Darth Nihilus versus Mace, Yoda, Dooku and Sidious

Started by Aede Madavan14 pages

Doesn't Quey'Tek solely conceal Force Sensitivity, and not the user's Force presence itself, anyway?

I was under the impression that it hid one's connection to the Force. I may be mistaken, however.

Zampanó
I was under the impression that it hid one's connection to the Force. I may be mistaken, however.

You're correct, in a sense. It doesn't, presumably, erase its user from a Jedi's senses entirely (otherwise the Jedi would find it awfully suspicious that Palpatine wasn't showing up on their radar at all), but it eliminates one's Force signature to such a degree that powerful Force users appear to be "normal."

Gideon
You're correct, in a sense. It doesn't, presumably, erase its user from a Jedi's senses entirely (otherwise the Jedi would find it awfully suspicious that Palpatine wasn't showing up on their radar at all), but it eliminates one's Force signature to such a degree that powerful Force users appear to be "normal."

The only instance I know of that was confirmed usage of Quey'Tek was Count Dooku's attempt at evading Anakin and Obi-Wan in Labyrinth of Evil, and his efforts were intended to mask his presence in its entirety; merely hiding his Force-sensitivity wouldn't do him much good when every other presence in the vicinity was a battle droid. Wookiepedia says otherwise, but it is in direct conflict with the text.

Palpatine's technique was likely more similar to the power Zannah invoked during her infiltration of the Jedi Temple, although I don't recall if that had been named or not.

But if his intenion was to simply make it impossible for Anakin and Obi-Wan to distinguish him from the battle droids then concealing his connection to the Force may have been all that was required; as the Force exists within all matter inside the SW Universe the droids would still have a presence in the Force, and unless we can be sure that Anakin or Obi-Wan possessed the ability to differentiate between living beings and inanimate matter, or any other factor that would differentiate Dooku from the battle droids beyond his Force connection, or that Dooku was of such a belief, then we cannot be sure that Quey'Tek performs any function beyond the concealment of a Force User's connection to the Force (which I'm pretty sure has been confirmed to be the case).

unless we can be sure that Anakin or Obi-Wan possessed the ability to differentiate between living beings and inanimate matter

Based on KotORII (cutscene on Peragus) they do.

Actually, wasn't there a childrens comic in which Anakin could feel droids through the Force but Obi-wan couldn't. I remember reading it in the store while heavily curling my lip.

Dooku was isolated; a lone presence distanced from regimented hordes in an otherwise abandoned, unstable and dangerously radioactive structure would effectively be a dead giveaway. Again, this is the only instance I'm aware of in which an active attempt at camouflage is actually addressed by name as Quey'Tek. If there is not another, and no Sourcebook or Essential Guide indicates otherwise, the nature of the technique has decidedly never been "confirmed" in the manner suggested.

And I would think it intuitive that the signatures of life forms in the Force, particularly sapients whirling in emotion and thought, would be fundamentally different from those of inanimate objects or artificial constructs. That the Force is all-pervasive does not require that such disparate things are perceived in a remotely similar manner, let alone a nearly identical one.

Originally posted by ares834
Nah. According to the campaign guide his body disintegrated and he displaced his persona into his Robes/mask. Yes, his effort to consume the Exile did weaken him but it did not kill him. The Exile, Visas, and Canderous did. As such it seems likley that damaging his robes/mask would hurt and eventually kill him.

As for his "insta-kill" attack. The Dark Reaper used a very similar attack, allowing it to suck out the force killing the target just like Nihilus. Intrestingly there was a defense against this. It is likely that this would in fact protect them from Nihilus's attack.

Actually, you are thinking of the Harvester. It's battery.

Originally posted by Eminence
Again, this is the only instance I'm aware of in which an active attempt at camouflage is actually addressed by name as Quey'Tek. If there is not another, and no Sourcebook or Essential Guide indicates otherwise, the nature of the technique has decidedly never been "confirmed" in the manner suggested.

The term and technique originate in the book Cestus Deception. Asajj Ventress uses it.

I didn't remember it being mentioned by name, but you're correct.

But even that doesn't confirm the nature of the technique.

So in other words, Nihilus may actually win? If theres no defence against it and Quey'Tek doesn't erase the presense completely, N. may be snacking heartily.

hmmm, this doesn't make him Deus Ex Machina either though, since Luke and the LOTF jedi can remove themselves from the force entirely.

Caedus was the first to learn that technique, presumably from Lumiya, who was trained by sidious.

Originally posted by truejedi
hmmm, this doesn't make him Deus Ex Machina either though, since Luke and the LOTF jedi can remove themselves from the force entirely.

Caedus was the first to learn that technique, presumably from Lumiya, who was trained by sidious.

The entire premise of that, let alone it itself, is stupid.

Just stupid.

It's even stupider than fanfic that has Luke banging Jaina right at the time of Crystal Star.

meh.

If establishing the precedent that a defense against N.'s attack DOES exist (clearly by the LOTF jedi and Caedus) is stupid, then I accept the title.

In the meantime, since you made the Betty thread, nothing you say even matters.

Originally posted by Letum Lettow
It's even stupider than fanfic that has Luke banging Jaina right at the time of Crystal Star.
...

NO ONE questioned this?

Well, I wouldn't have had to if you would stop quoting the gently loving idiots!

Originally posted by Letum Lettow
It's even stupider than fanfic that has Luke banging Jaina right at the time of Crystal Star.

Your ignorance of grammatical convention aside, this is one of the feeblest, most unfunny, crass, boorish, and lame retorts I've heard this year.

I mean seriously, that's f*cking disgusting. How could someone stand to read Crystal Star and then write a lovely incest/pedo/rape-fic about it?

Awful book.