well if we go on only by comic rules then lucifer cant be that powerful, but if we talk outside comic then luficer is that cunning...only he knows why he needs to be that way maybe he figured the best way to defeat god is to turn his own creation against him...again thats only outside comic i realise im driftin into religion now
Actually you may be right. Lucifer cannot do jack sht to Yahweh directly. Perhaps hurting Yahweh's creation is the only way to hurt Yahweh, yet Yahweh seemed more than willing to destroy his own creation himself, because he saw it as flawed. Refer to the entire recreating universe posts i made in other threads.
If Lucifer is truly that powerful, than the point to doing the entire manipulation must be to entertain himself, because with that power he can force anyone under yahweh and micheal to do whatever he wants them 2 .
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
[B]well if we go on only by comic rules then lucifer cant be that powerful, but if we talk outside comic then luficer is that cunning...only he knows why he needs to be that way maybe he figured the best way to defeat god is to turn his own creation against him...again thats only outside comic i realise im driftin into religion nowActually you may be right. Lucifer cannot do jack sht to Yahweh directly. Perhaps hurting Yahweh's creation is the only way to hurt Yahweh, yet Yahweh seemed more than willing to destroy his own creation himself, because he saw it as flawed. Refer to the entire recreating universe posts i made in other threads.
If Lucifer is truly that powerful, than the point to doing the entire manipulation must be to entertain himself, because with that power he can force anyone under yahweh and micheal to do whatever he wants them 2 . [/B]
There is No way that Lucifer will ever be able to hurt Yahweh/The Presence. The Presence creation is not flawed at all. Everything is a part of "The Great Plan". Lucifer is doing everything God wants him to do whether Lucifer realises it or not. Lucifer has pretty good fights on his wins. He went to the Goddess Izamami realm powerless and wanted to make everyone realise u don't mess with him, and he won ez. Beating Fenris who has been planning since Lucifer's fall is big. The Spectre still has 1 thing that Lucifer never has done, thats face TGEB who is Gods only equal. Spectre has fought Michael who is Lucifer's equal and lost, so I would say Lucifer wins.
Originally posted by kevdude
There is No way that Lucifer will ever be able to hurt Yahweh/The Presence. The Presence creation is not flawed at all. Everything is a part of "The Great Plan". Lucifer is doing everything God wants him to do whether Lucifer realises it or not. Lucifer has pretty good fights on his wins. He went to the Goddess Izamami realm powerless and wanted to make everyone realise u don't mess with him, and he won ez. Beating Fenris who has been planning since Lucifer's fall is big. The Spectre still has 1 thing that Lucifer never has done, thats face TGEB who is Gods only equal. Spectre has fought Michael who is Lucifer's equal and lost, so I would say Lucifer wins.
Lucifer slew Micheal once.
Originally posted by kevdudeMicheal defeated Spectre under Gods decree. I don't see it a viable win. In other times, Micheal has had to come to Spectre for help or guidance.
There is No way that Lucifer will ever be able to hurt Yahweh/The Presence. The Presence creation is not flawed at all. Everything is a part of "The Great Plan". Lucifer is doing everything God wants him to do whether Lucifer realises it or not. Lucifer has pretty good fights on his wins. He went to the Goddess Izamami realm powerless and wanted to make everyone realise u don't mess with him, and he won ez. Beating Fenris who has been planning since Lucifer's fall is big. The Spectre still has 1 thing that Lucifer never has done, thats face TGEB who is Gods only equal. Spectre has fought Michael who is Lucifer's equal and lost, so I would say Lucifer wins.
Originally posted by batdude123
Originally posted by kevdude
There is No way that Lucifer will ever be able to hurt Yahweh/The Presence. The Presence creation is not flawed at all. Everything is a part of "The Great Plan". Lucifer is doing everything God wants him to do whether Lucifer realises it or not. Lucifer has pretty good fights on his wins. He went to the Goddess Izamami realm powerless and wanted to make everyone realise u don't mess with him, and he won ez. Beating Fenris who has been planning since Lucifer's fall is big. The Spectre still has 1 thing that Lucifer never has done, thats face TGEB who is Gods only equal. Spectre has fought Michael who is Lucifer's equal and lost, so I would say Lucifer wins.
Good points you made bro.
Yahweh is flawed in my opinion though. He admitted to being dissatisfied with the current existance and decided he wanted to erase it and recreate it. A female character told him that hes sick, because that would mean killing trillions of innocent beings. He said no it doesnt mean that, because any NEW decision he makes automatically goes back to the beginning of time. Therefore when he erases an existance, it will be like it NEVER existed...
His "Great Plan" must have been DONE many times over, and if that's the case then in essense there's a total flaw.
Also his "Great Plan" totally goes against free will, suggesting that Vertigo's Uni/multiverse is like a story he writes, or a soap opera that Yahweh is doing for his own purposes and lacking in care for anything and anyone else. ok...that may be off topic...
but the point is Yahweh is a flawed being.
The Presence is not flawed, because the Presence is said not to be a character. It simply IS...it's not a decisive force like Yahweh is, it's just POWER.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Good points you made bro.Yahweh is flawed in my opinion though. He admitted to being dissatisfied with the current existance and decided he wanted to erase it and recreate it. A female character told him that hes sick, because that would mean killing trillions of innocent beings. He said no it doesnt mean that, because any NEW decision he makes automatically goes back to the beginning of time. Therefore when he erases an existance, it will be like it NEVER existed...
His "Great Plan" must have been DONE many times over, and if that's the case then in essense there's a total flaw.
Also his "Great Plan" totally goes against free will, suggesting that Vertigo's Uni/multiverse is like a story he writes, or a soap opera that Yahweh is doing for his own purposes and lacking in care for anything and anyone else. ok...that may be off topic...
but the point is Yahweh is a flawed being.
The Presence is not flawed, because the Presence is said not to be a character. It simply IS...it's not a decisive force like Yahweh is, it's just POWER.
The Presence/Yahweh (same) are not flawed at all. God already told both Michael and Lucifer a big secret. Telling them everything has been thought out thousands and thousands of times in his head way before everything was created, and everything happened the way he wanted it to happen. Even now when in the Lucifer comic Lucifer KNOWS now that God leaving is a part of "The Great Plan", and if there is no plan like rit now then it as well is a part of "The Great Plan". The only thing he left out which God even said is almost impossible is not knowing who will defend Creation and who will be the person against it being allowed to live (with God being the judge), he wanted a tiny piece of randomness in his plan. Also everything in Creation is God anyway, its a part of a dream he dreamt up so that he would sorta not be alone. 😎