.

It's also funny how you try to pass off Odin's durability as only class 75 when a poisoned Odin K.O.ed Ulik in one punch. There's no instance of Thor ever koing Ulik in one hit but you would like to say Thor is the stronger Asgardian? An amp Thor with the Power Gem got his head pummeled into the ground by Thanos. Next issue we see Odin unmoved by Thanos' punch. How is Thor more durable?

There's nothing to deny because there's nothing to debate here. Odin is more durable than Juggernaut and even an amp Thor.

You do realize that the Odinforce greatly amps Odin's physical attributes as well as his power in general, right? Odin, by default, can be considered a "class 75" simply due to his Asgardian genetics if you will. When he taps into the OF, though, he easily exceeds Thor and most of Thor's rogues in the strength department. This is simple for most to accept.

Originally posted by h1a8
You forgot that energy based attacks are not the same as physical ones. What galaxy busting attack did Odin take? Issue number or scans? You can post a poll on who's more durable with the exception of magic and it would be clear that Juggernaut is the winner. I have agreed with you on certain debates after disagreeing yet you seem to forget. Implying that it is impossible to debate with me.

U claimed that Juggernaut was more durable to both energy and physical attacks. Regardless in his fight against Forsung, The energy being released was destroying the galaxy and creating new suns. Yet Odin was taking forsungs attacks just fine. Similarly galaxies were destroyed due to the output released in his fights against Infinity and Seth, but Odin was taking these very same attacks without being koed. The results of a poll do not tell us who is more durable and attempting to claim so is fallacious.

Originally posted by h1a8
[B]It is clear that energy based attacks are not the same as physical based ones. Many characters can absorb, harness, and manipulate energy through their body like nothing. Energy can also have no concussive properties and just burning properties (or something similar).

Wait, they can ALSO HAVE concussive properties. Thanos' attack was because it was budging Odin a bit. Surfer's blast doesn't burn, it's concussive most of the time. Neither hurt Odin. Thanos' amp punch only annoyed Odin.

There are even materials on Earth that can resist different types of energy (heat, electricity, etc.) but will easily shatter or break if struck with small forces.

But the issue at hand is both Surfer and Thanos' were concussive and Odin was not hurt at all.

Naija explained the Ulik incident and I accept it. So Odin is above class 75 but ALL bios say that Thor is the strongest of all asgardians because of his hybrid nature (Gaia's blood in him). This is hard not to accept since writers were involved in these bios as stated on the Marvel site (I'm not sure it's still there though). Also Ulik is low class 100 if he is class hundred at all.

[quote]There are feats that prove Thor could one shot him too.

Show me actual feats of him one shotting Ulik, Surfer, or Annihilus. Just one scan of him one-shotting any of these characters should do.

Thor has one or two shotted stronger beings before.

LOL. That could be applied towards Surfer as well. But when they meet and fight, Thor has never one shot either Surfer or Ulik. Odin made them look like punks. And this was what the writers of Thor think of Odin since they have him one shoting people who have given Thor trouble time and time again.

So by Thor not one shotting Ulik means it was either a low showing or Thor was holding back grossly.

No, it just means that Ulik and Surfer are his peers. It's not a low showing, it's an ordinary showing when every time they meet Thor he's never able to one shot k.o. them.

That is crazy. What a foolish statement. Create a poll and see how foolish it is.

I didn't create a poll, but I did do a thread for debate asking for actual feats to back up people's claims rather than just opinions on who is more durable.

Originally posted by Naija boy
U claimed that Juggernaut was more durable to both energy and physical attacks. Regardless in his fight against Forsung, The energy being released was destroying the galaxy and creating new suns. Yet Odin was taking forsungs attacks just fine. Similarly galaxies were destroyed due to the output released in his fights against Infinity and Seth, but Odin was taking these very same attacks without being koed. The results of a poll do not tell us who is more durable and attempting to claim so is fallacious.

I stand by Juggs being more durable to both energy (except magic) and physical attacks. Odin surviving a galaxy attack doesn't quite convince me when I know (or have overwhelming belief that) Juggs can too. Plus a galaxy attack hitting a humanoid gets diluted by more than 1 billions times since it isn't concentrated in one spot but spread throughout the galaxy (a large area). You make a point though. It can't be proven. When proof is not possible, a decision on evidence should be the deciding factor. This is the way criminal court room justice is.

The evidence I have to support the claim that Juggs is more durable is that there is evidence that his durability is universal (takes a least universal force to penetrate). It was stated that the crimson bands of cyttorak binds the universe together. The same bands that give Juggs his indestructibility. Now I'm referring to the untampered full powered bands. Not the ghostly ones that can be summoned and whose strength depends on the will of the user. The second evidence is that all bios says he is absolutely indestructible (note: evidence is not proof). Only the abstracts had this level of durability in the bios. Everyone else (including skyfathers and galactus) didn't have that level. The third evidence is that Juggs tanked Godblasts and other high level attacks like it was nothing.

Even if it is possible to penetrate Juggs he heals instantly (even from a skeleton). HF would count as durability right?

Statistically, the results of a poll usually does reflect the truth if one choice gets more than 70% of the vote and there are more than 30 votes. Thus a poll can be considered evidence too.

Let me ask you a question. I will greatly respect you if you are honest. Excluding magic and mind attacks, do you believe that Juggs have greater or equal durability than Odin? Now this is just your opinion and not something of fact.

If you say yes then it still doesn't prove that Onslaught wins. I drop that argument and agree Odin wins. So I am no longer arguing who wins this fight in the thread. I concede. Odin wins.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Wait, they can ALSO HAVE concussive properties. Thanos' attack was because it was budging Odin a bit. Surfer's blast doesn't burn, it's concussive most of the time. Neither hurt Odin. Thanos' amp punch only annoyed Odin.

But the issue at hand is both Surfer and Thanos' were concussive and Odin was not hurt at all.

Show me actual feats of him one shotting Ulik, Surfer, or Annihilus. Just one scan of him one-shotting any of these characters should do.

LOL. That could be applied towards Surfer as well. But when they meet and fight, Thor has never one shot either Surfer or Ulik. Odin made them look like punks. And this was what the writers of Thor think of Odin since they have him one shoting people who have given Thor trouble time and time again.

No, it just means that Ulik and Surfer are his peers. It's not a low showing, it's an ordinary showing when every time they meet Thor he's never able to one shot k.o. them.

I didn't create a poll, but I did do a thread for debate asking for actual feats to back up people's claims rather than just opinions on who is more durable.

Lastly, energy can be concussive doesn't mean that it is all (or always) concussive. For example, light has concussive properties (pseudo kinetic energy) but less than 1% of the energy is concussive. Laser beams largely burn through stuff and have very little concussive force. Getting hit with a SS cosmic blast is not the same as getting hit with a Thor hammer strike.

I concede to Odin winning this so its cool now. I was just thinking that with Franklin Richards (celestial level at full potential), magneto's, xavier's, x-man, etc. all power to the 10th degree more and with that crazy Juggernaut feat makes this a good fight. My strategy was Onslaught teleporting behind Odin and penetrating him physically. i guess that wouldnt work

Originally posted by h1a8
[B]ulik and surfer are not peers.

Nobody says they are peers. To Thor they are in durability and strength.

ulik isnt even class 100 I believe. Didn't thor two shot Namor or something? Anyway Ulik is nothing. One shotting him proves greater than 100 ton strength though.

Ulik is obviously something and Thor thinks so. It's not like the guy just stands their and let's Ulik wail on him free.

Lastly, energy can be concussive doesn't mean that it is all (or always) concussive. For example, light has concussive properties (pseudo kinetic energy) but less than 1% of the energy is concussive. Laser beams largely burn through stuff and have very little concussive force. Getting hit with a SS cosmic blast is not the same as getting hit with a Thor hammer strike.

So when Surfer blast a hole through star ships, it's not really the concussive force of the attack piercing through but really just the fire that's burning through? LOL.

Originally posted by h1a8
Lastly, energy can be concussive doesn't mean that it is all (or always) concussive. For example, light has concussive properties (pseudo kinetic energy) but less than 1% of the energy is concussive. Laser beams largely burn through stuff and have very little concussive force. Getting hit with a SS cosmic blast is not the same as getting hit with a Thor hammer strike.

Every time I turn around you try to apply real world physics to the world of comics...
💃 💃 💃

its called the "power cosmic"... it does things that physics can't even seem to explain!... its like scientific magic voodoo man!

and surfer also travels faster than light... but... at light speeds your mass would expand... and surfer's doesn't... doesn't that defy quantam physics...

seriously... stop trying to apply real world stuff like the writers even consider that crap when they are writing stories.

Was Onslaught able to use the Cyttorak gem? He he had this in this fight might make the difference.

Originally posted by h1a8
I stand by Juggs being more durable to both energy (except magic) and physical attacks. Odin surviving a galaxy attack doesn't quite convince me when I know (or have overwhelming belief that) Juggs can too. Plus a galaxy attack hitting a humanoid gets diluted by more than 1 billions times since it isn't concentrated in one spot but spread throughout the galaxy (a large area). You make a point though. It can't be proven. When proof is not possible, a decision on evidence should be the deciding factor. This is the way criminal court room justice is.

The evidence I have to support the claim that Juggs is more durable is that there is evidence that his durability is universal (takes a least universal force to penetrate). It was stated that the crimson bands of cyttorak binds the universe together. The same bands that give Juggs his indestructibility. Now I'm referring to the untampered full powered bands. Not the ghostly ones that can be summoned and whose strength depends on the will of the user. The second evidence is that all bios says he is absolutely indestructible (note: evidence is not proof). Only the abstracts had this level of durability in the bios. Everyone else (including skyfathers and galactus) didn't have that level. The third evidence is that Juggs tanked Godblasts and other high level attacks like it was nothing.

Even if it is possible to penetrate Juggs he heals instantly (even from a skeleton). HF would count as durability right?

Statistically, the results of a poll usually does reflect the truth if one choice gets more than 70% of the vote and there are more than 30 votes. Thus a poll can be considered evidence too.

Let me ask you a question. I will greatly respect you if you are honest. Excluding magic and mind attacks, do you believe that Juggs have greater or equal durability than Odin? Now this is just your opinion and not something of fact.

If you say yes then it still doesn't prove that Onslaught wins. I drop that argument and agree Odin wins. So I am no longer arguing who wins this fight in the thread. I concede. Odin wins.

Ur belief that juggernaut can survive the same galaxy busting blasts Odin was tanking is based on virtually nothing since he has never even come close to taking such an attack on panel. Further Odin did take direct blasts fully concentrated on him from Seth and we know from the collateral damage that his other blasts caused that seth was hurling galaxy busters.

There is no evidence that juggernauts durability is universal. The crimson bands of cyttorak binding the universe together does not equate to universal force being needed to take out juggernaut. Not even close. Not to mention that tears have been caused in the fabric of the universe (time and space) by less than universal powers. Further not all bios say that he is totally indestructible as some describe him as near totally invulnerable or extremely durable. SO that is another faulty basis for ur conclusion. Lastly tanking a godblast is not even close to being useful evidence for ascribing total indestructabillity to juggernaut when the godblast is not even close to one of the most powerful attacks in marvel when u consider skyfather+ characters. It is further shown to be faulty when u consider that other characters (like Odin for example) have tanked much more powerful attacks and yet we do not ascribe to them total indestructability.

Actually no, simply assuming that because many people believe it to be true it, it must be, especially when many of those people have varying levels of knowledge regarding the issue and are more than anything influenced by personal preferences is a glaring example of argument ad populum or appeal to popularity fallacy.

And no i do not believe that juggernaut has greater than or equal durability to Odin.