Originally posted by Validus
So what was Thor before the Ragnarok saga? Street level?
Posted something similar in the Superman thread some time back.
Superman gets a powerboost and suddenly people are crawling out of the woodwork saying 'unfair.'
Next day they are saying how the Silver Surfer can at '100X the speed of light' and 'transmute elements' without breaking a sweat.
Well, lets put it this way. Superman beats everyone. Why? Because he's Superman. In these forums, there are people he loses to. In comics, he doesn't lose. Why? Because he has to be the strongest, fastest, most powerful character out there, when in reality there are characters that would wipe the floor with him, like Surfer and more than likely Thor. However, DC comics will never allow him to be beatable, thus the power upgrades. They're so anal about making him the best that he never gets humbled, ever. Take JLA/Avengers, where he beat Thor. Thor has taken more damage than Superman could dish out, yet he gets KO'ed with ease? Bullshit. In reality, Thor would ram Mjolnir down his throat and godblast him like he did Mangog. He's gonna always be Superdick in the eyes of a lot of comics fans.
I want at least one person to admit that if Superman were to lose to a Marvel character, fans would go ape shit.
Originally posted by Thunderstrike
Well, lets put it this way. Superman beats everyone. Why? Because he's Superman. In these forums, there are people he loses to. In comics, he doesn't lose. Why? Because he has to be the strongest, fastest, most powerful character out there, when in reality there are characters that would wipe the floor with him, like Surfer and more than likely Thor. However, DC comics will never allow him to be beatable, thus the power upgrades. They're so anal about making him the best that he never gets humbled, ever. Take JLA/Avengers, where he beat Thor. Thor has taken more damage than Superman could dish out, yet he gets KO'ed with ease? Bullshit. In reality, Thor would ram Mjolnir down his throat and godblast him like he did Mangog. He's gonna always be Superdick in the eyes of a lot of comics fans.I want at least one person to admit that if Superman were to lose to a Marvel character, fans would go ape shit.
Unless it was someone of equal footing to supes in both popularity and power. This is more then likely the reason behind all the 'Hulk can beat superman' threads.
So your reason for disliking Superman comes down to beating your favorite character in a crossover? Is that what you're trying to say?
Complaining that he wins a lot is a bit weak. He wouldn't be much of a super-hero if he went around getting his ass kicked all over the place now would he? I just find it odd that you like Hyperion, who you claim does everything with ease, but dislike Superman for somewhat the same reason.
Originally posted by Validus
So your reason for disliking Superman comes down to beating your favorite character in a crossover? Is that what you're trying to say?
Originally posted by Validus
Complaining that he wins a lot is a bit weak. He wouldn't be much of a super-hero if he went around getting his ass kicked all over the place now would he? I just find it odd that you like Hyperion, who you claim does everything with ease, but dislike Superman for somewhat the same reason. [/B]
Hyperion is a different case. His character in Supreme Power fascinates me because of the fact that he is a hero to the bone, but is rejected by the world around him, and has always felt alone. The thing with Hyperion is that he can't find solace. It's not the power level that draws me to the character. It's the same way with Thor. I love the fact that he's a God that identifies with Humans more than he does fellow gods. Beta Ray Bill is another fave of mine because he's a great warrior with a heart for people. However, I think that DC writers write Superman like he's Jesus, which I find just flat out dumb. I've got good reason not to like Superman, just like I have good reason not to like Wonder Woman as well.
If you remember what Captain America said about DC, that rang true with Infinite Crisis. It's kinda foreboding, if you think about it.
Originally posted by Thunderstrike
No. My dislike for Superman comes from the fact he never loses to people he should get killed by because of the simple fact that he's Superman. Superman fans are rabid wolves when you tell them that their favorite hero can be beat.Hyperion is a different case. His character in Supreme Power fascinates me because of the fact that he is a hero to the bone, but is rejected by the world around him, and has always felt alone. The thing with Hyperion is that he can't find solace. It's not the power level that draws me to the character. It's the same way with Thor. I love the fact that he's a God that identifies with Humans more than he does fellow gods. Beta Ray Bill is another fave of mine because he's a great warrior with a heart for people. However, I think that DC writers write Superman like he's Jesus, which I find just flat out dumb. I've got good reason not to like Superman, just like I have good reason not to like Wonder Woman as well.
If you remember what Captain America said about DC, that rang true with Infinite Crisis. It's kinda foreboding, if you think about it.
Similar reason why I dislike X-Men , they put too much hype into something and then twist it out of shape. I was never much interested in the X-men disliking most of them due to their powers . Also the unrealism of their plight was ****ing annoying .
Oh hi were mutants , we have superpowers from natural genetics and were a minority . Except that we take up 65 percent of the planet.
You can't be a goddamn minority if you take up that much of a planet. The avengers never interested me either , although thats more likely due to their semi-boring line-up.
Originally posted by Thunderstrike
I just don't like his character. I like Kal-L though. He's a family man.
Kal-L's great , you take a character who's used to the up-beat 30's and 50's (of comics) and then place him next to current characters and you have such a wonderful problem . It's brilliantly funny and yet twisted at the same time to see him talking to earth 1 batman and telling him that his world was 'The good world' .
Originally posted by Thunderstrike
I want at least one person to admit that if Superman were to lose to a Marvel character, fans would go ape shit.
Let me speak for myself ......there are a good number of Marvel characters that could defeat Superman.
No doubt about that.
The only problem is that on forums people pit Superman against Marvel characters that oscillate between several notches to many leagues beneath him, and then feel bad when people say Superman beats them.
I have absolutely no problem with Superman losing to a Marvel character ......for example Superman has no business messing with Rune King Thor (note: I am talking about 'normal' Superman not All-Star/PC), or with the Beyonder, etc.
However if I say Superman would beat Colossus like he was a chump, that Superman would beat Rogue like she was a joke, that Superman is too omni-dimensional for the Hulk (who is amazingly uni-dimensional), that Superman is faster than Quicksilver, that Superman would take out Prof. X before he could even get a chance to use telepathy, that .......so on and so forth.
Some people who like Marvel are not exactly happy with that, and normally in response you will see spite threads come up or talk about how Superman should be depowered (while talking about how their favorite character in Marvel is SO powerful without blinking an eye).
Anyways, the long and short of it is that there are a good number of characters in Marvel that will defeat 'normal' Superman, and a number that would even school the more powerful versions of Superman.
Thus I have no problem at all with Kal-El (or any Kryptonian/Daxamite/whatever losing).
Just don't expect me to say Superman will lose to 90% of the characters he is pitted against on KMC, characters who are either one-trick ponies (like most characters in Marvel are, eg Cyclops ....and there was a thread on Cy's optic blast vs Supes heat v., or the various Colossus/Thing vs Supes bouts) or have power sets that while powerful would not have sufficient time to effectively affect Superman (for example Professor X is an amazing telepath, but he wouldn't have time to do anything before he got reduced to goop. And for that matter Manchester Black used a very powerful telepathic attack on Superman, apparently killing him, and a few moments later Supes was dismantling his entire team).
Thus, Superman can lose to a host of Marvel characters. However that number is not that great (but it is not small either), and most of those characters are usually obscure (which brings a problem since most pro-Marvel people on KMC love to pit Supes against their fave idols ....thus the Superman vs Venom, Superman vs Spiderman, S vs Hulk, S vs Colossus, S vs Xavier etc etc etc).
However if I say Superman would beat Colossus like he was a chump, that Superman would beat Rogue like she was a joke, that Superman is too omni-dimensional for the Hulk (who is amazingly uni-dimensional), that Superman is faster than Quicksilver, that Superman would take out Prof. X before he could even get a chance to use telepathy, that .......so on and so forth.
I can imagine All-Star Superman hitting RKT with all of his planet-pulverizing strength and RKT barely noticing. There's no way All-Star Superman is at an Odin-level of power.
Odin's main enemy was 1,000+ ft tall Surtur who destroyed a star just to extract the metal he used to forge his sword. And Surtur seemed like a chump compared to RKT.
All-Star Superman was overloaded by a bit of solar radiation. I'm not sure how this compares in the slightest to sun-destroying forces.
Originally posted by JohnR
I can imagine All-Star Superman hitting RKT with all of his planet-pulverizing strength and RKT barely noticing. There's no way All-Star Superman is at an Odin-level of power.Odin's main enemy was 1,000+ ft tall Surtur who destroyed a star just to extract the metal he used to forge his sword. And Surtur seemed like a chump compared to RKT.
All-Star Superman was overloaded by a bit of solar radiation. I'm not sure how this compares in the slightest to sun-destroying forces.
✅ 🐰 ✅
This is out of context, but oh well
I agree with Thunderstrike on this subject
The reason I cant stand about Superman is he's the only character besides Wolverine who's power is the power not to lose. I'm swear if Dc had the god of the universe step down Superman could still beat him. DC would just have the sun grow bigger or have a trillion more suns appear. I mean it's stupid how he just wins every fight no matter what, I think he's worse than Wolverine.
My fav character is Juggernaut, so I'm going to take Juggernaut and use him as an example.
If Juggernaut was Dc's Superman he would never lose. Even without his helmet he would always win, they would just create a plot device that had him somehow become immune to telepathic attacks. Then when he did finally lose a fight, they would give him a power up that gave him the power of a trillion suns. It's just impossible to defeat superman, I mean its crazy.
How much can Superman lift now?