Originally posted by riceroost
Uhhhh, hasn't Wolverine taken Guardian down?!? Second X-Men / Alpha Flight battle: Wolverine could have killed Guardian.
I have that and no they never even fought...try again.
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/UncannyX-Men-109_11.jpg
2. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/UncannyX-Men-109_13and15.jpg
Originally posted by Grimm22
Nope, I actually own quite a few Wolverine comics 😉Bats is a better taction than Wolverine, easily
Bats has taken stabs before, how would one stab kill him 😐
Seriously unless Wolverine's claws are now poisined then that aint happening ❌
batman has not taken stabs that are enen CLOSE to being compible to the 3 one foot long admantium claws that would go right through his armor flesh and bones like they were made out jello.. I challenge you to find ONE example of batman taking something like that and surviving...
Originally posted by Soljer
I would argue with you on this point, just because I believe Batman is an INCREDIBLE tactician. But it really isn't condusive to this thread, considering I still think that, with prep, Batman would win 9/10, and without, he would lose 9/10.
agreed 100%
well IMO bats could probably take it without prep even 4 out of 10... maybe 5 but that's pushin it..
Originally posted by jinzin
agreed 100%well IMO bats could probably take it without prep even 4 out of 10... maybe 5 but that's pushin it..
I...I cannot believe that I am about to argue FOR Wolverine AGAINST Jinzin. What has the world come to?
Heh, just curious though - what could Batman really do to Wolverine without prep? If it were just a one on one fight? Sure, given time, Batman could manufacture more powerful tranqs, or get some high powered sonics or the like. But I don't think anything that Batman normally carries on his belt would be powerful enough to stop Wolverine. And since Wolverine is so much faster, there is even less chance for batman to pull something sneaky.
Definitely either 8 or 9/10 for Logan without prep.
Though on an entirely different topic - I don't believe Wolverine has superhuman strength. Enhanced human, at most.
And about Jinzin telling Grimm to show his proof of the Dumpster scene being PIS:
Very very true - you cannot prove a negative, he cannot prove "its not PIS," however, Jinzin COULD argue against your proof. Which you have not supplied.
Anyways, my only evidence of that being PIS would have to be that Wolverine has never shown that kind of strength outside of that scene and holding the Elevator car. Though, the elevator car is considered by many to be in support of his grip strength, he isn't CURLING the elevator car.
I wouldn't put Wolverine too far out of Captain America's range.
Originally posted by Soljer😂
I...I cannot believe that I am about to argue FOR Wolverine AGAINST Jinzin. What has the world come to?
Originally posted by Soljer
Heh, just curious though - what could Batman really do to Wolverine without prep? If it were just a one on one fight? Sure, given time, Batman could manufacture more powerful tranqs, or get some high powered sonics or the like. But I don't think anything that Batman normally carries on his belt would be powerful enough to stop Wolverine. And since Wolverine is so much faster, there is even less chance for batman to pull something sneaky.
same with superman (and this was during their first encounter).
Aside from the freq device.. he also has flashbang batarangs, high explosive batarangs, knock out gas etc etc.. and while those may notbe enough to put logan down, I think they can certainly soften logan up for some one hit kill strikes.. yes.. batman knows the touch of death. And I don't think it's inplausible for batman to be able to outfight a stunned logan...
Originally posted by Soljer
Anyways, my only evidence of that being PIS would have to be that Wolverine has never shown that kind of strength outside of that scene and holding the Elevator car. Though, the elevator car is considered by many to be in support of his grip strength, he isn't CURLING the elevator car.
I still say he's curling it you can't deny that wolverine's arm isn't bent during that scene otherwise the elevator would be hanging straight down a continuous line from where the cord was cut.. it isn't it's off kilter.. cause wolverine is lifting it.. if only slightly...
Originally posted by SoljerI'd say he's above.. he was near peak human levels back before the weapon x project... afterwards he was peak x3 so i'd say he's stronger probably not by much.. but stronger.
I wouldn't put Wolverine too far out of Captain America's range.
Originally posted by capt it up
actaully I can post a few feats easiliy in the dumpster range, but I have to do it later since my computer at the moment is out of use and I am force to be on my fathers computer
Don't sweat it, man. You've posted them before
http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=46c6f3d71tg.jpg
Wolverines old stats.
http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wolverinesoldstats0xj.jpg
Wolverine throwing a 1,600 pound full trash container with one arm. (Yes look it up ur self’s at full they are 1,600 pounds)
http://img93.imageshack.us/my.php?image=anothergoodoldstrengthfeat5sc.jpg
This pic speaks for it self.
http://img93.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wolvstrength9ea.jpg
Lifting a shark that weights between 1000 to 1200 pounds and throwing it in a boat from the water. (Look it up your self if u don’t believe how much a shark that size would way)
http://img53.imageshack.us/my.php?image=strengthfeatskarkstyle9jl.jpg
Wolverine punching a guy who says he his brother in water so hard he slams into the wall and his head goes through it.
http://img73.imageshack.us/my.php?image=strength21yp.jpg
Wolverine beats rough-house with his fists. (Rough-house is stated by (marvels wolverine official hand book 2004) to be strength class of a 6 which is the same strength class colossus is in. he is also stated (wolverine # 123) to be just under hulks level of strength.
http://img73.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wolverineownsroughhouse6bd.jpg
Originally posted by riceroost
Ryu's pretty impressive.
Originally posted by riceroostyeah he can but for how long?
He can dodge bullets with ease, so his speed is likely on par with Wolverine.
see the thing is spiderman also dodges bullets with ease and he's able to do it when confronted by multitudes of gunmen... last year he was attacked by an entire hydra army who shot automatics at him and he escaped without a scratch.. wolverine's still able to land blows time after time on spidey... ryu also faces the same problem that spiderman does in that wolverine will have a much higher stamina level.. ryu's able to compete speed wise because he can amp himself with chi.. but it does take it's toll on the man... IMO if spiderman gets tired trying to put wolverine down and avoid him in the graveyard to the point where it was hard for him to stand back up.. ryu's gonna fall to that same drawback... ryu MIGHT (and i stress MIGHT) be able to compete speedwise but he'll get tired; wolverine maintains..
i'd also like to point out that his bullet dodging was harldy impressive when stacked against other street levels.. batman has dodged multiple assailants in automatic gunfire.. he's danced around opponents who have spent their entire lifetimes engaging in marksmenship...
hell he's dodged a blast from deadshot after it had been fired and closed ground so fast he KOed deadshot before the guy could react to what just happened...
and yes he does dodge bullets... rather than evasive maneuvers.
http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b42uu.jpg
he's dodged automatic gunfire from an entire swat team http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b39fe.jpg
look all I'm saying is, if you're going to give the benefit of the doubt that ryu can even compete speedwise, then use better examples then him dodging bullets from one gunment using a handgun... hell even wolverine's done better than that...
IMO better feats for ryu's speed would be his fights against bison.. but that's not so much his actual speed as it is locking in on bisons chi like radar.. he could do the same to wolverine but would it work? I don't know.. I mean look at them comparatively.. when akuma started warping on ryu he didn't know what to do, when bison warps on him he gets beat pretty badly... when people of similar abilities or speedtry that stuff on wolverine (i.e. quicksilver, speed demon, silver surfer, nightcrawler, etc etc..) they get stabbed... 😕
Originally posted by riceroostI THINNK it was a 10 ton boulder.. but then again.. does this matter? really does it? look at what spiderman has been capible of lifting on his back (support beam of an entire building, 30 tons of rubble) and his best shots did nothing but make wolverine smile.. I truly don't think ryu could fair any better...
Ryu is stronger than Wolverine. He goes jogging with what is by my estimation a 15-20 ton boulder on his back.
Originally posted by riceroostdo they back more punch then a spiderman punch? remember he's demolished an entire building with punches rather quickly.. none of these punches did anything but make spidey tired... same applies to ryu.. sure he can throw hadokens.. but one, the hado ken isn't even close to some of the things wolverine's dodged in terms of speed, two we've seen several instances of wolverine taking full blasts shots from cykclops, one where he ran through baals hellfire, another where he took on manderins disintigration flame.. none of this even put the guy down... and all of these shots.. well when ryu DOES shoot out hadokens that have the same destructive capacity he usually tends to pass out... the only times he's shown NOT to pass out from throwing out something that destructive is when he begins to let the dakr hado take over.. and even then, again he faces the problem of wolverine's durability vs. his own stamina.. he gets tired... wolverine maintains.
Ryu can play keep away with fireballs capable of killing normal humans. They wont kill Wolverine by any means, but they do pack quite a punch..
Originally posted by riceroost
Shinkuu Hadouken can pretty much vaporize a highly durable cyborg, and cause skyscrapers to collapse.
Originally posted by riceroostagain.. if you're going to use this as pro-ryu evidenc how can you argue against batman's skill...
Ryu may not have Wolverine's experience, but he does fight more often than anyone else on the planet. I think he's a verteran of more than 10,000 fights.
Originally posted by riceroostneither of which prove effective on wolvie either.. 😕
Ryu can create fire (Shakunetsu Hadouken) as well as lightning (Denjin Hadouken).
Originally posted by riceroost
Ryu may have an edge in technical martial arts, but I do think Wolverine has an edge in brawling ability and military combat style martial arts, as well as weapons fighting.
again I'm not sure if his martial arts ability outclasses wolverine's THAT much.. the guy had SERIOUS problems on several occasions fighting bolrog.. and while balrog's a gifted fighter.. he's still just a boxer.. he only utilizes a portion of his body.. and he doesn't have some of the most important attributes that wolverine can make use of (i.e. healing factor, heightened senses)
Originally posted by riceroostSagat wan't the greatest fighter on the planet.. not even close.. he was just the greatest tournement fighter.. there were a number of people far more powerful than himself during his reign as champ.. and to sagat'sown admission he had a lot to learn about the fighting arts when ryu beat him.
An inexperienced Ryu nearly killed the greatest fighter on the planet (Sagat) with a Dragon Punch when he was roughly 16.
Originally posted by riceroost
Today Ryu is a monster. Shin Shoryuken is arguably just as destructive as Shun Goku Satsu, without actually being a strictly killing move.
Originally posted by riceroost
Ryu would be hard pressed against Wolverine in an up-close fight, because I dont know how durable he is supposed to be, or how quickly he can heal,
Originally posted by riceroost
but if Ryu had to (It would be very un-like him though) he could succumb to the Satsui no Hado and just about destroy anyone on the planet if he wanted.
Originally posted by riceroost
Ryu is honorable though, so I think he would take a loss to Wolverine and use it to motivate him to become better,
Originally posted by riceroostthis is all assuming wolverine didn't kill him before this happened..
which iswhere Ryu does become dangerous. Every time Wolverine fights Ryu, he will face a stronger, faster, more powerful, and technically better fighter. Ryu improves exponentially better than any martial artist in comics. Wolverine might win the first three fights pretty easy, but by fight 4 Ryu will shock him, by 6 Ryu will stalemate him, and by 7-10 Ryu probably beats him.
Originally posted by riceroostI don't.. remember iron fist took down the entire wrecking crew with a decent amount of ease.. ryu had problems with one guy that wasn't even close to wrecking crew level in balrog and got seriously messed up...
I think Ryu would annihilate Iron Fist. Ryu can do with a basic blow what the Iron Fist does with his hardest shot.
It would be a great fight.
Originally posted by jinzin
not saying he isn't..... the main problem with dealing with wolverine for a guy like ryu is wolverine's levels of damage soak...yeah he can but for how long?
see the thing is spiderman also dodges bullets with ease and he's able to do it when confronted by multitudes of gunmen... last year he was attacked by an entire hydra army who shot automatics at him and he escaped without a scratch.. wolverine's still able to land blows time after time on spidey... ryu also faces the same problem that spiderman does in that wolverine will have a much higher stamina level.. ryu's able to compete speed wise because he can amp himself with chi.. but it does take it's toll on the man... IMO if spiderman gets tired trying to put wolverine down and avoid him in the graveyard to the point where it was hard for him to stand back up.. ryu's gonna fall to that same drawback... ryu MIGHT (and i stress MIGHT) be able to compete speedwise but he'll get tired; wolverine maintains..
i'd also like to point out that his bullet dodging was harldy impressive when stacked against other street levels.. batman has dodged multiple assailants in automatic gunfire.. he's danced around opponents who have spent their entire lifetimes engaging in marksmenship...
hell he's dodged a blast from deadshot after it had been fired and closed ground so fast he KOed deadshot before the guy could react to what just happened...
and yes he does dodge bullets... rather than evasive maneuvers.http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b42uu.jpg
he's dodged automatic gunfire from an entire swat team http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b39fe.jpglook all I'm saying is, if you're going to give the benefit of the doubt that ryu can even compete speedwise, then use better examples then him dodging bullets from one gunment using a handgun... hell even wolverine's done better than that...
IMO better feats for ryu's speed would be his fights against bison.. but that's not so much his actual speed as it is locking in on bisons chi like radar.. he could do the same to wolverine but would it work? I don't know.. I mean look at them comparatively.. when akuma started warping on ryu he didn't know what to do, when bison warps on him he gets beat pretty badly... when people of similar abilities or speedtry that stuff on wolverine (i.e. quicksilver, speed demon, silver surfer, nightcrawler, etc etc..) they get stabbed... 😕
I THINNK it was a 10 ton boulder.. but then again.. does this matter? really does it? look at what spiderman has been capible of lifting on his back (support beam of an entire building, 30 tons of rubble) and his best shots did nothing but make wolverine smile.. I truly don't think ryu could fair any better...
do they back more punch then a spiderman punch? remember he's demolished an entire building with punches rather quickly.. none of these punches did anything but make spidey tired... same applies to ryu.. sure he can throw hadokens.. but one, the hado ken isn't even close to some of the things wolverine's dodged in terms of speed, two we've seen several instances of wolverine taking full blasts shots from cykclops, one where he ran through baals hellfire, another where he took on manderins disintigration flame.. none of this even put the guy down... and all of these shots.. well when ryu DOES shoot out hadokens that have the same destructive capacity he usually tends to pass out... the only times he's shown NOT to pass out from throwing out something that destructive is when he begins to let the dakr hado take over.. and even then, again he faces the problem of wolverine's durability vs. his own stamina.. he gets tired... wolverine maintains.
talked about this above.
again.. if you're going to use this as pro-ryu evidenc how can you argue against batman's skill...
neither of which prove effective on wolvie either.. 😕
again I'm not sure if his martial arts ability outclasses wolverine's THAT much.. the guy had SERIOUS problems on several occasions fighting bolrog.. and while balrog's a gifted fighter.. he's still just a boxer.. he only utilizes a portion of his body.. and he doesn't have some of the most important attributes that wolverine can make use of (i.e. healing factor, heightened senses)
Sagat wan't the greatest fighter on the planet.. not even close.. he was just the greatest tournement fighter.. there were a number of people far more powerful than himself during his reign as champ.. and to sagat'sown admission he had a lot to learn about the fighting arts when ryu beat him.
is it as destructive as say.. hulk with a redwood?
he's not durable enough to stop vega claws from sending him to the hospital if he's hit with them.. that's a pretty strict consistency with any street fighter in ryu's class... and the only human able to contradict this was bison.. even then he had to use a pretty hefty amount of psychopower to stop bullets from penetrating him...
i don't think this is true either.. I'm pretty positive alpha bison, akuma, oro, and gill could all beat ryu given that circumstance anyway.. not saying he can't take wolverine here.. just how likely is it to happen?
exactly...
this is all assuming wolverine didn't kill him before this happened..
I don't.. remember iron fist took down the entire wrecking crew with a decent amount of ease.. ryu had problems with one guy that wasn't even close to wrecking crew level in balrog and got seriously messed up...
ryu's impressive.. but against marvel street levels.. he's much less so..IMHO anyways.
Is your publisher going to realise this as a paper back or leather bound hard copy? lol
Nice post BTW 😎
