Originally posted by Gideon
The burden of proof is on you, Nebaris, not me. 😉
No, it actually really is on you, given that your ABC argument is dependant on Palpatine being completely unable to overpower Mace using the force. The burden of proof is on you to prove that he was using all of his power against Mace, otherwise your argument, that the weaker Dooku definitely wouldn't be able to overpower Mace simply because Palpatine appeared to not be able to, hasn't a leg to stand on.
That might support Kiddo's point if all Mace did was block the lightning. Alas, he did not. Alas, your point (and his) fails. Vaapad allows for a loop that deflected Palpatine's Force lightning back upon the Sith Lord.
Irrelevant misdirection. My counter was involving the method in which Mace was able to defend against Palpatine's lightning. There was no need to elaborate on the fact that he channelled that defence into an offense via a deflection, as either way, Mace was still only applying a physical defence - his lightsaber, to defend himself against Palpatine.
You've yet to answer how such a physical defence speaks - in any way - for how adept he would have been at defending against an attack such as a force choke, which would have to be directly defended against via the force, or rather, you've yet to accept that it doesn't.
If you believe that this applies only to Force lightning, the burden is on you to prove it.
Not that the burden of proof is actually on me, the novelisation's exact words were "super-conducting loop" which would indicate that it would only apply to lightning.
None of my points fail. The same properties and circumstances that resulted in Palpatine's defeat are very likely to occur with Dooku, since it refers to the nature of Vaapad.
That would only be the case if Dooku were to either engage Mace in lightsaber combat, or with force lightning. You've yet to grasp the fact that if Dooku were to attempt to overpower him with a telekinetic or other such attack, Mace would have to apply a defence which he never had to use against what Palpatine threw at him.
If you believe that this will not occur with Dooku, it's up to you to prove it. 😉 [/B]
No, it's still up to you to prove the opposite, as you made the original claim - that Dooku wouldn't be able to overpower Mace with the force, simply because someone stronger didn't - which as it stands, remains completely unproven.
The burden of proof is on you to prove that he was using all of his power against Mace,
Right, We saw Sidious use his powers all out on Yoda, he used none of that against Mace. Sidious was faking so much in that fight, for Anakin. Ian Mcdiarmid even stated in Star Wars Insider that the lighting did not effect his appearance and that messed up look was his real face.
You've yet to grasp the fact that if Dooku were to attempt to overpower him with a telekinetic or other such attack, Mace would have to apply a defence which he never had to use against what Palpatine threw at him.
The move on Kenobi in ROTS with Anakin coming in on him, I don't see Mace having anything to block that.
And saying well he has Vaapad so he must beat all darksiders. 😖
Originally posted by kiddo44i thought he meant that figuretively, as in "the real darth sideous we know and hate emrged" kinda thing 😬
Right, We saw Sidious use his powers all out on Yoda, he used none of that against Mace. Sidious was faking so much in that fight, for Anakin. Ian Mcdiarmid even stated in Star Wars Insider that the lighting did not effect his appearance and that messed up look was his real face.
Originally posted by kiddo44no but he has a better chance at them than most other jedi..
The move on Kenobi in ROTS with Anakin coming in on him, I don't see Mace having anything to block that.And saying well he has Vaapad so he must beat all darksiders. 😖
Originally posted by MadMel
i thought he meant that figuretively, as in "the real darth sideous we know and hate emrged" kinda thing 😬
No, this was in an interview in 2005, and he was asked about the face change, and what was the "real" Sidious face and he said the messed up one, and his face as Palpatine was a cover.
Originally posted by kiddo44
No, this was in an interview in 2005, and he was asked about the face change, and what was the "real" Sidious face and he said the messed up one, and his face as Palpatine was a cover.
McDiarmid is not a G-canon source. Hell, he even said in the "Becoming Sidious" documentary that he moves "500 times faster than the Jedi" -- as good as Palpatine is, he's clearly not that fast.