If this is about that inane thread about the Grim Reaper: It was an inane waste of space.
I'm just going to paraphrase an earlier post to save effort.
Everyone is entitled to hold an opinion, and they're free to express it, if they so wish. But if they expect everyone to agree with it or respect it, then they're out of their mind.
If telling someone an unfounded, wrong and/or plainly stupid opinion, is disrespectful, I frankly don't care. If someone's of the opinion/belief the Earth is a flat circular disc on the back of four giant elephants resting atop a larger space tortoise which flies around the sun, I have no qualms telling them that's idiotic.
The credo that "It's a belief, therefore it can't be wrong." or "Opinions are always valid." is (in my opinion, somewhat ironic huh?) incorrect.
Someone who expresses an opinion in full knowledge that it may be subject to criticism or contention, but then can't take the criticism or contention that may accompany expression of an opinion, has no entitlement to whine about disrespect.
I agree that personal expression and freedom of opinion are good things, though I do think that it's more worthwhile and beneficial for everyone when that personal expression isn't used primarily for selfish reasons.
I believe that personal expression is only really of value, when the primary motivation behind it is to assist others - and not to tear others down, or take something away from them. So I believe Marcu is correct in this regard.
Where I disagree with him though is when an individual expresses an opinion that is detrimental to the well being to others. In situations such as these, it is necessary to restrict the right to express those opinions that can cause others harm, particularly if those beliefs are frequently practiced upon. In severe cases it may even be necessary to take the right of opinion away from the individual if it continues to cause serious harm to others.
Re: Respecting other's Beliefs
Originally posted by marcu
I know I have not been on here much as of late. But the last few days I have been popping in. I am a little sad. There is many people of many different faiths or beliefs on this board and in the Religion section. But even today as I am reading through threads, I see that people post a topic with questions or discussion points and the very next post is someone name calling or blasting them for their post. I understand that this is a place for discussion...but why run people into the ground right off the hop? What happened to repsect and being polite?Please, someone help me out here and talk to me about this. I don't understand it. If someone starts a serious post here and you don't have a nice thing to say or contribute...then why do you people bother? Just to get a rise out of people? To be plain mean?
It breaks my heart to think that people start threads that mean something to THEM and the very first responder knocks them down.
It doesn't matter what belief system we all have...no one deserves to be run down.
Originally posted by Storm
I tend to agree with Cline. Beliefs don’ t merit automatic respect because some beliefs are immoral, evil, or just plain stupid. Beliefs may be able to earn a person’ s respect, but it’ s an abdication of moral and intellectual responsibility to automatically accord the same respect to all beliefs.If believers want respect, then they must be treated as adults who are responsible and culpable for what they assert, for better and for worse. This means that their claims should be treated seriously with substantive responses and critiques, if criticism is warranted. If believers are willing to present their position in a rational, coherent manner, then they deserve a rational and coherent response, including critical responses. If they are unwilling or unable to present their views in a rational and coherent manner, then they should anticipate being dismissed with little afterthought.
Originally posted by Alliance
Actually, I disagree. I think people with opinions based on fallacies or poor logic deserve to be corrected. Respect goes for grey areas. There is nothing to respect about ignorance.I think this coming from you is just hilarious.
Why exactly would you say it is hilarious coming from me? Do you even know me? Rememeber me?
The sad part here is that the point is being missed from my first post. People aren't even given a chance around here...they post a new thread on a religious topic that is of interest or importance to THEM and there can't even be an intellectual discussion about it here. It's one blast followed by another blast....
That begs the question as to who exactly is the IGNORANT one around these threads? The one with the topic that you found ignorant? Or YOU for not being able to show some maturity in posting under that person with respect?
I know that answer already...
Originally posted by marcu
That begs the question as to who exactly is the IGNORANT one around these threads? The one with the topic that you found ignorant? Or YOU for not being able to show some maturity in posting under that person with respect?I know that answer already...
Well thats rather presumptuous. You start a thread on respect and in your 3rd (i believe) post you are already calling people ignorant. (see my earlier comment about hilarity)
Originally posted by marcu
The sad part here is that the point is being missed from my first post. People aren't even given a chance around here...they post a new thread on a religious topic that is of interest or importance to THEM and there can't even be an intellectual discussion about it here. It's one blast followed by another blast....
Actually thats totally incorrect. People do post topics and get serious discussions. Regret has had several good topics lately. THis is a forum. If you want 100% intellectual, go to a university. Some people on here are kids. Intellecual discussion also implies that you have intellectual opinions. Most threads on here don't reflect that, including this one.
Originally posted by marcu
The sad part here is that the point is being missed from my first post. People aren't even given a chance around here...they post a new thread on a religious topic that is of interest or importance to THEM and there can't even be an intellectual discussion about it here. It's one blast followed by another blast....That begs the question as to who exactly is the IGNORANT one around these threads? The one with the topic that you found ignorant? Or YOU for not being able to show some maturity in posting under that person with respect?
I know that answer already...
If your beleif entitles a certain discrimination against other people, then your beleif will not be respected by all.
Islam sees women as second class. Why should I respect Islam ?
Evangelism says Gays go to Hell. Why should I respect Evangelism ?
Evangelism also says Mormons are Satan's cult. Why should I respect it any further ?
Hinduism promotes extreme classism. Why should I respect Hinduism ?
And so on and so on....
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
If your beleif entitles a certain discrimination against other people, then your beleif will not be respected by all.Islam sees women as second class. Why should I respect Islam ?
Evangelism says Gays go to Hell. Why should I respect Evangelism ?
Evangelism also says Mormons are Satan's cult. Why should I respect it any further ?
Hinduism promotes extreme classism. Why should I respect Hinduism ?
And so on and so on....
Why? Because if you were Islam, Evangelical, Gay or a Hindu...I'd still respect you and speak kindly to you. Try to get to know you as a person and not slam you regardless of our differences.
I am not looking for enemies here...just want to come to some kind of understanding that we are all people who deserve respect and must show respect.
Originally posted by marcu
Why? Because if you were Islam, Evangelical, Gay or a Hindu...I'd still respect you and speak kindly to you. Try to get to know you as a person and not slam you regardless of our differences.
Actually if you were an Evangelical you would be "slaming" Urizen since he's bisexual.
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Actually if you were an Evangelical you would be "slaming" Urizen since he's bisexual.
Actually I am Evangelical and I am not nor would I slam him for being bi-sexual. As a matter of fact...I have been confronting many Christians for slamming gays before they have full understanding of how that all works. I lean towards it not being of a persons choice to be gay or bi...but rather something they may be born with. So, don't tell me that I should be slamming him...cause I would be more interested in getting to know his story to further my knowledge on the topic.
Originally posted by marcu
Why? Because if you were Islam, Evangelical, Gay or a Hindu...I'd still respect you and speak kindly to you. Try to get to know you as a person and not slam you regardless of our differences.
No matter how kindly one says "eff off," you're still saying it.
Your opinion is what matters, not how nicely you package it.
Originally posted by marcu
Why? Because if you were Islam, Evangelical, Gay or a Hindu...I'd still respect you and speak kindly to you. Try to get to know you as a person and not slam you regardless of our differences.I am not looking for enemies here...just want to come to some kind of understanding that we are all people who deserve respect and must show respect.
Are you talking about respecting people, or respecting someone's opinion ?
Because those are two completely different things. I do not have to respect an opinion which I find hateful or offensive. No one does.
Originally posted by marcu
The sad part here is that the point is being missed from my first post. People aren't even given a chance around here...they post a new thread on a religious topic that is of interest or importance to THEM and there can't even be an intellectual discussion about it here. It's one blast followed by another blast....That begs the question as to who exactly is the IGNORANT one around these threads? The one with the topic that you found ignorant? Or YOU for not being able to show some maturity in posting under that person with respect?
I know that answer already...
People are given chances, but at the same time one must understand that at some point - they may experience conflict with the opinions they've presented. I think it's also important to note that being able to have an opinion isn't necessarily an entitlement, it is a gift from God that comes along with free will.
Some opinions are clearly evil, and I have a problem with any opinion expressed that can clearly be used to cause harm to others. "Harm" to me is defined as those evils which include sexual sin, violent crimes, slander, lying, and other such sinful behavior as mentioned in the bible. In a perfect world, one without evil - I think complete freedom of expression would work quite well. But unfortunately, we don't live in a perfect world as of yet.
In this world full of people with relativistic morality who want to make their own opinions and perverted doctrines truth over what we all inherently know truth to be, it is necessary to limit some forms of expression, particularly those forms of expression that cause detriment to others. A world which truly offers absolute freedom to do what they please with their opinions, really offers freedom to no one.
Re: Respect and support
Originally posted by Wonderer
It is important to me that we don't criticise and judge others, in fact, we must respect and support all other religions.This is a call to all religions out there to be respectful, tolerant and supportive to all other religions.
The most important things in life are love, kindness and compassion and helpfulness and I feel we can all try to practice this more. There is all too much fighting in the world between religions and it is totally unnecessary.
I wish all you other religions out there great happiness and peace in your heart and the wisdom not to go out on a mission to criticise other religions.
We are all human and we fail many times in our attempts not to judge those who think different than we, but we can at least try harder to create harmony between all religions. 🙂
For me, being respectful in all aspects of life is fair. U shouldn't disrespect anyone under any circumstance. Guy222
Originally posted by Thundar
Some opinions are clearly evil, and I have a problem with any opinion expressed that can clearly be used to cause harm to others.
I find some of your opinions evil because they are ignorant and promote certain prejudices.
Originally posted by Thundar
"Harm" to me is defined as those evils which include sexual sin, violent crimes, slander, lying, and other such sinful behavior as mentioned in the bible.
The only sexual sin is rape. That's the only thing that causes harm.
Lying is often necessary. If a depressed girl asks me if I think she is pretty when in reality I find her ugly, I am not going to tell her the truth. To save her life, I will lie.
Would you tell a serial killer the truth if he asked you where your mother was ?
Telling the Truth is not always a good thing. You're black and white sense of morality is disturbing and annoying.
Originally posted by Thundar
In a perfect world, one without evil - I think complete freedom of expression would work quite well. But unfortunately, we don't live in a perfect world as of yet.
You trying to impose your personal morality upon the rest of the world is evil. You have no clear understanding of anyone else's pov, you assume that we all "inheritantly" know your opinion to be truth, you are clearly a fool.
You have a dangerous mind, because you are convinced that you know all there is to know.
Originally posted by marcu
*sighs*Just general respect for people...and opinions.
Should we be respectful to people. Yup.
But the amount of respect I give someone's opinion depends on what that opinion consists of. I wouldn't respect the opinion of a compulsive liar, because, well quite frankly -- he won't be respecting me or anyone else by always lying to them.
So anyway, I only give my complete respect or reverence, to one who is completely righteous with all of his/her personal opinions.
Unfortunately, I don't know of a limited being within this plain of existence, who is completely righteous with all of their opinions, so often times - I find myself not respecting the opinions of many of the limited people I meet in life.
Originally posted by ThundarAlthough, it is not for us to decide who is "righteous" and who is not, at least not according to Christ.
Should we be respectful to people. Yup.But the amount of respect I give someone's opinion depends on what that opinion consists of. I wouldn't respect the opinion of a compulsive liar, because, well quite frankly -- he won't be respecting me or anyone else by always lying to them.
So anyway, I only give my complete respect or reverence, to one who is completely righteous with all of his/her personal opinions.
Unfortunately, I don't know of a limited being within this plain of existence, who is completely righteous with all of their opinions, so often times - I find myself not respecting the opinions of many of the limited people I meet in life.