Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
I firmly believe that if a monsoon or other terrifying situation comes your way that you will have not the slightest reluctance to call upon God and reach for His holy Word if it is available.Side note: I have never heard anyone call on Buddha, Confucious, Zorastor, Allah (the moon god), or any other deity besides God in a time of trouble and intense fear. It is always "oh my God etc."
Well get out there and mingle. Down the street from where I live is a corner shop run by an old Indian couple, and she is forever clasping her hands... though were we would say "Oh God" she says "Oh..." - the name of a Guru/Yogi I believe. I can't pronounce it, and I've never asked about it. Likewise a Muslim does have phrases relative to their religion that are no way Christian. And I notice you slipped in the "moon God" bit. Couldn't help yourself? I find it funny you are so determined not to give credence to valid theorems that Jesus has roots with Mithra and the like, yet you parrot Chick's historically inaccurate linking of a Moon God to Allah. Hypocrisy thy name is...
The reason you find so many people in your context saying "Oh God" is due to the western Christian effect - it is dominant in that nation, it is what English speakers tend to say regardless of religion. Atheists even say it - because "Sweet Jesus" "Oh God" "Bloody Hell" etc have connotations now separate from the religion - saying them is in no way reflective of religious belief or leanings.
And I can assure that the when caught in a hotel during a monsoon I didn't reach for a Bible. In fact in all the terrifying situations I have been in I have never felt the sudden fearful need to clutch the Bible like a shield.
Re: Satanists
Originally posted by SamIel
any out there?
Imagine the state of mind of the following people: an incestuous man who verbally and physically abuses his wife, children, parents, and those around him, a pedophile, a serial killer, a violent and sadistic rapist, an inhumane terrorist, a cannibal, the heart and mind of a KKK member, an inventor of new kinds of torture and pain, a cruel bully who injures your heart and soul with merciless brutality, the rage of a violent drunkard or drug addict. Recall the worst, most frightening, horror movie that you have ever seen, the most terrible dream that you have ever had as a child, the most uncomfortable, creepy, eerie, feeling that you have ever experienced. Think of something or someone that/who scares you to death. Bring to mind the most painful experiences coupled with fear that you can remember as a child, teenager, and adult. The pain that a child, teenager, or adult feels who is raped by his/her father, relative, or stranger. The pain and despair that a prostitute feels. The suicidal thoughts that come to someone who feels unloved. Imagine that Adolf Hitler, Timothy Mcveigh, the Columbine killers, Sadam Hussein, Osama Bin Laden and all of the previous examples that I gave at the outset of this paragraph including the various states of mind, feelings, and experiences, and individuals were embodied and personified in one person. This would still be a futile attempt at describing the one who hates people who do not believe in Jesus Christ as well as Christians. This is who is called, the great dragon, that serpent of old (recall the garden of Eden), the devil, satan, the adversary, enemy, tempter, prince of the power of the air, king or prince of Tyre, lucifer, anointed cherub who covers, day star, son of the morning, prince of darkness, and wicked one. He is real and he is a personal devil. He is the giver of all of the pain, experiences, feelings, and various states of mind that I have mentioned. He is behind it all. He walks about like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour. He transforms himself into an angel of light to deceive you. But he is without measure as it were in his wickedness, evil, sadism, and sin. He has no capacity for pity, compassion, or mercy. He is evil incarnate. He was/is a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. He blinds the minds of those who do not believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ, to keep you from receiving eternal life.
Love (i.e. Jesus Christ) wants to take you out of darkness and into His marvelous light. Will you accept? Jesus' heart desire is to give you everlasting love, life, joy, peace, comfort, happiness, glory, and sin-free consciousness. Will you receive His love? Simply ask Jesus Christ to save you from sin, satan, and from Hell. Repent: turn away from sin after admitting that you are a sinner. Jesus will wash away every sin and pour out His love upon you. The words that I speak to you are the true sayings of God Almighty. Read the Bible and see that the Lord is good. He is not holding anything against you. He has not condemned you. Jesus came to save souls not condemn them. Love--Jesus Christ--will wait for your decision. If you should choose satan, your decision will be honored by God. But choose Life, choose the Prince of Peace, choose Jesus Christ, the Son of God and you will receive eternal life. This good news is for everyone and anyone else who reads it.
Re: Re: Satanists
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Imagine the state of mind of the following people: an incestuous man who verbally and physically abuses his wife, children, parents, and those around him, a pedophile, a serial killer, a violent and sadistic rapist, an inhumane terrorist, a cannibal, the heart and mind of a KKK member, an inventor of new kinds of torture and pain, a cruel bully who injures your heart and soul with merciless brutality, the rage of a violent drunkard or drug addict. Recall the worst, most frightening, horror movie that you have ever seen, the most terrible dream that you have ever had as a child, the most uncomfortable, creepy, eerie, feeling that you have ever experienced. Think of something or someone that/who scares you to death. Bring to mind the most painful experiences coupled with fear that you can remember as a child, teenager, and adult. The pain that a child, teenager, or adult feels who is raped by his/her father, relative, or stranger. The pain and despair that a prostitute feels. The suicidal thoughts that come to someone who feels unloved. Imagine that Adolf Hitler, Timothy Mcveigh, the Columbine killers, Sadam Hussein, Osama Bin Laden and all of the previous examples that I gave at the outset of this paragraph including the various states of mind, feelings, and experiences, and individuals were embodied and personified in one person. This would still be a futile attempt at describing the one who hates people who do not believe in Jesus Christ as well as Christians. This is who is called, the great dragon, that serpent of old (recall the garden of Eden), the devil, satan, the adversary, enemy, tempter, prince of the power of the air, king or prince of Tyre, lucifer, anointed cherub who covers, day star, son of the morning, prince of darkness, and wicked one. He is real and he is a personal devil. He is the giver of all of the pain, experiences, feelings, and various states of mind that I have mentioned. He is behind it all. He walks about like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour. He transforms himself into an angel of light to deceive you. But he is without measure as it were in his wickedness, evil, sadism, and sin. He has no capacity for pity, compassion, or mercy. He is evil incarnate. He was/is a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. He blinds the minds of those who do not believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ, to keep you from receiving eternal life.Love (i.e. Jesus Christ) wants to take you out of darkness and into His marvelous light. Will you accept? Jesus' heart desire is to give you everlasting love, life, joy, peace, comfort, happiness, glory, and sin-free consciousness. Will you receive His love? Simply ask Jesus Christ to save you from sin, satan, and from Hell. Repent: turn away from sin after admitting that you are a sinner. Jesus will wash away every sin and pour out His love upon you. The words that I speak to you are the true sayings of God Almighty. Read the Bible and see that the Lord is good. He is not holding anything against you. He has not condemned you. Jesus came to save souls not condemn them. Love--Jesus Christ--will wait for your decision. If you should choose satan, your decision will be honored by God. But choose Life, choose the Prince of Peace, choose Jesus Christ, the Son of God and you will receive eternal life. This good news is for everyone and anyone else who reads it.
Shut the f*ck up.
God created Hell...God created Satan....the deepest root of all evil is God himself.
Re: Re: Satanists
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
This is who is called, the great dragon, that serpent of old (recall the garden of Eden), the devil, satan, the adversary, enemy, tempter, prince of the power of the air, king or prince of Tyre, lucifer, anointed cherub who covers, day star, son of the morning, prince of darkness, and wicked one. He is real and he is a personal devil. He is the giver of all of the pain, experiences, feelings, and various states of mind that I have mentioned. He is behind it all. He walks about like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour. He transforms himself into an angel of light to deceive you. But he is without measure as it were in his wickedness, evil, sadism, and sin. He has no capacity for pity, compassion, or mercy. He is evil incarnate. He was/is a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. He blinds the minds of those who do not believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ, to keep you from receiving eternal life.
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Well I don't appreciate god's ruse... He didn't have to employ this satan guy to trick me. I'll give it to him though, he's good...the tally of hell must be through the roof.
The Truth of Satanism
I'd like to state some points, all about the modern form of Satanism (not the Theistic Satanism):
- There is no God, no Heaven, no Hell, even Satan's existance is highly doubted
- They worship nothing; Satan is used as a metaphor for Satanic beliefs, which are very open and free.
- They do not disallow much, e.g: homosexuality
Look it up:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaVeyan_Satanism
and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Satanic_Bible
That is the modern representation of Satanism, discuss?
Interesting. Thanks.
As I read the wiki article, I started to think about Ayn Rand novels....then her name popped up.
They went on to compare it somewhat with ethical egoism, which isn't an entirely harmful philosophy. Satanism, it seems, goes a few steps further toward the absence of morals (it's essentially individualistic and ego-centric), but still not too far beyond what most would consider functionally moral in today's society.
Personally, the biggest problem I can see for myself is that I believe that there isn't a "me" in the traditional sense...that I can't be ascribed to any of my physical parts, thoughts, actions, or even moments of consciousness. A philosophy/religion centered around serving the self would certainly necessitate a belief in one's existence.
Though even that might be countered, because Satanism is basically an atheistic philosophy concerning gods, and there's no mention of a soul, afterlife, or anything else associated with a "self" other than the word 'self'. Beyond that, it's mainly just the fundamental doctrine of serving the self.
...
Anyway, I'm rambling.
It was an interesting read. If my family wouldn't have a heart attack if they saw the book, I might actually purchase it simply out of intellectual curiosity....I've already freaked them out enough with my reading and philosophies.
I've been reading a bunch of Nietzsche recently, so this is all kinda pertinent to where my mind is at right now. I've been trying to reconcile two ideas together: One, that we should create our own meaning in life (since it is otherwise inherently meaningless until we ascribe personal meaning to it), and be freed from societal influences so that we are true to ourselves and are able to define good/evil, moral/immoral, etc. for ourselves....not as universal truths but as personal truths. And Two: the doctrine of "no-self" which is common among Eastern philosophies such as Buddhism and Taoism, which I ascribe to in theory.
It's hard to fault the concept of wanting to be true to oneself (to say nothing of some of Nietzsche's other ideas, which run the gamut from brilliant to maddeningly harmful), especially when social influences can be all too evident in our lives.
On the one hand, escaping social influence to be a singular individual who is true to their nature isn't so different than, say, the Buddha citing social duty as one of the chief hindrances to humans when trying to acheive enlightenment. But can so much emphasis be placed on the self in a system that denies the existence of it?
The possible reconciliation comes with this: if All, in an enlightened sense, is One (whether it is called Tao or just in the unity of existence) then indeed, life and all of our experiences are only what we perceive and interpret. We are creating meaning, not being given meaning by a higher force (God, in some religions) or by society....we create it, just as Nietzsche's Ubermensch or even the Satanistic follower. And would not the idea that "self" is false be able to be assimilated into even individualistic philosophies? If it is truly about what we believe and the meaning we create, to limit what we can believe (such as forbidding a belief in "no-self"😉 would be antithetical to the principle.
My Truth, then, would be "Unity" as a principle. Whether you want to see it as a seamless stream of energy throughout the universe that we are connected to, or simply call it an esoteric name like Tao. Is this belief "selfish" in a Satanist sense? Probably. Because it's my belief, and I'm acting according to that which I believe serves me best, which in turn means serving the concept of "Unity".
I don't know if I can make any claims to altruism in life, even as I profess to serve something outside my immediate being. But I don't think it matters, since "altruism" or "selfishness" are, in and of themselves, not good or bad traits. Again, we can only create their meaning...they don't come preordained with meaning attached to them.
...
Again, I'm rambling. This set off a lot of different thoughts in me, and I'm mostly just trying to work through them by writing them out. Hopefully I make some kind of sense though.
Originally posted by The Grey Fox
I'd like to state some points, all about the modern form of Satanism (not the Theistic Satanism):- There is no God, no Heaven, no Hell, even Satan's existance is highly doubted
- They worship nothing; Satan is used as a metaphor for Satanic beliefs, which are very open and free.
- They do not disallow much, e.g: homosexuality
Look it up:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaVeyan_Satanismand
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Satanic_Bible
That is the modern representation of Satanism, discuss?
Yeah I was talking about that in an atheist thread. To be quite honest its not without merit but its just seems it was created soley to oppose religion. Crap if you ask me.
Originally posted by DigiMark007But can so much emphasis be placed on the self in a system that denies the existence of it?
Well what I can add to this is that I think when the Buddhists talk aboiut nothing and no-self its misunderstood. To be fair the words "nothing" and "no-self" are translations from a foreign language and may not be an accurate description.
I think when they say there is no-self they mean that there is a highier self but it is incomprehensible to what you think you are. Buddhists also use the word no-mind. No-mind does not mean no mind, it means a different sort of mind.
Also bare in mind that the Taoists and Buddhists use form and structure to achieve nothingness. Maybe im rambling as well but it seems to me that followers of Buddhism and Taosim misundertsand the concept of "nothing", they find it hard to comprehend or understand because they dont really understand what Buddhists mean by "nothing".
Just adding my 2cents, hope it helps.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well what I can add to this is that I think when the Buddhists talk aboiut nothing and no-self its misunderstood. To be fair the words "nothing" and "no-self" are translations from a foreign language and may not be an accurate description.I think when they say there is no-self they mean that there is a highier self but it is incomprehensible to what you think you are. Buddhists also use the word no-mind. No-mind does not mean no mind, it means a different sort of mind.
Also bare in mind that the Taoists and Buddhists use form and structure to achieve nothingness. Maybe im rambling as well but it seems to me that followers of Buddhism and Taosim misundertsand the concept of "nothing", they find it hard to comprehend or understand because they dont really understand what Buddhists mean by "nothing".
Just adding my 2cents, hope it helps.
Possibly some do, but I'm not just talking vaguely about aspects of the religions that I haven't fully researched and personally considered. The Buddha was very strong with his words that there is no soul or 'self', that we are formed of various aggregates, sensory perceptions, etc. that form an illusory sense of self. Taoism doesn't really touch the subject as thoroughly, to be fair. I think that it's probably misunderstood by some, but to simply cite "translation differences" and then reinterpret it how you wish would be a disservice to the origins of the ideas.
Beyond that, I'm not just talking about what the religions say down to the letter. It's an aspect of my personal belief. One of the harder things for me has been trying to reconcile that idea with a faint belief in reincarnation, since there's a healthy amount of empirical evidence to suggest it's a possibility. I call it 'faint' because it's far from a concrete belief, more a personal interest that I feel is at least somewhat justified. But if there's no self/soul/whatever, what reincarnates? How do Buddhists accept both of these as truths?
In any case, I'm getting away from Satanism, but I covered most of my thoughts concerning its possible advantages in my last post. I'd shy away from calling anything "selfish" in my worldview, but neither altruistic. If all is one, and I'm serving both the "self" and the "All" simultaneously, i is either both of those or neither of them....and only becomes important if we make a distinction of meaning within ourselves.
As Digimark has stated: The Concept of No Self, means "no soul".
We, our "selves" consist of the Five Aggregates: Matter, Perception, Sensation, Mental Formations, and Conciousness.
So yes we do exist, and we are individual, but we are not separate from the rest of this world, we are not above or below anything or anyone else, and to think so leads to evil and disunity.
Buddhism teaches that everything is interdependent, and the idea of a soul implies that we have a form of existance which does not rely on the environment, others, or any other aspect of the universe.
The "self" is created. We give ourselves an identity, our parents and/or society give us a name, and we create our own character and persona through our social growth.
However, everything from nature to nurture, from self discovery to environment and society made us who and what we are now. Our self is ever changing, and evolving, and therefore not static, not "eternal".
The self is temporary, as it will only exist in this life. Buddhism teaches that the cycle of birth and rebirth is enacted through an exchange of the aggregates as we die. When we die our bodies decompose, eventually returning to basic matter, which in turn, builds the rest of this world, and other life forms.
That is why you do not have any memory of past lives, because those selves you were, had died. You as a person are composed of the same matter that went into the creation of a thousand other people before you, and the matter and energy you consist of will in turn create a thousand more ahead of you.
What this means is that essentially we are all one, even though we may not beleive it. What this also means is that when we are reborn, we may very well have a new family, a new life, a new conciousness, and a whole new journey, and may or may not ever see our previous loved ones, or we might but in different and less recognizable forms.
This is a rather hard scenario to deal with, because no one wants to beleive that once we die, we are not reunited with the people we treasure. But what it forces us to do is value other people as we value our loved ones.
If we were to view other people as we view our families or loved ones, we would treat them better.
And if we were to realize the temporarity of life, instead of imagining that we will exist in this one form for all eternity, we would see our own life and others as infinitely precious, and value it much more.