Bush Accepts McCain's Ban on Torture

Started by PVS2 pages

Bush Accepts McCain's Ban on Torture

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051215/ap_on_go_pr_wh/congress_detainees_29

Bush Accepts McCain's Ban on Torture [stabs cheney in the back ๐Ÿ’ƒ ]

By Liz Sidoti / Associated Press

WASHINGTON - President Bush reversed course on Thursday and accepted Sen. John McCain's call for a law banning cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment of foreign suspects in the war on terror.

Bush said the agreement will "make it clear to the world that this government does not torture and that we adhere to the international convention of torture, whether it be here at home or abroad."

"It's a done deal," said McCain, talking to reporters in a driving rain outside the White House after he met with the president.

Under the deal, CIA interrogators would be given the same legal rights as currently guaranteed members of the military who are accused of breaking interrogation guidelines. Those rules say the accused can defend themselves by arguing it was reasonable for them to believe they were obeying a legal order. The government also would provide counsel for accused interrogators.

"We've sent a message to the world that the United States is not like the terrorists," McCain said earlier as he sat next to Bush in the Oval Office. "We have no grief for them, but what we are is a nation that upholds values and standards of behavior and treatment of all people, no matter how evil or bad they are. And I think this will help us enormously in winning the war for the hearts and minds of people throughout the world in the war on terror."

Still holding out was Rep. Duncan Hunter, R-Calif., chairman of the House Armed Services Committee. He said he would hold up completion of one of the two bills that includes the ban unless he got White House assurances that the new rules would still allow "the same high level of effective intelligence gathering" as under current procedures.

But officials said the ban would remain intact in the other bill, the final defense spending measure.

The White House at one point threatened a veto if the ban was included in legislation sent to the president's desk, and Vice President Dick Cheney made an unusual personal appeal to all Republican senators to give an exemption to the CIA.

But congressional sentiment was overwhelmingly in favor of the ban, and McCain, a former Navy pilot who was held and tortured for five and a half years in Vietnam, adopted the issue.

The Republican maverick and the administration have been negotiating for weeks in search of a compromise, but it became increasingly clear that he, not the administration, had the votes in Congress.

Bush called McCain "a good man who's honored the values of America."

"We have worked very closely with the senator and others to achieve that objective as well as to provide protections for those who are the front line of fighting the terrorists," Bush said.

McCain thanked Bush for his personal participation in the negotiations and his effort to resolve their disagreements.

McCain said there are no loopholes in the agreement. The negotiations with the White House produced an agreement to provide to civilian interrogators the same legal defense protections as those afforded military interrogators and to set up a process for legal counsel.

He said that he and other congressional supporters of the amendment told the White House they believed it was sufficient to have the same protections as provided to military personnel and "I'm glad they agreed."

McCain said he hoped to have it passed in Congress within 24 hours.

Sen. John Warner, R-Va., Hunter's counterpart in the Senate, was on board and appeared with Bush and McCain in the Oval Office. "We're going to get there," Warner said afterward.

McCain's amendment would prohibit "cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment" of anyone in U.S. government custody, regardless of where they are held. It also would require that service members follow procedures in the Army Field Manual during interrogations of prisoners in Defense Department facilities.

In discussions with the White House, a provision was added modeled after the Uniform Code of Military Justice. That says that military personnel accused of violating interrogation rules can defend themselves if a "reasonable" person could have concluded they were following a lawful order. The addition extends those rights to CIA interrogators, and McCain said from the Oval Office that they were "legitimate concerns."

Officials said the language also now includes a specific statement that those who violate the standards will not be afforded immunity from civil or criminal lawsuits.

In recent weeks, the administration had sought to add language that would offer protection from prosecution for interrogators accused of violating the provision. But McCain rejected that, arguing it would undermine the ban by not giving interrogators reason to follow the law.

Earlier this year, the Senate included McCain's original provisions in two defense bills, including a must-pass $453 billion spending bill that provides $50 billion for the Iraq war. But the House omitted them from their versions, and the bills have been stalled.

Negotiations intensified this week, with Congress under pressure to approve at least the spending bill before adjourning for the year.

Supporters of the provisions say they are needed to clarify current anti-torture laws considering abuses at Abu Ghraib in Iraq and allegations of misconduct by U.S. troops at the detention center at Guantanamo Bay.

They also say that passing such legislation will help the United States repair an image they say has been tarnished by the prisoner abuse scandal.

The White House long has contended that the United States does not engage in torture.

The White House long has contended that the United States does not engage in torture.

LOL yeah right........then have them define torture as well.

Originally posted by soleran30
The White House long has contended that the United States does not engage in torture.

Exactly, it's ridiculous that this is even an issue.

Field interrogations FTW.

I wonder if this includes extreme interrogating too..

i think that this great country is going to the shits b/c of p***y bush we should torture the al quida members for info..

Originally posted by Ness
i think that this great country is going to the shits b/c of p***y bush we should torture the al quida members for info..

bush is our president.
if you cant get behind him and support him in these troubled times
then you are obviously anti american. love it or leave it.
if you dont like it you can just geeeeeeeeeeeeeeit out. ๐Ÿ˜

BWAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA ๐Ÿ˜‚
oh i waited so long to throw that it someone's face.
thanks for stepping up to the plate ๐Ÿ˜„

Originally posted by Ness
i think that this great country is going to the shits b/c of p***y bush we should torture the al quida members for info..
Yeah, and especially people who were mistaken for arab terrorist suspects. I hope I get kidnapped next week to be interrogated in some country for half a year.

LMFAO

hmm I don't think this bill makes that much difference in practice, tho it might be symbolic but we all know. If the stakes are high enough, the militairy, NSA, CIA and whatever will torture suspects to get the info they need.

you're either with him, or you're with the terrorists!!!! ๐Ÿ˜‚

oh somebody stop me!!!!!! ๐Ÿคฃ

they are conditioning us to accept torture

they tried to, and they failed.
enough said on the conspiracy end
kthx

Originally posted by Deano
they are conditioning us to accept torture

I'd ask for evidence, but I know that you have none, so let's just both agree that you're full of crap.

That said, by your posting history, you must be trying to condition us to accept complete drivel as accepted fact through your monotonously repetitive posts (which in and of themselves may be considered torturous) .

well in all fairness, cheney and his pet bush did spend the last 4 years trying to justify torture with the whole 'ticking time bomb' scenario. i just see that as bullshitting the people rather than 'conditioning'. god even when he comes close to a valid point it still reaks of icke ๐Ÿ˜˜

your always asking for evidence. but your too idiotic to see it even if i did show you. there is more torture now then ever before, many storys of incresed brutality invloving tasers and other torture devices. and then there are the army methods of torturing prisoners.

p.s take your hate elsewhere. i shud be able to post without getting attacked by some morons. cheers.

Originally posted by PVS
well in all fairness, cheney and his pet bush did spend the last 4 years trying to justify torture with the whole 'ticking time bomb' scenario. i just see that as bullshitting the people rather than 'conditioning'. god even when he comes close to a valid point it still reaks of icke ๐Ÿ˜˜

its called conditioning. you can make jokes about icke all the want. but it seems you dont have the courage to admit certain things that you know are right just because you think they may be involved in a conspiracy.

so carry on with mentioning icke all you want. wont change a thing.

Originally posted by PVS
well in all fairness, cheney and his pet bush did spend the last 4 years trying to justify torture with the whole 'ticking time bomb' scenario. i just see that as bullshitting the people rather than 'conditioning'. god even when he comes close to a valid point it still reaks of icke ๐Ÿ˜˜

That wasn't so much a conspiracy as it was a couple of dicks in government doing whatever the hell they wanted and not giving a crap who knew.

I would think that a conspiracy would have more panache.

yes, a conspiracy is covered up. cheney was never in the closet about his love for cruel and unusual punishment. thus the fact that we all know of his preference. deano, READ THE ARTICLE ๐Ÿ˜–

Originally posted by Deano
p.s take your hate elsewhere. i shud be able to post without getting attacked by some morons. cheers.

I can't believe he'd actually have the nerve to post that statement when having previously posted the following statement recently in a thread that there was absolutely no discourse between him and I.

Originally posted by Deano
id kill kharmadog. then the world will be a much better place. no poverty or crime, only peace.

Not only are you paranoid person, you're a bit of a tool as well.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
I can't believe he'd actually have the nerve to post that statement when having previously posted the following statement recently in a thread that there was absolutely no discourse between him and I.

Not only are you paranoid person, you're a bit of a tool as well.

your really clutching at straws.can you not understand what a joke is? obviously not. i try to get along with you sometimes, but as always you prove impossible.