Ken Masters vs Robert Garcia

Okat satsujin here are your claims:

They have similar moves, and your right. I will admitt that

SAME

Standing Far: LP,MP,HP,LK
Standing Close:LP,MP,HP,LK
Crouching:LP,MP,HP,LK,MK,HK
Jump straight Up:LP,MP,HP,LK,MK,HK
Jump Diagnol:LP,HP,LK,HK

Different

Standing Far:MK,HK
Standing Close:MK,HK
Jumping Diagnol:MP,MK

RYU

KEN

RYU genral strategy

I thought I'd try and organize all the relevant, 'accessible' information about Ryu and his strategies, combos and matchups in one thread. Feel free to add anything, I will be generally editing this page to add things as I go over them.

Since Karathrow's down and only accessibly through archive.org, I'm going to be updating this page with Frame Data on Ryu's moves. Keep looking for updates as I add everything and give descriptions for each move.

EDIT: I have a better source of frame data and I'm working to compile the important stuff.

Notation: c. - crouching / s. - standing (far) / cl. - close standing / ju. - jump straight up / j. - jumping or superjumping
LP MP FP - light medium fierce punches
LK MK FK - light medium fierce kicks
ST - startup frames
AC - 'hit' frames
RE - recovery frames
DAM - damage
STUN - stun points
HA - frame advantage (on hit)
BA - frame advantage (on block)
CHA - frame advantage (on crouching hit)
PA - parriable (H high, L low)
SELF - cancels into itself
CAN - can cancel into special moves
SCAN - can supercancel (cancels into super)
PAR

Moves
Normals
s.LP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

cl.LP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

s.MP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

cl.MP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

s.FP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

cl.FP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

s.LK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

s.MK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

cl.MK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

s.FK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

c.LP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

c.MP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

c.FP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

c.LK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

c.MK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

c.FK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

j.LP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

ju.MP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

j.MP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

ju.FP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

j.FP
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

ju.LK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

j.LK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

ju.MK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

j.MK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

ju.FK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

j.FK
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

UOH (s.MP+MK)
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

Throws

Command moves
» towards+MP: Sakotsu Wari
A sort of lunging, overhead punch that hits twice.
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
» towards+FP: Kyuubi Kudaki
A lunging, forward gut punch that hits twice.
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
Special moves
» QCF+P (236+P): Hadouken (EX w/PP)
A fireball. The EX version hits twice, is red, is faster and knocks down.
--- (LP) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (MP) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (FP) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (EX) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

» DP+P (623+P): Shoryuken (EX w/PP)
A dragon punch / uppercut moving upwards and slightly to the side. The EX version hits twice when starting from the ground and has faster startup.
--- (LP) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (MP) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (FP) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (EX) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

» QCB+K (214+K): Tatsumaki Senpuu Kyaku (EX w/KK)
A travelling hurricane kick that knocks down on hit. The EX version can hit up to 5 times and is stationary.
--- (LK) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (MK) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (FK) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (EX) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

» HCF+K (41236+K): Joudan Sokotou Geri (EX w/KK)
A simple, forward sidekick that sends your opponent flying. The EX version bounces your opponent off the wall for a juggle opportunity.
--- (LK) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (MK) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (FK) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:
--- (EX) ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

Super arts
» SA1: QCFx2 +P (236236+P): Shinkuu Hadouken (2 stocks) (5.6 EX moves)
An upgraded version of the Hadouken that can hit up to 5 times.
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

» SA2: QCFx2 +P (236236+P): Shin Shoryuken (1 stock) (3.2 EX moves)
An upgraded version of the Shoryuken. If the first hit connects, the move does a huge amount of damage and sends your opponent flying into the air. If it does not, the move turns into a low-damage, multi-hit Shoryuken.
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

» SA3: QCFx2 +P [Hold P, rotate stick to charge faster] (236236+P[H]): Denjin Hadouken (1 stock) (2.4 EX moves)
An unblockable attack (must be parried), Ryu will charge up an electric fireball for as long as the punch button is held. The longer the button is held, the stronger the fireball will be in terms of both damage and stun.
--- ST: AC: RE: DAM: HA: BA: CHA: PA:

Ground game
Pokes
» c.MK (low hit, decent reach, cancels, hitconfirm late cancel)
» c.MP (good for hitconfirms)
» c.LK (do two for a hitconfirm chain)
» s.MP (can cancel into super or special)
» s.FK (great vs dudley, great anti-air, excellent to catch people with)
» s.MK (ok reach, excellent priority)
Blockstrings
» c.LK, s.LK, s.MK (push people out if they're too close for comfort)
» c.LK, c.LP, c.LK (can confirm into SA1)
» s.FP, s.FK (target combo)
» cl.MP, s.MK, c.MK (slightly unsafe)

Air game
Jump-ins
» j.MK (crosses up)
» j.FP (to attack, hurts like hell)
» j.FK (to attack, little bit more range)
Air-to-air
» j.MP (hits twice, harder to parry, pushes you away on parry, totally safe in air-to-air)
» j.FP (to attack)
» j.FK (to attack)
» EX Tatsumaki (to attack, risky)
Anti-air
» s.FK (quick, easy, good recovery)
» s.FP, s.FK (FP needs to be early enough to hit as an anti-air)
» c.FP (good when opponent is nearly directly above you, but slow)
» (EX?) SRK (getting divekicked for sure? use this)
» ju.FP (you'd be surprised)
» s.MP (sometimes, and you can toss a fireball right afterwards for zoning)

Meaty attacks
» towards+MP [can link into c.LK if timed for last hit to land very late]
» UOH (MP+MK) [can link into SA1 / SA2]
» close s.MK (hitconfirms, strong, cancels into SRK for SA3 setups)
» close s.FP

Combos
» s.FP, s.FK [chain]
» j.FP, cl.FP (or close s.MK), EX Joudan, (EX?) SRK
» c.LK, c.LK > SA1
» c.LK, c.LP > SA2
» c.MK, FK Tatsumaki [vs. standing]
» crossup with j.MK, c.LK, c.LK > SA1 / SA2 [vs. crouching]
» c.MP (or c.MK), EX Tatsumaki [good chip, safe on block]
» c.MP (hc) > SA1 / SA2
» cl.MK (hc), (EX?) SRK (or > SA1 / SA2)
» toward+FP (hc), (EX?) SRK (or > SA1 / SA2)
» (corner) c.MK (or close s.MK), EX Tatsumaki > (on landing) SA1

[b]Setups
SA3 Denjin setups
» Anything leading into FP SRK xx SA3 setup
» Anything leading into LP SRK xx SA3 (on 1/4 - 1/3 stunned character, release if SRK hits)
» Anything into LK / MK Tatsumaki, SA3 setup (preferable over HK)
» Any air-to-air where you land first (FP Hadouken xx SA3)
» Any instance where you anti-air a guy from the ground (LP Hadouken xx SA3)
» crossup MK, c.LK, s.MP, LP Hadouken xx SA3 (better vs Akuma)
» c.LK, c.LP, c.LK, LP Hadouken xx SA3 (better vs Akuma)
Kara-throw setups
» cl.MP, Kara-throw
» c.LK, Kara-throw
» toward+FP, step back, Kara-throw
» c.LK, s.LP (whiff), Kara-throw [vs. crouching]

Punishing after a parry
» parry -> any close s.FP (or close s.MK) Denjin setup
» parry -> close s.FP (or close s.MK), EX Joudan, (EX?) SRK
» low parry -> c.MP (FP?), EX Joudan, (EX?) SRK (?)
» low parry -> c.MK, EX Tatsumaki (or > SA1 / SA2)
» low parry -> c.MK, LP SRK xx SA3 (Denjin setup)

Wakeup game
Possible things to do on wakeup against an opponent
» toward+MP [overhead, done very early may link into c.LK]
» c.LK, toward+MP [low, then overhead]
» c.LK, c.LK [hits low]
» c.LK, s.LP (whiff), Kara-throw [vs. crouching]
» c.LK, step back 2 frames, Kara-throw
» walk in, step back, Kara-throw
» meaty UOH [can link into super]
» meaty close s.MK, FP SRK xx SA3
» crossup j.MK

Kara-cancels
Throwing: toward+MP
SRK: c.MK or c.FK (MK safer)

Notes and comments
» EX Joudan as a follow up to anything you can link it off lets you set an opponent up for extra damage.
» A blocked FP SRK is a prime candidate to be followed up with SA3. Remember that!
» MK is not always good as a crossup, it's better on crouching opponents (it also sometimes doesn't link with your ground attack unless done very deep).
» His (j.FP, s.FP, EX Joudan, SRK / FK Tatsumaki) combo deals 70 damage and 60% stun on an opponent Ryu.
» His EX Hadouken is ridiculously fast. Use it, it's good damage and generally reliable, even when tossed out randomly at somewhat close range.

General playstyles
» eddieW: Ryu compared to Ken? While Ken has better and easier ways to land a super, Ryu has great damage and knockdown potential without a super. The way he plays Ryu is to select SA1 and play what he calls "Super Turbo Red Fireball Ryu", blended with some 3S tactics. The goal here is to score a knockdown, then dash in and 50/50 for some more damage (eg. with kara-throwing, or c.LK, walk back to bait the throw, punish with c.MK, MK Tatsumaki for knockdown and good damage). If they get you off, EX Hadoukens will get your opponent to jump and score some extra damage.

.

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
Okat satsujin here are your claims:

They have similar moves, and your right. I will admitt that

[B]SAME

Standing Far: LP,MP,HP,LK
Standing Close:LP,MP,HP,LK
Crouching:LP,MP,HP,LK,MK,HK
Jump straight Up:LP,MP,HP,LK,MK,HK
Jump Diagnol:LP,HP,LK,HK

Different

Standing Far:MK,HK
Standing Close:MK,HK
Jumping Diagnol:MP,MK

RYU

KEN [/B]

Currently I can't find a good strategy explanation for ken. Now, you claimed they played the same. Elaborate on how they play the same.

yo emperor ashtar : satsujin is a SNK lover, he hates Capcom, so that's why he is so annoying. He didn't even know what a ''kara'was. i think he don't understand what you have post.

wel in street fighter 3 third strike i am a Ken player.
The man who learned me everything about the game plays with Ryu.

and the match up is 5-5 . but they have both different animations and most moves are different!! example : Standing close Hp looks the same but have both different animations.

''what i see about this boring discussion is that Satsujin never played street fighter 3 third strike and he is jeleaos that Capcom has made such a good game and SNK didn't!!!!!!! 😛 😛 😛 ''

I don't want to interfere with you lovely ladies, but Ryu, Ken, and Akuma don't play anything alike, never have, and never will. Akuma has low defense and speed as he's meant to pressure your opponent, Ken is meant to be anti-air and play a variety of mix-up, and Ryu is all about bread and butter, what you see is what you get, doing high stun and having high defense.

Originally posted by SaTsuJiN
please you are the queen of postin out yer ass.. bringing up old crap to support current arguments.. they wear the same exact stuff.. perform the exact same animations and thus can be played the exact same way.. super moves changes a characters playstyle ?.. since when? all thats required of the player is to meet the supermoves condition to strike them with it... aside from that its hurricane > hadou > shoryu etc.. all the exact same stuff.

Robert would have made much more sense to have in CVS2 & SVC than lame @$$ Ryo. Robert should have been another of Ken's rivals. Robert sponsored the tourney (in CVS2) along w/Ken whereas Ryo didn't rival anybody or add to the story @ all if I remember right. Anyway, Ken beats Robert's @$$ and they should merge this w/the other one

I dont really see Robert being that much better than Ryo.IMO,they both suck equaly.

Robert doesn't suck, ryo on the other hand. . .Anyway, I laways pick the kyokugen team first, that or iori.

Iori's a f**king beast

Originally posted by Remulous
I dont really see Robert being that much better than Ryo.IMO,they both suck equaly.

edit: quite

Robert just isnt cool to me,damn near none of his moves are his own.Ryo is Ryu with Ken's hair color and Robert is Ken with Ryu's hair color with most of Guile's moves.I don't like any kyokugen userers exepy for Yuri.