I don't understand how people could say a magical creator in the sky made everything out of nothing, in the blink of an eye. It makes so much little sense. If you disagree with evolution, that's fine, I'd like to see what you think, but saying "God did it" as an alternative answer isn't that impressive if you ask me.
Originally posted by ThePittman
So you are saying that you know how he works and what he thinks?However the advancement of science and understanding of the world around us leads to disproving his existence not proving he is real. As humans gain a greater knowledge of science we move away from religion, as each generation passes and mans knowledge expands religions start to fade.
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
I am not talking about "religion" I am talking about God. Religion is a means to an end. The end being a relationship (fellowship) with God. That is what people are searching for. But instead of coming to God through Jesus (as the Bible instructs) people have tried to get to God through self-effort (i.e., this man-made thing called religion). Religion has nothing to do with God. Religion is not some "thing" out in a vacuum. It is something that is man-made for the purpose of approaching God. But it is not the answer. Jesus is the answer. I know what the Lord God has revealed to me in His Word about what He thinks and how He operates.[B]Science Reveals God
As a rule, when God and science are mentioned together, it is either in an effort to disprove God or science. There are admittedly contradictions between God and science, especially modern, pseudo science (I Tim. 6: 20, KJV). In this material, though, we want to briefly examine how true science actually reveals God and certain truths about God (as taught in God’s word). Of course, in an absolute sense, there is no empirical evidence (test tube) that God exists. (It is also a fact, however, that "science" does not require empirical proof for all scientific tenets.) For instance, "no man has seen God" (I Jn. 4: 12). God is invisible and intangible (Rom. 1: 20, Jn. 4: 24). Hence, we approach God "by faith" (Heb. 11: 6, Gen. 1: 1). However, there is scientific proof that God exists (not to exclude faith): a case in point being creation implies a Creator. Let us now notice some revealing truths about God from science itself.
Biogenesis – attests to life begets life. This may sound shocking to some but true science rejects the hypothesis that "life came from nothingness." The scientific law of biogenesis requires life begetting life. According to the Genesis’ account of creation, God was the present and active force behind all creation (Gen. 1: 3, 6, 9, 11, 14, 20, 24, 26, 29). Notice the repeated occurrence of "and God said…." The particulars and sequence of the Genesis’ account agrees with established science. Thus, all who subscribe to the tenets of Darwinian evolution (life came from nothingness) are not scientific.
Paleontology – witnesses the validity of the Genesis’ account. When we refer to paleontology we are alluding to the fossil record. If some were not so closed minded, they would appreciate that the biblical account of creation and the science of paleontology are in harmony. For instance, there is a mixture of the simple and the complex (Gen. 1: 1, 2 "without form," 3-25, and earth with all the complexities, consummating in man, vss. 21, 27).
In the account of creation, life suddenly appears, fully formed (Gen. 1: 20, 21, 24, 27, 28). Paleontology also teaches the sudden introduction of mature life. There is no intimation of gradation, either in Genesis or the fossil record. Life was created mature and ready to reproduce (ibid.).
In this same vein, the record in Genesis explains why there are no transitional forms (a tadpole developing into man, i.e., all the progressive developmental stages...). The fossil record also presents evidence consistent with Genesis – no transitional forms.
Just think how the Genesis’ flood would have and did impact the fossil record (Gen. 7; 8). You would have universal fossil evidence of life forms being suddenly fossilized, often in stratum of dense mud, rock, and/or ice. Paleontology reveals fossil facts that are consistent and corresponding to the effects of the Genesis’ flood. Indeed, there is undeniable paleontological evidence of severe geological, atmospheric, and hydrological changes to the earth – just as would have been produced by such a great catastrophe as the flood described in Genesis chapters seven and eight.
Thermodynamics – a running down process. In common parlance, science indicates the universe did not evolve and continue to improve, but rather the converse. To advance organic evolution is to contradict this scientific second law of thermodynamics. The truth of the Bible is that there is a "running down" of the universe (Heb. 1: 10-12).
The law of genetics – informs us of order. There is order and perpetuity of life in the biblical account of creation. Notice how each was to produce "after their own kind" (Gen. 1: 11, 21, 25). Science does not identify God, but it does necessarily imply God. A man, any man, or group of men, would have been totally beyond known contemporary science, irreconcilably beyond, I might add, (contemporary to the writing of Genesis) in setting forth all the creation information resident in the Genesis’ account. To believe that fallible man could have been responsible for the Genesis’ record is unimaginably ludicrous!
Intelligent reader, biogenesis tells us life begets life, paleontology confirms the account in Genesis, thermodynamics points to creation rather than organic evolution, and the science of genetics reveals some of the complexities and order of the introduction of life and its propagation.
True science reveals the reality of God, but the Bible alone reveals the "person" of God the Creator and his will (see "The Godhead" in Great Truths and also "The Truth About Man," in Archives).
I know who we need: where is Templares when we need him. He makes an effort to explain away my posts on creation and evolution.
Still waiting for an erudite and scholarly reply to this post.
Originally posted by Draco69
I personally believe in a bit of both. The universe can be broken down in to rational mathematics. Like Einstein said, for every clock there is a clockmaker.Evolution could just be a tool of God.
(Game show buzzer sounds: genckt, genckt, wrong answer.) Evolution and God are diametrically opposed. They do not coexist. God has declared by His Word how He created the Heavens (i.e. space, atmosphere) and the earth: by His words.
As far as mechanics here is how God did it:
Hebrews 11:3
By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.
Psalm 33:6
By the word of the LORD the heavens were made, And all the host of them by the breath of His mouth.
God speaks and things "be" "exist" or "come into being." That explains why there are no transitional fossil forms. All life came into being suddenly or instantaneously.
More examples of God speaking things into existence:
Genesis 1:3
Then God said,“Let there be light”; and there was light.
Genesis 1:6
Then God said, “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.”
Genesis 1:9 Then God said , “ Let the waters under the heavens be gathered together into one place, and let the dry land appear”; and it was so.
Genesis 1:11
Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb that yields seed, and the fruit tree that yields fruit according to its kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth”; and it was so.
Genesis 1:14
Then God said, “Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days and years;
Genesis 1:20
Then God said, “Let the waters abound with an abundance of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the face of the firmament of the heavens.”
Genesis 1:24
Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth the living creature according to its kind: cattle and creeping thing and beast of the earth, each according to its kind”; and it was so.
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
(Game show buzzer sounds: genckt, genckt, wrong answer.) Evolution and God are diametrically opposed. They do not coexist. God has declared by His Word how He created the Heavens (i.e. space, atmosphere) and the earth: by His words.As far as mechanics here is how God did it:
[B]Hebrews 11:3
By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.Psalm 33:6
By the word of the LORD the heavens were made, And all the host of them by the breath of His mouth.God speaks and things "be" "exist" or "come into being." That explains why there are no transitional fossil forms. All life came into being suddenly or instantaneously.
More examples of God speaking things into existence:
Genesis 1:3
Then God said,“Let there be light”; and there was light.Genesis 1:6
Then God said, “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.”Genesis 1:9 Then God said , “ Let the waters under the heavens be gathered together into one place, and let the dry land appear”; and it was so.
Genesis 1:11
Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb that yields seed, and the fruit tree that yields fruit according to its kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth”; and it was so.Genesis 1:14
Then God said, “Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days and years;Genesis 1:20
Then God said, “Let the waters abound with an abundance of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the face of the firmament of the heavens.”Genesis 1:24
Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth the living creature according to its kind: cattle and creeping thing and beast of the earth, each according to its kind”; and it was so. [/B]
And if God created Evolution, it would also be by Gods words, fancy how it can work both ways eh? Open up your mind just a crack man, realize that what you're basing all your faith on is a book written by people and therefore subject to peoples flaws (which are many). Do you seriously think that Torah and the Bible for that matter haven't changed with each new rendition through the eons?
Originally posted by Robtard
And if God created Evolution, it would also be by Gods words, fancy how it can work both ways eh? Open up your mind just a crack man, realize that what you're basing all your faith on is a book written by people and therefore subject to peoples flaws (which are many). Do you seriously think that Torah and the Bible for that matter haven't changed with each new rendition through the eons?
Rob. if you asked me how I came up with the solution for a math problem (not how many different ways that I could have gotten the answer) and I tell you that I got the answer by addition, would it make sense to say that I could have gotten the answer by doing it another way? No it doesn't make any sense. Listen, I said that if you asked me how I came up with the answer (not how many different ways there are of finding the answer). If my response to you is that I added, then my reply has in fact answered your question. There is no need to state that I could have done it another way because I haved just answered your question.
Conversly, if you asked me how many different ways could I have come up with the answer, now I can elaborate. I can tell you all of the various ways that I could have gotten my answer.
I said all that to say this: God has revealed to us how He created matter, space, time, and life. He did it by speaking. There is no reason to say that He could have done it another way. That is conspicuously obvious, but the fact is He didn't do it any other way. He chose to do it through speaking not evolution. When God spoke it was done. Evolution is based on the premise that things "evolve" over eons of time. It does not take God eons to create the universe and earth. It took God only six days. He could have done it sooner.
Clear thinking, rational people don't read about how someone has done something and then come to a conclusion that that person did it another way. Still don't understand then re-read this post.