Originally posted by sithsaber408
From a Christian perspective, children can indeed have an enormous effect on things, and should not be relegated to the backround.It was young David, at age 12 who defeated a giant named Goliath when the whole army of Israel could not.
Which was the logic behind the children's crusade. And we all know how that ended.
Jesus himself wanted the children to come to him and learn his teachings along with the adults.
As odd as it sounds I think kids should be allowed to wait till they are old enough to decide for themselves - usually about 9 or 10.
There is a fine line between "teaching as equals" and "indoctrinating so they are like us."
I cannot in good conscience however, condone the idea that these kids should be ready to "lay down their lives like the muslim kids do" garbage that the lady is preaching.
Some Muslim kids. Not Muslim kids in general. But pleased to see you agree - it is flat out wrong.
Everything else, like the showing of a plastic fetus in a talk about abortion, to questioning the theory of evolution, to telling them to pray for leaders and the president is fine, but should be much more toned down and generalized.
Toned down? The abortion debate should be put on hiatus completely. Some Christians get upset at a kids book in a library because of the single line "This is Jim and his two dads" yet feel perfectly happy flashing around plastic foetus. I mean jeeze.
We never get into that kind of stuff with our kids, aged 1st grade through 6th.
For good reason.
(mostly I do puppet skits and make a fool of myself in a large dog costume.) 😛
Kinky. (Sorry, couldn't help myself.)
The hard-hitting kind of lessons that are going on here would be better suited to young Christian teens, at ages 14 or 15, about to enter public high schools.
15 I believe might be putting it on hold a bit long though. Education is important, and it can be detrimental to be ignorant of normal, acceptable things, or things in general. Kids are curious. They will seek out knowledge from other places if it is not provided by teachers or parents - which can be worse.
Education is better then hoping they wont want to know before the age of 15.
Even democrats, since no leader "sneaks in" but is allowed by God for a purpose. I know many Christians who had to release their personal pride to pray for President Clinton, and were right to do so. 😛
Even democrats? Is there some reason why people might not want to pray for a democrat? Some of them are actually religious after all. Though usually more liberal.
Lastly, parents have a right to teach their children however they want to.
To a degree - however if the teaching is harmful or has potential negative social results it is debatable whether that should be given a green light.
Just as any other parents, they will be held accountable for how that affects them.
Except God, who isn't accountable for anything when it comes to humanity.
As for the "culture war" of secularists v.s. the "Christian army"....These liberal reviewers are right. It's indeed coming. No need to involve the kids. When you see the ten million man march of Christians on Washington, and see the peacefull demonstrations and raw power of that many men worshipping almighty God at once, and demanding a return to decency, morals, and TRUTH, then you'll see who you are really up against.
Highly unlikely it would come down to that.
1st - Christianity is a religion in decline
2nd - Christians can't agree on anything. Maybe it they stopped going on about how "my belief is right and your's is wrong" they might have a chance.
3rd - What is decent, moral and true? You can bet you bottom dollar it differs for person to person.
The secularist vs. religious fundamentalism is what is more being alluded to. Not peaceful demonstrations - but rather increasingly fanatical opinion. I'd be prepared to stake the farm on there being no peaceful gathering of 10 million Christians in this life time.
Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Which was the logic behind the children's crusade. And we all know how that ended.As odd as it sounds I think kids should be allowed to wait till they are old enough to decide for themselves - usually about 9 or 10.
There is a fine line between "teaching as equals" and "indoctrinating so they are like us."
Some Muslim kids. Not Muslim kids in general. But pleased to see you agree - it is flat out wrong.
Toned down? The abortion debate should be put on hiatus completely. Some Christians get upset at a kids book in a library because of the single line "This is Jim and his two dads" yet feel perfectly happy flashing around plastic foetus. I mean jeeze.
For good reason.
Kinky. (Sorry, couldn't help myself.)
15 I believe might be putting it on hold a bit long though. Education is important, and it can be detrimental to be ignorant of normal, acceptable things, or things in general. Kids are curious. They will seek out knowledge from other places if it is not provided by teachers or parents - which can be worse.
Education is better then hoping they wont want to know before the age of 15.
Even democrats? Is there some reason why people might not want to pray for a democrat? Some of them are actually religious after all. Though usually more liberal.
To a degree - however if the teaching is harmful or has potential negative social results it is debatable whether that should be given a green light.
Except God, who isn't accountable for anything when it comes to humanity.
Highly unlikely it would come down to that.
1st - Christianity is a religion in decline
2nd - Christians can't agree on anything. Maybe it they stopped going on about how "my belief is right and your's is wrong" they might have a chance.
3rd - What is decent, moral and true? You can bet you bottom dollar it differs for person to person.
The secularist vs. religious fundamentalism is what is more being alluded to. Not peaceful demonstrations - but rather increasingly fanatical opinion. I'd be prepared to stake the farm on there being no peaceful gathering of 10 million Christians in this life time.
Imperial Samurai, I just want to say thanks.
That was the first open, intelligent, and considerate response to my post, which in effect said "I'm a sunday school worker, and this movie is out of wack. I support her ideals, but not her methods, and certainly not her messages."
Everyone else is squawking about Christian militas and wanting to buy handguns. 🙁
Nobody is talking about an acutal "culture War" with killing, that's ridiculous, just as you posted.
I wasn't saying there would be physical fighting or anything, just a confrontation of ideals: Secular America and Christian America.
As for the gathering, they already had close to a million men in Washington before at a Promise Keepers event a few years ago.
I just went to one in Arco Arena, in Sacramento over the weekend, with around 10,000 Christian men.
It was pretty peaceful. We heard some good preaching and worshiped the Lord in song.
If such events are held peacefully all throughout the country, why would it be hard for all the men from all the meetings to have one BIG meeting in Washington?
Also, with 100 million people in america identifiying themselves as Christians, with missionaries in every country around the world (my church alone has people in India, Haiti, Japan, and Trinidad. My boss at work is currently on a missions trip to Uganda.) , and as the film Jesus Camp itself says, 1 or 2 new churches opening every day how can you call Christianity a religion in decline?
It is certainly under attack, but in these troubled times, people are more and more often seeking a comfort from God, whomever that may be to them.
I plan of seeing Jesus Camp sometime this week, I'll let you know about it after... If anyone is interested in seeing a truly scary yet comical Christian film, rent "Hell House", it is a documentary were Christians put together a Fun/Horror house about sins like homosexuality, being a non-Christian, reading Harry Potter etc. and they act out scenarios were people die and either go to heaven or hell based on if they belive in Jesus or not. If you're interested in seeing religious brainwashing in America, rent this movie.
Originally posted by Robtard😱
I plan of seeing Jesus Camp sometime this week, I'll let you know about it after... If anyone is interested in seeing a truly scary yet comical Christian film, rent "Hell House", it is a documentary were Christians put together a Fun/Horror house about sins like homosexuality, being a non-Christian, reading Harry Potter etc. and they act out scenarios were people die and either go to heaven or hell based on if they belive in Jesus or not. If you're interested in seeing religious brainwashing in America, rent this movie.
Originally posted by Robtard
I plan of seeing Jesus Camp sometime this week, I'll let you know about it after... If anyone is interested in seeing a truly scary yet comical Christian film, rent "Hell House", it is a documentary were Christians put together a Fun/Horror house about sins like homosexuality, being a non-Christian, reading Harry Potter etc. and they act out scenarios were people die and either go to heaven or hell based on if they belive in Jesus or not. If you're interested in seeing religious brainwashing in America, rent this movie.
😱
Originally posted by Robtard
I plan of seeing Jesus Camp sometime this week, I'll let you know about it after... If anyone is interested in seeing a truly scary yet comical Christian film, rent "Hell House", it is a documentary were Christians put together a Fun/Horror house about sins like homosexuality, being a non-Christian, reading Harry Potter etc. and they act out scenarios were people die and either go to heaven or hell based on if they belive in Jesus or not. If you're interested in seeing religious brainwashing in America, rent this movie.
Wait... they do it to each other? Or do they go out and grab people of the street and in a weird German social experiment kind of way do it to them?
Also, with 100 million people in america identifiying themselves as Christians, with missionaries in every country around the world (my church alone has people in India, Haiti, Japan, and Trinidad. My boss at work is currently on a missions trip to Uganda.) , and as the film Jesus Camp itself says, 1 or 2 new churches opening every day how can you call Christianity a religion in decline?It is certainly under attack, but in these troubled times, people are more and more often seeking a comfort from God, whomever that may be to them.
Yes I do say it is in decline. Numbers of conversions in western nations are dropping, Church attendance is down - the big Christian sects/denominations are loosing followers to the more energetic evangelical Church, or to the more liberal ones.
The only places Christian numbers are really booming are in places of suffering and need - Africa, South America.
wasn't saying there would be physical fighting or anything, just a confrontation of ideals: Secular America and Christian America.
I know what you are saying - but I don't see any likelihood in 10 million American Christians gathering on the streets of Washington. Or Sydney or London of whatever. It would be one of the biggest protests ever - but I am yet to see anything approaching cohesion among enough Christian groups to get together and do it.
They differ to much. Have different ideas on what is right and wrong. Liberal Christian vs. conservative Christian.
Effectively, this mother will propagate her skewed viewpoint through her children- children, who shall never know how it feels to weigh evidence, consult one's own moral nature, and make a informed decision on their own. Sounds like though control to me.
Even though im a catholic, this is alittle to extreme. This is really not a good look for us. I dont only mean christians, but theres other religions that can be this extreme.
the movie looks disturbing. It shows how the religions we thought were normal are now turning into cults. The children are so brainwashed that when the woman running the camp declared war on the government, the kids yelled with her and said they would give their lives to take back land for Jesus. Belief is one thing. Obsession and brainwash is another.
Re: Time Article
Originally posted by WonderGirl
😠 Has anyone read the recent Time article where they interview the directors of Jesus Camp? I was not impressed. They supported a totally twisted of Christians. If you haven't read it, check it out on the site and see what I mean. 😠
Time as in Time Magazine?
And you do realise that just doing an interview doesn't actually mean support the things being said or done. It is a thing called journalism. Just like the reporters who interview criminals aren't actually supporting the crime.
I wasn't accusing Time Magazine itself... but the directors of the movie. It's sounds suspiciously like they're making fun of it- and just because Chrisians don't like they or their family exposed to things that are inappropiate, and pass down their religion, doesn't mean we're resenting everything. We're commanded to be 'in the world, but not of it'.
"In a sense, Jesus Camp is a record of a crime- the theft of childhood by possibly well-intended but narrowly ideological adults.... Neither she nor Gradycan entirely fathom why the Evangilicalsfeel so profoundly threatened in a largely tolerant U.S. They speculate that casual, unthinking secularism, represented by everthing from the TV schedule to Wal-mart's groaning shelves, makes these Evangilicals feel encircled and unheeded despite their relative prosperity."
Time Magazine
November 6, 2006