90 Minutes in Heaven

Started by Robtard27 pages
Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Validate your claim that life after death without suffering brain damage is impossible.

People have died and they have been brought back to life, but they are usually only dead for a few minutes at most, people that are dead for longer than 15 minutes and are brought back to life have brain damage in varying degrees depending on how long their brain was oxygen deprived. My fathers best friend's infant son suffered S.I.D.S. at 5 months old, the child was without oxygen for roughly 15-20 minutes, the child was brought back to life but due to the 15+ minutes of oxygen depletion, the child has almost zero control of his legs and will require a wheelchair for the rest of his life; the child is age 17 now and still in a wheelchair. If you need further validation, go look it up in a certifified medical journal, you shall find it. Brain [-] oxygen [x] time = brain damage, that is a fact.

Originally posted by Robtard
People have died and they have been brought back to life, but they are usually only dead for a few minutes at most, people that are dead for longer than 15 minutes and are brought back to life have brain damage in varying degrees depending on how long their brain was oxygen deprived. My fathers best friend's infant son suffered S.I.D.S. at 5 months old, the child was without oxygen for roughly 15-20 minutes, the child was brought back to life but due to the 15+ minutes of oxygen depletion, the child has almost zero control of his legs and will require a wheelchair for the rest of his life; the child is age 17 now and still in a wheelchair. If you need further validation, go look it up in a certifified medical journal, you shall find it. Brain [-] oxygen [x] time = brain damage, that is a fact.
Originally posted by Robtard
Well of course a guy selling a book telling about dead the afterlife and coming back is going to say how he miraculously died and came back to life without brain damage, just like a door to door sales man is going to tell you his product is superior to his competitors product. I'd like an actual doctor to explain away this 'miracle'.

Like I said, you have not listened to the "free" link where Don vividly describes his instaneous death at the hands of an eighteen-wheeler. The man was gruesomely killed. His left arm and leg severed. Blood oozed out of Don's eyes, nose, and ears. There were several eyewitnesses to this true account that occurred on a road that traversed a man-made lake. Don's tragic accident occurred in a rural county, as a result Don's deceased body was to be transported to a mortuary instead of a coronary. But the EMTs had to wait for a Justice of Peace to officially declare Don deceased. While they were waiting for this a pastor and his wife (who had attended the same religious conference as Don, who was also one of the speakers, were traveling along the same road. The couple encountered several cars on this two-lane road that was backed up for miles. The pastor affirmed that he heard the audible voice of God say to him,

“pray for the man in the red car."

The pastor did not personally know Don. The pastor proceeded to walk towards the accident when he was met by the authorities. The pastor tried several times to go over to Don (who was clinically dead) so that he could do as God had instructed him, but the authorities tried a number of times to dissuade him because of the severity of Don’s condition (it was a gruesome sight) and the fact that Don was dead (based on their own testimony). Don had broken nearly every bone in his body. The pastor prayed (as God had directed him) that Don would not suffer any head injuries and no internal injuries. Don’s chest had been impaled by the steering wheel, his right leg crushed, his left leg had been severed and lying on the floor of the car. His left arm was in the back seat. It was such a horrible sight that the authorities tried to prevent the pastor from seein it. It had been raining that day so the authorities covered Don's deceased body with a tarp.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Let me use your rationale as to why this doesn't happen to everyone. First of all, you have no evidence that it does not happen to "everyone." Now let me proceed. Why doesn't everyone walk on water (the only record that we have is Jesus and Peter who have done this). Why don't all people win the Lottery? Why don't all people get straight A's in school? Why aren't all people tall, short, good-looking etc.? Why aren't all people celebrities? Why did Jesus invariably select Peter, James, and John, instead of all twelve of His disciples for certain situations? So, I think you get the idea. You know you would have to ask God. I believe (and that is all it is my "belief"😉 is that God permits certain people to experience spiritual things, Hell, and Heaven so that they can attest to their existence (respectively).

Death occurs to everyone. The afterlife occurs with everyone. However, I suppose this is similar to how people were chosen for "divine inspiration" of the writings of the Bible.

Originally posted by FeceMan
The afterlife occurs with everyone.

Really, I wasn't aware.

Originally posted by FeceMan
Death occurs to everyone. The afterlife occurs with everyone. However, I suppose this is similar to how people were chosen for "divine inspiration" of the writings of the Bible.

I see the analogy, but no it is not the same.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Like I said, you have not listened to the "free" link where Don vividly describes his instaneous death at the hands of an eighteen-wheeler. The man was gruesomely killed. His left arm and leg severed. Blood oozed out of Don's mouth, eyes, nose, and ears. There were several eyewitnesses to this true account that occurred on a road that traversed a man-made lake. Don's tragic accident occurred in a rural county, as a result Don's deceased body was to be transported to mortuary instead of a coronary. But the EMTs had to wait for a Justice of Peace to officially declare Don deceased. While they were waiting for this a pastor and his wife (who had attended the same religious conference as Don, who was also one of the speakers, were traveling along the same road. The couple encountered several cars on this two-lane road that was backed up for several yards. The pastor affirmed that he heard the audible voice of God say to him, “pray for the man in the red car. The pastor did not personally know Don. The pastor proceeded to walk towards the accident when he was met by the authorities. The pastor tried several times to go over to Don (who was clinically dead) so that he could do as God had instructed him, but the authorities tried a number of times to dissuade him because of the severity of Don’s condition (it was a gruesome sight) and the fact that Don was dead (based on their own testimony). Don had broken nearly every bone in his body. The pastor prayed (as God had directed him) that Don would not suffer any head injuries and no internal injuries. Don’s chest had been impaled by the steering wheel, his right leg crushed, his left leg had been severed and lying on the floor of the car. His left arm was in the back seat. It was such a horrible sight that the authorities tried to prevent the pastor from seein it. It had been raining that day so the authorities covered Don's deceased body with a tarp.

Hallelujah! Either God actually intervened and saved Don's brain from 90 minutes of oxygen depletion (requires faith here) OR Don wasn't actually dead even after suffering those massive injuries. People have suffered those types of injuries and not died, or they were kept on life support (brain still receiving oxygen) until they could be patched up. Any chance of Don suffering hypothermia too? That can extend the brain damage setting in, in some rare cases.

Don had several people who were praying for him (several churches inside and out of the country). The nine wheels of the eighteen-wheeler rolled directly over Don's litte, Ford Escort, crushing it completely. The roof of Don's car came down on Don's head crushing it. Don's condition was exceedingly gory. The pastor continues to pray for Don's deceased, bloodstained, broken, dismembered body (or rather limbs) until suddenly Don's spirit and soul are returned to his body. The pastor (who happen to sing as well) had been singing and praying fervently, and earnestly for Don's dead body to revive by God's power. The pastor (who at the moment was still praying with his hand on Don's bloody shoulder) quickly exited the car after Don (who had been deceased) began to sing. The pastor approaced the EMTs and authorities to go in and see for themselves that Don was singing and he was alive. The authorites and EMT personnel refused to do this (they knew Don was dead) and so they continued to wait for the Justice of Peace to arrive so that he could certify Don's death. Not only did the authorites and EMT not believe the pastor but they condescendingly assured him that there was no possible way that Don could be alive because they had viewed his deceased body. The pastor threatened to lay across the road to keep them from leaving without Don (who was now alive by God's power via the prayers of thousands of people). Finally, 6 hours later Don is at the trauma center being stabilized. After numerous tests (CATSCANS, MRIs) the doctors could not find any trace of the internal injuries and head injuries that Don had sustained. (Remember: the pastor affirmed that God told him to pray for the man in the red car. So the pastor prayed that Don would suffer no internal injuries or head injuries.)

Originally posted by Robtard
Hallelujah! Either God actually intervened and saved Don's brain from 90 minutes of oxygen depletion (requires faith here) OR Don wasn't actually dead even after suffering those massive injuries. People have suffered those types of injuries and not died, or they were kept on life support (brain still receiving oxygen) until they could be patched up. Any chance of Don suffering hypothermia too? That can extend the brain damage setting in, in some rare cases.

God is the reason why Don is alive today telling his true account. There is no other explanation.

Clinical death is usually defined as the medical state in which it is impossible to revive a person with any technology at medicine's disposal, in essence the complete and irreversible cessation of all body functions. Despite the fact that the body continues to live in cases of brain death, it is also seen as a valid definition of clinical death by almost all medical establishments.

In relation to emergency medical care, clinical death occurs when the patient's heartbeat and breathing have stopped. The reversal of this state is possible through CPR, Epinephrine injection, and other treatments.

I thought JIA left the KMC forums...

Originally posted by crazy
I thought JIA left the KMC forums...

Oh, yeah, peace out.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive

God is the reason why Don is alive today telling his true account. There is no other explanation.

Clinical death is usually defined as the medical state in which it is impossible to revive a person with any technology at medicine's disposal, in essence the complete and irreversible cessation of all body functions. Despite the fact that the body continues to live in cases of brain death, it is also seen as a valid definition of clinical death by almost all medical establishments.

In relation to emergency medical care, clinical death occurs when the patient's heartbeat and breathing have stopped. The reversal of this state is possible through CPR, Epinephrine injection, and other treatments.

Anothr possible explanation, the story is completely false and this Don is just trying to make a quick dollar from peoples desperate need to justify their belief in God, or the story isn't told in complete truth and certain facts were left out or embelished.

Clinical Death isn't the end all be all... After 5-6 mins of clinical death, resuscitation is still possible but difficult if the body temperature is still normal. Even after 15 mins resuscitation is possible, but it is more difficult and brain damage or even brain death is likely...

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Don had several people who were praying for him (several churches inside and out of the country). The nine wheels of the eighteen-wheeler rolled directly over Don's litte, Ford Escort, crushing it completely. The roof of Don's car came down on Don's head crushing it. Don's condition was exceedingly gory. The pastor continues to pray for Don's deceased, bloodstained, broken, dismembered body (or rather limbs) until suddenly Don's spirit and soul are returned to his body. The pastor (who happen to sing as well) had been singing and praying fervently, and earnestly for Don's dead body to revive by God's power. The pastor (who at the moment was still praying with his hand on Don's bloody shoulder) quickly exited the car after Don (who had been deceased) began to sing. The pastor approaced the EMTs and authorities to go in and see for themselves that Don was singing and he was alive. The authorites and EMT personnel refused to do this (they knew Don was dead) and so they continued to wait for the Justice of Peace to arrive so that he could certify Don's death. Not only did the authorites and EMT not believe the pastor but they condescendingly assured him that there was no possible way that Don could be alive because they had viewed his deceased body. The pastor threatened to lay across the road to keep them from leaving without Don (who was now alive by God's power via the prayers of thousands of people). Finally, 6 hours later Don is at the trauma center being stabilized. After numerous tests (CATSCANS, MRIs) the doctors could not find any trace of the internal injuries and head injuries that Don had sustained. (Remember: the pastor affirmed that God told him to pray for the man in the red car. So the pastor prayed that Don would suffer no internal injuries or head injuries.)

So after having his arm and leg severd, having his chest pierced by the steering wheel, having nearly every bone smashed and lying dead on the cold ground (assuming it was cold since it was raining) bleeding profusely for 90 minutes, Don wakes up and starts to sing? That definately takes faith to believe in nonsense like that.

Originally posted by Robtard
Clinical Death isn't the end all be all... After 5-6 mins of clinical death, resuscitation is still possible but difficult if the body temperature is still normal. Even after 15 mins resuscitation is possible, but it is more difficult and brain damage or even brain death is likely...

But Don had been dead for 90 minutes. The entire time that Don's body was in the car being prayed over, Don vividly describes that his spirit and soul were in Heaven, surrounded by loved ones. Don was immediately met by a friend who had died in high school. Don relates that he heard the wings of angels above his head as though they were ministering to him. Behind his loved ones Don cites seeing a huge, looming gate of luminous, glowing pearl (almost alive). Don says that beyond that was the brightest light that he had ever seen. Don did not know how anyone could survive looking at that light. Don says that he saw colors that do not exist here on earth. Don saw the sidewalks of transparent gold (gold is transparent it only looks brownish-yellow because of an impurity).

Originally posted by Robtard
So after having his arm and leg severd, having his chest pierced by the steering wheel, having nearly every bone smashed and lying dead on the cold ground (assuming it was cold since it was raining) bleeding profusely for 90 minutes, Don wakes up and starts to sing? That definately takes faith to believe in nonsense like that.

No, Don's deceased body was still inside the car, under the tarp. You have left out the important details that culminate in Don's resuscitation. The way that you described is not complete in terms of how Don came to be revived from death.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
But Don had been dead for 90 minutes. The entire time that Don's body was in the car being prayed over, Don vividly describes that his spirit and soul were in Heaven, surrounded by loved ones. Don was immediately met by a friend who had died in high school. Don relates that he heard the wings of angels above his head as though they were ministering to him. Behind his loved ones Don cites seeing a huge, looming gate of luminous, glowing pearl (almost alive). Don says that beyond that was the brightest light that he had ever seen. Don did not know how anyone could survive looking at that light. Don says that he saw colors that do not exist here on earth. Don saw the sidewalks of transparent gold (gold is transparent it only looks brownish-yellow because of an impurity).

Exactly, I question the 'fact' that Don was actully dead for 90 minutes, the more you post of the story, the more I question it. With every passage it gets more and more improbable. How Don describes heaven is your typical 'candy bait' view of heaven religious people like to temp people with, "glowing pearl", "brightest light", "colors that do not exist here on earth" and "sidewalks of transparent gold" all said to coerce people.

Originally posted by Robtard
Exactly, I question the 'fact' that Don was actully dead for 90 minutes, the more you post of the story, the more I question it. With every passage it gets more and more improbable. How Don describes heaven is your typical 'candy bait' view of heaven religious people like to temp people with, "glowing pearl", "brightest light", "colors that do not exist here on earth" and "sidewalks of transparent gold" all said to coerce people.

There were several eyewitnesses, the EMTs (people who have undergone countless hours of preparation, training, and study to provide emergency medical care) concluded that Don was indeed dead. There were originally four ambulances to treat other people who sufferred minor injuries. But three of those ambulances left. The EMTs and other authorities were simply waiting for the Justice of Peace to arrive to give the official pronouncement of Don's decease. So, yes, you are correct in saying that God intervened.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
There were several eyewitnesses, the EMTs (people who have undergone countless hours of preparation, training, and study to provide emergency medical care) concluded that Don was indeed dead. There were originally four ambulances to treat other people who sufferred minor injuries. But three of those ambulances left. The EMTs and other authorities were simply waiting for the Justice of Peace to arrive to give the official pronouncement of Don's decease. So, yes, you are correct in saying that God intervened.

Dude, besides the obvious improbabilities in the story which I question is authentic to begin with... It speaks of God speaking to a man and God bringing a guy back to life after doing a 90 minute drive by in heaven. As Yoda would say, 'Lunacy, it is.'

Don Piper's True Account

Don Piper was relieved when the pastor's conference he had been attending finished a little early that Wednesday in January 1989. Being associate pastor and having just been appointed minister of education at a Houston area church, Don was a busy man. The early start home would provide him much needed time to mentally organize his hectic schedule.
"I was thinking about that night and also that I was going to be preaching that next Sunday morning in three services," Don remembers.

Little did Don know he would be late for the service that night--not just by minutes or hours, but by months--and before he got home, he would take a detour he would never forget.

Within minutes of leaving the retreat center, Don drove onto a bridge spanning a lake. It was a fairly long bridge and there was water on both sides of the elevated highway.

Recalling the scene, Don says, "I approached the end of the bridge, and before I reached the end, a tractor-trailer truck owned by the Texas Dept. of Corrections crossed the center stripe and hit my car head on."

Not only did the truck hit Don's car, it ran over the passenger side of the small Ford Escort, completely crushing the vehicle and killing Don Piper. Instantly, Don began an amazing journey.

"When I was killed, I was instantly transported to heaven's gate," he says. "It was an instantaneous thing."

Don found himself standing in front of a divine portal, surrounded by familiar faces.

"I did not see a single person that I did not know," he says. "They were relatives, they were friends that died in high school, they were teachers--they were people I had seen and known all my life who had gone to glory. They were smiling; they were embracing me; they were welcoming me' they were in the process of taking me through the gate of heaven."

Looking over the heads of his friends, Don saw a looming pearl gate.

"The gate of heaven was a magnificent edifice, the one that I saw. It looked no less like a giant gate that had been sculpted from mother-of-pearl," Don explains.

Peering through the gate, Don saw an incredible light.

"Behind that portal was such a light that I don't conceive of how you could see it in an earthly body. It could only be envisioned in a heavenly body because it was too bright."

And, says Don, there was music, that of a literal, angelic choir.

"In all honesty, as awesome as the sight was, the sound was more amazing," he says. "I heard literally thousands of praise songs. They were all praise songs. I really couldn't see anything. I was so preoccupied with the people around me, I couldn't see anything. But you could sense this hum of wings hovering all about you, like you were being ministered to by angels, and they were observing this whole episode."

While Don stood at the gates of heaven, pastor Dick Onarecker of Klein, Texas, stood on a Texas highway by Don's lifeless body. He had also attended the pastor's conference. He came upon the accident moments after it happened. The EMS personnel had told him that Don was dead.

"It was as though I was compelled to stop and to pray for him. The Lord had just impressed on me very emphatically, very urgently that I was to pray for him," says Dick. "I walked over by the door. There was great physical damage on the outside. I laid my hands on him and began to pray for him."

As soon as Don's journey began, it ended. Don found himself back in his crushed vehicle, staring up at a tarp that had been thrown over him by medical attendants.

Says Don, "The first conscious memory was 'What a Friend we have in Jesus.' I was singing. I was thinking to myself, Why am I singing this song? I'm in the dark, and I knew it was about noon time when the accident happened. I'm in the dark, I'm singing, and I'm holding a hand. I'm thinking to myself, What on earth is happening?"

Dick had begun singing hymns to Don.

"The Lord impressed on me not only to pray for him but that there would be no internal injuries and that there would be no head injuries. Then, I began to sing, and I to heard him singing with me," says Dick.

Don was transported to Herman Hospital in Houston. Miraculously, he suffered no head or internal injuries. However, virtually every bone in Don's body was either broken or shattered.

His left arm and left leg were completely severed, and had to be rebuilt and replaced. Looking at his battered and pain-seared body, this man who had touched heaven's gates wanted to go back.

"My mindset was having now been able to see what the matter with me was, and to know how beautiful heaven was, to want to be there again. As much as I loved these people that I was with, I was so confident of their salvation experiences that I knew they would join me sometime in the future," Don says.

But the prayers and love of family and friends pulled Don through four months of intensive therapy, numerous operations, and infections that on two occasions almost claimed his life.

"I like to say that I came back by popular demand," he says. "People prayed me back from the gates of heaven. People prayed me back from death's door. I'm here because people asked God for me to be here."

Still don't believe? Well, it is all documented.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
[b]Don Piper's True Account

Don Piper was relieved when the pastor's conference he had been attending finished a little early that Wednesday in January 1989. Being associate pastor and having just been appointed minister of education at a Houston area church, Don was a busy man. The early start home would provide him much needed time to mentally organize his hectic schedule.
"I was thinking about that night and also that I was going to be preaching that next Sunday morning in three services," Don remembers.

Little did Don know he would be late for the service that night--not just by minutes or hours, but by months--and before he got home, he would take a detour he would never forget.

Within minutes of leaving the retreat center, Don drove onto a bridge spanning a lake. It was a fairly long bridge and there was water on both sides of the elevated highway.

Recalling the scene, Don says, "I approached the end of the bridge, and before I reached the end, a tractor-trailer truck owned by the Texas Dept. of Corrections crossed the center stripe and hit my car head on."

Not only did the truck hit Don's car, it ran over the passenger side of the small Ford Escort, completely crushing the vehicle and killing Don Piper. Instantly, Don began an amazing journey.

"When I was killed, I was instantly transported to heaven's gate," he says. "It was an instantaneous thing."

Don found himself standing in front of a divine portal, surrounded by familiar faces.

"I did not see a single person that I did not know," he says. "They were relatives, they were friends that died in high school, they were teachers--they were people I had seen and known all my life who had gone to glory. They were smiling; they were embracing me; they were welcoming me' they were in the process of taking me through the gate of heaven."

Looking over the heads of his friends, Don saw a looming pearl gate.

"The gate of heaven was a magnificent edifice, the one that I saw. It looked no less like a giant gate that had been sculpted from mother-of-pearl," Don explains.

Peering through the gate, Don saw an incredible light.

"Behind that portal was such a light that I don't conceive of how you could see it in an earthly body. It could only be envisioned in a heavenly body because it was too bright."

And, says Don, there was music, that of a literal, angelic choir.

"In all honesty, as awesome as the sight was, the sound was more amazing," he says. "I heard literally thousands of praise songs. They were all praise songs. I really couldn't see anything. I was so preoccupied with the people around me, I couldn't see anything. But you could sense this hum of wings hovering all about you, like you were being ministered to by angels, and they were observing this whole episode."

While Don stood at the gates of heaven, pastor Dick Onarecker of Klein, Texas, stood on a Texas highway by Don's lifeless body. He had also attended the pastor's conference. He came upon the accident moments after it happened. The EMS personnel had told him that Don was dead.

"It was as though I was compelled to stop and to pray for him. The Lord had just impressed on me very emphatically, very urgently that I was to pray for him," says Dick. "I walked over by the door. There was great physical damage on the outside. I laid my hands on him and began to pray for him."

As soon as Don's journey began, it ended. Don found himself back in his crushed vehicle, staring up at a tarp that had been thrown over him by medical attendants.

Says Don, "The first conscious memory was 'What a Friend we have in Jesus.' I was singing. I was thinking to myself, Why am I singing this song? I'm in the dark, and I knew it was about noon time when the accident happened. I'm in the dark, I'm singing, and I'm holding a hand. I'm thinking to myself, What on earth is happening?"

Dick had begun singing hymns to Don.

"The Lord impressed on me not only to pray for him but that there would be no internal injuries and that there would be no head injuries. Then, I began to sing, and I to heard him singing with me," says Dick.

Don was transported to Herman Hospital in Houston. Miraculously, he suffered no head or internal injuries. However, virtually every bone in Don's body was either broken or shattered.

His left arm and left leg were completely severed, and had to be rebuilt and replaced. Looking at his battered and pain-seared body, this man who had touched heaven's gates wanted to go back.

"My mindset was having now been able to see what the matter with me was, and to know how beautiful heaven was, to want to be there again. As much as I loved these people that I was with, I was so confident of their salvation experiences that I knew they would join me sometime in the future," Don says.

But the prayers and love of family and friends pulled Don through four months of intensive therapy, numerous operations, and infections that on two occasions almost claimed his life.

"I like to say that I came back by popular demand," he says. "People prayed me back from the gates of heaven. People prayed me back from death's door. I'm here because people asked God for me to be here." [/B]

Would it be to much to ask to see the medical and police reports?