Originally posted by NewGuy01
Together this should be a hard-fought victory for the team. Not that Yoda couldn't beat Hord on his own, but then again Anakin can beat Ventress on his own--Yet she still gives the Ani/Obi duo trouble when they duel.
😕 Yoda or Windu alone can defeat "Tulak Hord". There is nothing suggesting that he's on their level.
Originally posted by Nephthys
[B]Other than pulling a 300 meter long battleship from the sky,
Has this ever confirmed or witnessed?
And pulling a battleship from the sky is a pretty questionable feat when you think about it. If it was "stationary", he wouldn't even have had to do much of anything to pull it down. If it was in orbit, he'd only need to nudge it slightly to pull it down to the surface, and we have no idea how long it took him, do we now?
It seems more like a "redirect falling ship" Galen Marek style feat. Certainly impressive, but not to the point where he'd lift all of the muntuur stones. 😆
defeating entire armies
OK...where? When?
and having legendary lightsaber skills.
So did Kit Fisto, Saesee Tiin and Agen Kolar.
Really, there's not much to quantify Tulak Hord with, except that he was considered very powerful for his age, and that he's weaker than Palpatine. Even many basic details of his life are apocryphal, with there being controversy over when he lived and whether or not modern lightsabers even existed in his time.
Of course, I got most of this knowledge from wookieepedia, so feel free to correct me.
Originally posted by Master Han
Has this ever confirmed or witnessed?And pulling a battleship from the sky is a pretty questionable feat when you think about it. If it was "stationary", he wouldn't even have had to do much of anything to pull it down. If it was in orbit, he'd only need to nudge it slightly to pull it down to the surface, and we have no idea how long it took him, do we now?
It seems more like a "redirect falling ship" Galen Marek style feat. Certainly impressive, but not to the point where he'd lift all of the muntuur stones. 😆
Khem Val, Tulak Hords loyal Dashade servant claims 'The great Tulak Hord once pulled a ship this size from the sky' upon seeing the wrecked Endar Spire. That he never left his masters side indicates he witnessed it, and that he says he pulled it from the sky indicates he didn't just redirect it.
Originally posted by Master Han
OK...where? When?
Again, Khem Val talks about it. His Yn and Chabosh campaigns apparantly.
2.10
Originally posted by Master Han
So did Kit Fisto, Saesee Tiin and Agen Kolar.Really, there's not much to quantify Tulak Hord with, except that he was considered very powerful for his age, and that he's weaker than Palpatine. Even many basic details of his life are apocryphal, with there being controversy over when he lived and whether or not modern lightsabers even existed in his time.
Of course, I got most of this knowledge from wookieepedia, so feel free to correct me.
And they are good lightsaber duelists. According to Kreia though, Hord was the greatest lightsaber master of the Sith Empire.
Considering Tulak Hord devised many lightsaber techniques and teachings (which Darth Thanaton later found) and that Darth Marr recovered his lightsaber, I'm guessing he used a proper lightsaber.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Khem Val, Tulak Hords loyal Dashade servant claims 'The great Tulak Hord once pulled a ship this size from the sky' upon seeing the wrecked Endar Spire. That he never left his masters side indicates he witnessed it, and that he says he pulled it from the sky indicates he didn't just redirect it.
OK, that's fair enough, and I suppose we can assume that Val is being factual here.
But, again, we still can't understand the feat's circumstances. It could range from being nothing more than a trick (ie., the ship is already in free fall), to making him orders of magnitude more powerful than anyone we've seen in the canon.
Again, Khem Val talks about it. His Yn and Chabosh campaigns apparantly.
But surely you understand how difficult it is to quantify destroying "entire armies" is...
And they are good lightsaber duelists. According to Kreia though, Hord was the greatest lightsaber master of the Sith Empire.
So he's probably pretty badass with a blade. He's no joke, but neither are Yoda and Windu, the first and second greatest lightsaber duelists in the Order's golden age of lightsaber dueling, and possibly of the Order's entire history.
So, given that the first Sith Empire existed in the infancy of lightsaber dueling, whereas Yoda and Mace dominated in its prime...
Considering Tulak Hord devised many lightsaber techniques and teachings (which Darth Thanaton later found) and that Darth Marr recovered his lightsaber, I'm guessing he used a proper lightsaber.
That's a reasonable, although not absolute, conclusion. That being said, Windu himself developed one of the deadliest forms ever conceived of, vaapad, so when it comes to technical skills, it's difficult to put Hord above either of the two.
I could always resort to ABC logic and say Yoda = Palpatine > Hord.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Theres no known tech that could do that and I don't see why Khem would exaggerate. He's standing right in front of the Endar Spire when he says it, he has a good basis for comparison. The simplest explanation is that he did it with the Force. As Han said, its safe to assume he's being accurate.
Well, you did say Khem was a Hord loyalist, yes? It makes sense that he would go to lengths to deify his ancient Master. And couldn't ion canons destabilize ships, in effect pulling them to the surface? Or gravity-well generators, or planetary tractor-beams? Or perhaps he worked in collusion with other Force users?
While he's allowed his opinion, I'm afraid Han's solo on this one.
Why are you so against believing this? Anyway, Khem is bound (by the force) in his loyalty to his current master (you), so its highly unlikely he even can lie or exaggerate things to you. I've never seen it happen.
Or maybe he used magical pixie tears. I'm fairly certain the Sith Empire didn't possess those technologies. As it is, the simplest explanation is that he did it with the Force. Occums Razor.
Don't you think that since the developers had him say it without anything contradicting it, they probably meant it to be true?
Originally posted by Nephthys
I don't think he could actually beat them (either of them), I'm merely pointing out that there is evidence that he's near or on their level. Whether its compelling is your own agenda.Also I edited Khem's story about Yn and Chabosh into my post.
Unless if I'm missing something from the tiny subtitles, Tulak Hord breaks a Jedi siege and then goes on a Jedi killing spree. At no point does he bust armies singlehandedly...we don't know how many he fought, how he did it, etc.
Similarly, his pull-a-ship-out-of-the-sky feat is so vague as to mean potentially any range of power. You could conclude that he was just slightly nudging it out of orbit or directing a ship already in free fall, putting the feat below Marek's, or you could conclude that he overpowered the ship's thrusters and repulsorlifts, and that he is therefore the most powerful Force user in the mythos.
A siege is something an army does. To be sieging an entire stronghold would naturally require one. He defeated the siege and by the sounds of it killed them all going by 'left nothing but jedi blood behind him'.
The term used is 'pulled out of the sky'. Slightly nudging it isn't pulling and if it was already falling he wouldn't be pulling it out of the sky. Also, that wouldn't make him the most powerful Force User in the mythos. Darth Nihilus would still be stronger.