Character Ownage

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Warming up your nervous system or what have you only applies when you are reacting to things within your realm of speed.

You are hundreds of times faster than a slug. You require no warm up there to dodge a slug speed attack.

Yet a slug is closer to you in speed than even quicksilver is to Barry.

I'm not making a case for what can or can't tag Flash, I'm saying if you suddenly deem Flash exempt from any feat you see as low, and instead only accept his speed as absolute, then why can't you do the same with other characters? Speed and everything that comes with it is a super power subjectable to writer interpretation just like everything else. Why is it only Flash that is granted his absolute best in comics? You might as well just plop down one feat for each super power and expect that to speak as the absolute truth if that's the case.

Even a character with great averages like Superman goes up 10 notches if we go by some of the standards people try to use with Flash.
Infinite strength
Universal durability
Almost Flash speed, which you just scale off whatever Flash's best is and lower it by a few notches.
Etc

Originally posted by One Big Mob
I assume he has a decent sense of humor by arguing with Carv every thread. Maybe this one sets him off, who knows? Is he "Hehe asian, cute..." And secretly hates me, or does he take it as wildly offensive? I'm sure we'll find out, and that's a gamble I'm willing to take.

Bran is intelligent, so we Asians accept him as one of our own.

With regards to the durability, that was another power I thought of that fit the narrative,but I couldn't care enough to add it.

With speed, the reason why I add it is because it takes supreme PIS for it to affect you when we are using the street level attacks (like Catwoman, Deathstroke etc).

I guess I'm referring to reflexes, because of course you can hold back your travel speed....Usain Bolt can run 100m in 20seconds if he wanted, or 2minutes.

But if a fist is coming towards you, and you can see it in slow motion.....how would that work? If we accept that character XYZ is slower than, say, Thor...it's like being punched by a sloth.

The example I like to use is online gaming, where your opponent has extreme lag. You can see what they're doing, in slow motion...and it's up to you to react accordingly. I guess then CIS comes into play....but how retarded does one have to be to get punched?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Bran is intelligent, so we Asians accept him as one of our own.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Bran is intelligent, so we Asians accept him as one of our own.

With regards to the durability, that was another power I thought of that fit the narrative,but I couldn't care enough to add it.

With speed, the reason why I add it is because it takes supreme PIS for it to affect you when we are using the street level attacks (like Catwoman, Deathstroke etc).

I guess I'm referring to reflexes, because of course you can hold back your travel speed....Usain Bolt can run 100m in 20seconds if he wanted, or 2minutes.

But if a fist is coming towards you, and you can see it in slow motion.....how would that work? If we accept that character XYZ is slower than, say, Thor...it's like being punched by a sloth.

The example I like to use is online gaming, where your opponent has extreme lag. You can see what they're doing, in slow motion...and it's up to you to react accordingly. I guess then CIS comes into play....but how retarded does one have to be to get punched?

Which is perfectly fine, but the implications of posts like this

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Basically. That basically means PIS, as plot is dictated by writers.

One might argue 'why not the other way, you biased piece of shit? Why aren't Morrison and Waids Flash the PIS ones?'

Because of the Full Capacity rule. What is Flash's Full Capacity? See Morrison and Waid.

To use an analogy some people might understand, it's like the OP saying Hulk in threads has the ability to go WBH if needed.

Where the hell did we get WBH? Only Pak has written such a creature. But we don't ignore it - unless OP specifies no WBH. Then it's a whole new argument, to say CIP means Hulk is holding himself back with Gamma Maths (again, funnily, due to Pak) and therefore in character Hulk won't go WBH.

Flash doesn't have that issue. His poor showings aren't due to CIP, or CIS, but PIS. Which is inadmissible on forums.

Are what I have issue with. Plus I've seen Flash threads where this sort of implication is the norm. Where literally 2-3 of Flashes best feats are the basis for the character.

It's the last sentence I guess I was focussing on but I love writing.

If Hulk has a low showing, we can attribute it to PIS, or CIP. Gamma maths. He's constantly holding back.

Same with Superman. Mental blocks and all that.

Surfer has his whole pacifist thing going on. Sure there are scans showing he can be ruthless, but there are a lot of showings where he cries about it all.

Thor? He has the warrior mentality, and whilst he's no Einstein, neither is he stupid like a Rhino. So either it's PIS, or he doesn't have the abilities.

So that's three reasons for a low showing. CIP, PIS, or just sheer inability.

With Flash, we know he has the ability to dodge a punch. If the puncher is slower than him, then it can't be CIP....it's literally travelling slowly to his face. Holding back mentally means he's actually letting himself be punched, and not doing anything about it.

Hence my conclusion that it's PIS.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Warming up your nervous system or what have you only applies when you are reacting to things within your realm of speed.

You are hundreds of times faster than a slug. You require no warm up there to dodge a slug speed attack.

Yet a slug is closer to you in speed than even quicksilver is to Barry.

It's hard to wrap ones head around how Flash sees the world.

Comparisons between boxers aren't even in the same realm....unless one of the boxers sees that other boxer as having a relative punch take 10 years from his perspective, and doesn't move out of the way because he is not "warmed up".

Replace 10 years with 60 seconds [i.e he is just 60 times faster in perception than his opponent, lol], and the concept still applies. So he basically stays there for a full minute, staring at a punch.

But the Flash obviously doesn't live that way

But it's a forum fight where both combatants enter the arena ready to fight.

Originally posted by krisblaze
But the Flash obviously doesn't live that way

Unless we're arguing that Flash can't switch on his perception to see each individual pico/attosecond etc. [which is very well documented that he can] because he needs to warm up [lmao], then there is no case here other than PIS.

Originally posted by krisblaze
But the Flash obviously doesn't live that way

good post. fanfic flash and such

Yes but the argument is how can he tell when he needs to boost his perception?

Speed force.

It automatically helped him dodge a bullet even when he wasn't aware of it for example.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Yes but the argument is how can he tell when he needs to boost his perception?

Because he's entering a fight?

That's like saying how does GL know he needs to charge his ring?

How does Iron Man know he needs his suit with him?

We assume they enter the forum fight ready to do battle.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Yes but the argument is how can he tell when he needs to boost his perception?

At Flash's absolute best... it just happens automatically... for example when the bullet is starting to penetrate through the back of his skull. There are scans showing that, they were posted on KMC.

Of course, it gets contradicted often, like when he gets eaten by a talking gorilla.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Speed force.

It automatically helped him dodge a bullet even when he wasn't aware of it for example.

You ninja'd me, CC.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It's the last sentence I guess I was focussing on but I love writing.

If Hulk has a low showing, we can attribute it to PIS, or CIP. Gamma maths. He's constantly holding back.

Same with Superman. Mental blocks and all that.

Surfer has his whole pacifist thing going on. Sure there are scans showing he can be ruthless, but there are a lot of showings where he cries about it all.

Thor? He has the warrior mentality, and whilst he's no Einstein, neither is he stupid like a Rhino. So either it's PIS, or he doesn't have the abilities.

So that's three reasons for a low showing. CIP, PIS, or just sheer inability.

With Flash, we know he has the ability to dodge a punch. If the puncher is slower than him, then it can't be CIP....it's literally travelling slowly to his face. Holding back mentally means he's actually letting himself be punched, and not doing anything about it.

Hence my conclusion that it's PIS.

All of the powers should be held to the same degree of scrutiny. Speed shouldn't get an execption just because it has numbers attached to it. Which I realize without numbers it makes it harder to judge, but it's the absolute best number that's accounted for more often than not.

For example, all of Flash's feats are acceptable, and anything under that is argued against because of those feats. Yet lowly characters like Superman have to use their best feats to bring up their lowly averages. If he was held to the same degree as Flash, every other feat would be used to prove his best feat is the level he's operating at, and anything under that is acceptable if not frowned upon to not use. Yet, he (Superman) has to use his best feats to bring up his average. I'm sure you can see the difference here.

Superman is impossibly strong going by average.
Superman is infinitely strong going by the leeway Flash is given.

You could likely get away with posting one feat in a Flash thread at this stage in time and most people wouldn't even question that he wins based on that one feat. The discussion doesn't become a discussion because that one page is fact, and he will be operating at that level in the thread. That seems to be the consensus on Flash.

I just don't see why speed is held to a different degree in comics. I never said he wasn't fast, or comparable to real life boxers (I used that to show reactions can differ, not that ****ing Catwoman can tag him or whatever else people think I used it for. I also compared speed differing to walking and running, guess I also compared him to a human too). I'm saying that speed, like everything else in the world is subject to variation to answer your initial problem with it. The only thing that doesn't really, is durability. Yet nobody has an issue averaging out durability.

Anyway, I realize Flash is quick and I'd go so far as to even admit he's speedy, but my problem doesn't stem from his actual feats. It's that he's treated differently than every other character on the forum and people will make reasons as to why it's different. If you want to take Flash's best feats as the average for whatever reason, then you should be consistent enough to not try and change it when it comes to another power. If Flash is operating in attosecond levels, then I want that same person to have Superman being abstract levels in that same thread.

That is my point if you can understand it.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
At Flash's absolute best... it just happens automatically... for example when the bullet is starting to penetrate through the back of his skull. There are scans showing that, they were posted on KMC.

Of course, it gets contradicted often, like when he gets eaten by a talking gorilla.

Yeah, so in Grodds case..,..

Is Grodd that fast, PIS, or is Flash letting himself get eaten?

Flash has only one thing going for him.

Speed.

It would be stupid as hell for example to make a Thor vs Flash thread with the stipulation that that speed is equalized. What would be the point of that thread if you remove Flash's one advantage?

So of course you have to account for full capacity for Flash because otherwise you are ignoring the only thing he can do.

It just so happens that speed is damn near the most broken power there is.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Yes but the argument is how can he tell when he needs to boost his perception?

But to answer the 'activating superspeed' a bit more in detail..
The moment something superfast happens, his brain instantly detects it and switches his perceptions to superspeed. The same way Superman can walk around normally, but if a gun goes off to the other side of town, he can catch it. If he has to consciously switch onto superspeed while at normal speed, the bullet would have long gone killed the person.

i see alot of grodd lowballing here