Originally posted by Grimm22Not really, its comics, Jesus nothing is ever cast in stone. I say 40-50 of comics out there would be considered Pis by forum standards. Don't forget kirby was around during marvel and Dcs plot device era when it was even more unstable than it is now.
Jack Kirby is rolling in his grave right now 🙁
Originally posted by Grimm22no it hasn't... 🤨
First off, Wolverine's strength has been shown again and again and again to be simply enchanced human. Which at most is about 1,000 pounds.
you guys LOOOOOVEEEE to say this shit but where's your proof honestly.. we've provided TONS of proof to the contrary and all you can say is "PIS", you make a claim you better be able to back it up... so back it up.
Originally posted by Grimm22
Now here it is shown that a 1,600 pound dumpster can be thrown with one hand by an enchanced human 🤨
Originally posted by Grimm22
Also, say Wolverine is above Enchanced Human (which he isnt), even then he shouldnt be able to throw the dumpster with one hand. Why?Leverage.
if he wasn't as strong as he is perhaps.. but since he is.. well.....
Originally posted by Grimm22and you say you read wolverine comics.. ❌
It would take some time for Wolverine to get into the right position to hold the dumpster with one hand I might add. Of course the comic shows it as simply a second. Now Wolverine was behind the vertical base of the dumpster, the fastest way to pick it up would be to run over to the middle of the horizontal base and pick it up there. Of course this makes no sense as by the time that Wolverine would have done this he would have been shot numerous times by his enemy. Since Wolverine isnt impervioious to bullets they would cause him to drop the dumpster and would most likely fall on himself.
wolverine takes bullets like they're mysquito bites. and again he'd have only needed to do that were his strength not proficient enough to toss the dumpster without the leverage.. well it was.. so....
Originally posted by Grimm22so even if he has the strength to pull off a feat he still can't pull off that feat?
So even if Wolverine had that kind of strength, he still couldnt have possibly done what he did in the comic 😄
I don't quite follow that "logic"... 😕
Errmm, I myself have said that Wolverine has enhanced strength (one ton range, most likely) making the Dumpster scene possible....but...leverage?
How strong, exactly, do you think wolverine is? Five ton? Ten ton? Honestly? He couldn't have pitched that dumpster because he couldn't have gotten under it to apply force to lift it. I'm not saying it was PIS, I think a feat like that is well within Wolverine's ability (two handed, more than likely :-/) but I would call it....artistic license of the writer.
Meh. Wolverine is an enhanced human (which is much greater than 1,000 pounds, Grimm22), but simple PHYSICS don't agree with that panel. I give it up to artistic license.
You're right - it's a comic, hence it HAPPENED, I'm not saying it didn't, how can I argue what has already been inked. I'm just arguing that it shouldn't have. I mean, Im not upset that it did, I'm not saying that I think it is "PIS," just that it shouldn't be possible.
And, not out of debate, but of curiosity - where DO you place Wolverine on the strength scale?
Originally posted by jinzin
no it hasn't... 🤨you guys LOOOOOVEEEE to say this shit but where's your proof honestly.. we've provided TONS of proof to the contrary and all you can say is "PIS", you make a claim you better be able to back it up... so back it up.
why not? DD who's only peak human in strength is able to handle 400 punds on a barbell like it's a bowstaff... wolverine throwning a dumpster with somwhere around 3 times his strength isn't out of the question.
if he wasn't as strong as he is perhaps.. but since he is.. well.....
and you say you read wolverine comics.. ❌
wolverine takes bullets like they're mysquito bites. and again he'd have only needed to do that were his strength not proficient enough to toss the dumpster without the leverage.. well it was.. so....
so even if he has the strength to pull off a feat he still can't pull off that feat?
I don't quite follow that "logic"... 😕
No your just to blind to understand what I just said. 😄
I JUST explained why its PIS. Oh course you simply ignored everything I said. 😐
Originally posted by Soljer
You're right - it's a comic, hence it HAPPENED, I'm not saying it didn't, how can I argue what has already been inked. I'm just arguing that it shouldn't have. I mean, Im not upset that it did, I'm not saying that I think it is "PIS," just that it shouldn't be possible.And, not out of debate, but of curiosity - where DO you place Wolverine on the strength scale?
Enchanced Human 😐
Same with Cap
Originally posted by riceroostas well, you can't say i would do more damage then a brick shot... the thing is ryu's hard pressed to keep those level punches coming at the consistency that a guy like spiderman has going...
Yeah Wolverine can take Ryu's punches well, but considering that a lot of Ryu's fighting utilizes chi you can't say that he would just soak up the damage like he would the damage from a normal 20 ton punch.
Originally posted by riceroosttheorized by whom?
It's been theorized that Ryu has an endless supply of ki energy with which to fight, so he should be able to maintain top speed for a very long time.
so far every time ryu really lets loose with his chi energy it drains the shit out of him and he passes out.... or is exhausted.
Originally posted by riceroost
Ryu's speed feats aren't all that impressive only because there is so little official Street Fighter story available to use. We know he can effortlessly dodge gunfire because Capcom confirmed that ability after the Street Fighter Alpha Movie came out, showing Ryu dodging bullets..
Originally posted by riceroostRyu is a normal human though 😕 what makes ryu so damned impressive is his ability to amp himself to superhuman levels. it is because of how much he trains, I'm not arguing that, but it also has to do with his chi manip. also: false dycotomy.. you're giving ryu the benefit of the doubt that he HAS an inexhaustable amount of power.. MAYBE someday ryu will be able to tap into that kind of power of his own free will.. until then there's simply no reason for this kind of rationale... Ryu has to prove that he won't get tired, feats suggest otherwise by a large amount.. until this is PROVEN it can't really be used for the purposes of this debate...
Again, this in not really true. Ryu is not a normal human and is able to pull off super human feats strictly because of how much he trains. Since Ryu trains more than anyone else his stamina increases to what is most likely superhuman or very near it. Bolstered by a nearly inexhaustable supply of ki energy, he's not going to tire out anytime soon.
Originally posted by riceroost
And we all know how believable it is for a normal human man to be dodging bullets. I could accept Batman dodging a single bullet, but not more than one, not more than one shooter, and certainly not automatic fire. I know he can do it, but it's so far out of the realm of what a person can do it's rediculous to bring it up here.
and yet ryu can? 🤨
no it's not ridiculous to bring it up here.. you're talking about what characters SHOULD be able to do instead of how they are represented, sorry but if that's the case you should most likely pull out of or retract a large number of your arguments for wovlerine, because many many people feel he shouldn't be able to do a large portion of the things that he does do...
also, batman's not really a normal human either:
Originally posted by riceroost
Ryu can dodge bullets because he's beyond human from his training regiment, he knows "magic" martial arts, and he can utilize Ki energy.
Originally posted by riceroostoooorrr. because he has much training like ryu, he is far more aware of his surroundings than a normal human, he far surpasses what a normal human can do.. AND much like captain america he's just that damned good, it may not be a good reason, but it's what we'e given.
Spider-Man dodges bullets because he has precog and super agility, Wolverine does it because he has enhanced senses/speed/reflexes beyond a human. Why does Batman dodge bullets??? Because the creative team thought it looked cool.
When someone argues that they have seen evidence of something but that the evidence doesn't count because that character "shouldn't be able to do that" they need to re-think the premise of thier conclusion. A characters abilities are based on what he or she demonstrates he or she can do, not on what someone thought they could do at one time.
Originally posted by riceroost
I really can't, there is VERY little official information on actual cannon Street Fighter crap.
Originally posted by riceroost
Ryu has never really fought Bison that we know of. They had a brief interaction before the second tournament where Ryu drove off Bison, but there was no fight. Bison tried to use Psycho Power to control Ryu and Ryu got pissed and hit Bison, leading to Bison retreating. This is actually pretty impressive considering Bison was god-like during Alpha 3 and he ran from a fight with Ryu. Ryu may have beat Bison at the second tournament, but that Bison was weaker and we have no official information on who was in the finals.
i was going to give you the benefit of the doubt to use whatevermedia you pleased.. but no? okay...
anyways was it not confirmed that bison in alpha 3 challanged and deafeated ryu?
Originally posted by riceroostaccording to whom? 😕
It was closer to a 20 ton boulder. And yeah Spider-Man is strong as hell, but Ryu went JOGGING down the road for miles carrying the boulder. In Oro's Street Fighter Third Strike ending Ryu is lifting a boulder that's easily twice the size of the one he was lifting before, So Ryu is well beyond 20 ton range.
again..ben of the doubt...
Originally posted by riceroost
Well Ryu punches harder than Spider-Man,
spiderman has one-punched down titanium steel doors.. the only time ryu did anything close to that was in a comic which isn't usebale as per your wishes...
Originally posted by riceroosthis firball is a firball.. it does have a decent destructive capaibility but it lacks the stopping power to put wolverine down... and it's draining on ryu.
so I would imagine his fireball would hurt a lot more since the fireball is more powerful than Ryu's punches.
Originally posted by riceroostbeing more powerful = faster?
Well the Sonic Boom (Guile's projectile) is supposed to travel at least as fast as the speed of sound and Ryu's Hadou Ken is by far a more powerful projectile.
is hulk faster than speedfreak? ❌
besies.. maybe sonic boom SHOULD be as fast as sound.. but in every media it's much slower than say bullets even...
Originally posted by riceroost
They can move pretty fast.
as fast as lazers? cause the'll need to be to hit wolverine..
Originally posted by riceroost
And Ryu can unleash fireballs quicker (takes him no time to charge fireball) than just about any other Street Fighter.
and these smaller one's have no stopping power.. can't even stop balrog...
Originally posted by riceroostthe bigger ones wipe him out.. again I don't see anything of his that proves more impressive than what wolverine's already stood up to, and walked through in the past...
Ryu can also make his fireball pretty gigantic. Like Cyclops, not every blast is the same size. Some are orbs, some are waves, some are blasts, and he can throw a huge beam of energy like in the X-Men vs. Street Fighter games.
Originally posted by riceroostthat was the biggest hadoken he had, and it left him in a really weakened state.. my point exactly..
Ryu can vaporize cyborgs with at least superhuman durability and regenerative/self repairing mechanisms with a single blast.
Errr, I was asking Jinzin, since he said "I wouldn't place him in the two ton range, and there isn't much evidence for even one ton" (paraphrased, obviously).
See, I place Wolverine just over Cap. Not the SAME strength, but the same League, at least. But Cap has always been represented as peak human, never as "enhanced" or "superhuman."
Meh. Regardless of that, I still rank them close, probably 1 ton range.
Originally posted by Soljer
You're right - it's a comic, hence it HAPPENED, I'm not saying it didn't, how can I argue what has already been inked. I'm just arguing that it shouldn't have. I mean, Im not upset that it did, I'm not saying that I think it is "PIS," just that it shouldn't be possible.And, not out of debate, but of curiosity - where DO you place Wolverine on the strength scale?
probably around 1600 pounds.. lol...
Originally posted by Grimm22
No your just to blind to understand what I just said. 😄I JUST explained why its PIS. Oh course being the wolverine fanboy that you are, you simply ignored everything I said. 😐
oh that's nice I'm a wolverine fanboy cause you're arguments are for shit and you can't prove a thing.. yeah.. way to go. 🙄
Originally posted by jinzin
probably around 1600 pounds.. lol...oh that's nice I'm a wolverine fanboy cause you're arguments are for shit and you can't prove a thing.. yeah.. way to go. 🙄
What the hell?!?! 🤨
Are you dense?!? Are you retarted or somthing?!? I explained why its impossible for that scene to make sense.
Oh and Wolverine dosent simply shrug off bullets that are shot directly at him!
Considering Wolverine IS a mutant, I'd see no reason why he isn't above peak human.
Think about it. The guy hauls an extra 100 lbs of weight in his skeleton frame, yet he is able to maneuver around as easily and with as much agility as other street levelers such as Daredevil and Captain America; he can even move ast enough to slice bullets in mid-air. that right there is a good indication of strength. Add that to the fact that, as a mutant, he's not necessarily limited to being just peak human strength and it's not illogical for him to perform those strength feats like throwing the dumpster.
Originally posted by riceroost
Ryu does not pass out after throwing high end fireballs/blasts/beams.
Originally posted by riceroosteither case.. he still passes out...
That was also when Ryu was much younger and struggling with the Dark Hado. Throwing the super destructive version didn't make him pass out, it was the strain of fighting the Satsui no Hadou. Dark Hadou builds up massive amounts of destructive energy and fighting to cut off the influence might have made the power explode, which is what caused Ryu to pass out.
Originally posted by riceroost
It's also the movie's interpretation of the satsui no hado, and it's not exactly accurate. When Ryu uses the Satsui no Hado he is not maniacal like a growling beast, he's more like Akuma/Gouki, calm collected and seeking to win the fight no matter what.
Originally posted by riceroost
OOOOOOOOh. I am beginning to see your problem. You are talking about the Ryu from the Street Fighter comic book from Udon. Needless to say this is not cannon Street Fighter information or sources. Yes, Wolverine would beat the Ryu from the comic. I am not talking about this Ryu. Ryu would pretty easily annihilate Balrog in the actual Street Fighter universe..
actually I'm using whatever media you can draw upon for sources since relying strictly on the games leaves things WAAAAAAYYY too ambiguous to make any real justifiable arguments in my opinion.. considering all the storyline that capcom as stated as having happened.. and then reconted, and then stated something else, and then reconted that etc etc.. leaving a lot of open endings. I figured you'de want more feats to draw upon. if not that's fine too.. but then this really isn't much of a debate considering most things stated about ryu are theorized rather than proven.. that being the case there's not much point to debate the issue..
Originally posted by riceroostwhat are you talking about there were a gripload of people more powerful or deadlier than himself at the time he was defeated...
Balrog is not really that good, and even having said that he can punch a bull elephant hard enough to kill it.
Again, this is comic Sagat. The real Sagat is a beast. He was the greatest fighter in the world until Ryu beat him. Ryu actually can't really touch Sagat's talent till around the end of the SF2 tournament. Currently they are still tiered in the same rank. Ryu only outclasses Sagat because he has more raw power/chi than Sagat. And again, this was at 16 years of age.
Originally posted by riceroostI know exactly what shun goku satsu does.. but that's not what the shoryuken does... shoryuken's more about destructive power... whether it's equivolent to the satsu or not they don't have the same effect on living beings..
You miss the point of the move. Shun Goku Satsu is not a move that comits a great force on the body like a shot from Hulk. It is a move designed to send the victim of the technique straight to Hell. Shin Shoryuken is roughly equal to this move. My bad on the wording. In terms of sheer destructive power a Hadou blast would work best. Ryu or Gouki could level a forest no problem.
Originally posted by riceroost
I dont know what you are talking about here. Vega has never fought Ryu in the comics or in the actual Street Fighter cannon storyline, so we dont know how he would stand up to blades. And in the official SF story Bison wouldn't even notice bullets. They are incapable of doing him any harm at all.
I surley hope you're not trying to suggest that wolverine couldn't make mince meat out of ryu with his claws.. if that were the case wwhy would ryu bullet dodge?
Originally posted by riceroostno arugments here. though i still think akuma and alpha 3 bison would hand this ryu his ass...
The 3 most powerful people in SF right now are Gouki/Oro/Gill. Ryu did get beat by Oro in SF3, but Ryu impressed Oro (Who is of god-like power) to the point that Oro has picked Ryu to be his student as Ryu shows greater promise than any other fighter on the planet. Oro compares Ken's fighting ability to that of a dog when in relation to Ryu's talent. And Ken is really good.
Originally posted by riceroostagain no arguments here.. but I can't argue about something that hasn't happened yet...
Gouki still believes that Ryu will be just as powerful, if not moreso than himself very soon.
Originally posted by riceroosttrue about the killing intent about being near akuma's level.. ryu needs to prove that himself first...
Ryu is almost as powerful as Gouki and that is WITHOUT using the Satsui no Hadou. If Ryu did use the SNH he probably would be as good if not better than Gouki. Ryu just wants to be that powerful without needing to use the killing intent..
Originally posted by riceroostgill is compared to a god by plenty of people yet his feats hardly ever demontrate godlike power...
Gill is straight up a God and was defeated by Alex in SF3. Ryu obliterated Alex.
Originally posted by riceroostyou're not stating anything I don't already know.. but wolveirne's just not one of those guys IMO.
Alex couldn't land a single blow on Ryu. Comic Ryu again. Balrog couldn't touch the real Ryu and even the real Balrog would kill comic Balrog. Ryu has stalemated Gouki (Alpha 2) who is the most powerful being in the Street Fighter universe. And he beat a guy who beat a god.
The real Ryu would vaporize pretty much all Marvel's street level guys. Ryu's not exactly street level, even though he fights hand to hand.
Gah! Accel(if you were directing that at me)! It isn't illogical for him to be able to lift the amount of weight Jinzin is proposing, hell, I would agree with a bit more! It IS illogical, however, to propose that he could throw a dumpster like that, considering the force required. I'm not saying it didn't happen! I'm not saying Wolverine isn't more than humanly-strong! I am only saying that the ONE particular scene in question was illogical. BUT, it is a comic, so logic goes right out the window. No questions.
Originally posted by Accelreally good logic. His strenght really should be up there if you move at his speed despite the extra weight hes carrying.
Considering Wolverine IS a mutant, I'd see no reason why he isn't above peak human.Think about it. The guy hauls an extra 100 lbs of weight in his skeleton frame, yet he is able to maneuver around as easily and with as much agility as other street levelers such as Daredevil and Captain America; he can even move ast enough to slice bullets in mid-air. that right there is a good indication of strength. Add that to the fact that, as a mutant, he's not necessarily limited to being just peak human strength and it's not illogical for him to perform those strength feats like throwing the dumpster.
Originally posted by Accel
Considering Wolverine IS a mutant, I'd see no reason why he isn't above peak human.Think about it. The guy hauls an extra 100 lbs of weight in his skeleton frame, yet he is able to maneuver around as easily and with as much agility as other street levelers such as Daredevil and Captain America; he can even move ast enough to slice bullets in mid-air. that right there is a good indication of strength. Add that to the fact that, as a mutant, he's not necessarily limited to being just peak human strength and it's not illogical for him to perform those strength feats like throwing the dumpster.
Exactly why I say Wolverine has enchaned human strength 😄
Originally posted by Grimm22
What the hell?!?! 🤨Are you dense?!? Are you retarted or somthing?!? I explained why its impossible for that scene to make sense.
getting touchy?
it's not my fault you can't argue worth a shit.. look...
we see wolverine next to the dumpster and then we see the dumpster airborne... how EXACTLY he picked it up or moved it is ambiguous but hey he didn't have leverage and even if h was strong enough to do something like this he still can't do it by your own logic... 🤨
Originally posted by Grimm22
Oh and Wolverine dosent simply shrug off bullets that are shot directly at him!
he doesn't?
🤨
http://img93.imageshack.us/my.php?image=5599de7b5az.jpg
yup, you're certainly doing a great job supporting that argument that you read wolverine books.. 🙄
Originally posted by jinzin
getting touchy?it's not my fault you can't argue worth a shit.. look...
we see wolverine next to the dumpster and then we see the dumpster airborne... how EXACTLY he picked it up or moved it is ambiguous but hey he didn't have leverage and even if h was strong enough to do something like this he still can't do it by your own logic... 🤨
he doesn't?
🤨
http://img93.imageshack.us/my.php?image=5599de7b5az.jpgyup, you're certainly doing a great job supporting that argument that you read wolverine books.. 🙄
Um your forgeting in the issue when he fought Bucky, where that chick shot him with a ritfle and knocked him over. 😐
Originally posted by Soljer
Gah! Accel(if you were directing that at me)! It isn't illogical for him to be able to lift the amount of weight Jinzin is proposing, hell, I would agree with a bit more! It IS illogical, however, to propose that he could throw a dumpster like that, considering the force required. I'm not saying it didn't happen! I'm not saying Wolverine isn't more than humanly-strong! I am only saying that the ONE particular scene in question was illogical. BUT, it is a comic, so logic goes right out the window. No questions.
Any way, applying real life physics to comic books kind of takes the fun out them. It doesn't really matter HOW wolverine did it, just that he DID do it.
