Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
I have to pull out that Comic. it's buried somewhere. But I remember that even before she got her byrne massive power up, she was stalemating captain marvel back then. Am I correct in this?
She stalemated him until he was distracted by Hermes in which she used the lasso to make him come to his senses.
Originally posted by Validus
How do you think she does without her lasso?
Without her lasso, it would certainly be more difficult. To me, it's not like Superman vs. Wonder Woman where Superman has a myriad of powers like heat vision and ice breath that will net him the majority of wins. It's basically a Superman with magical lightening vs. Wonder Woman. Unfortunately, unlike Superman, Cap's edge in magic is pretty damn useless against Diana due to her nigh magical resistance and her bracelets.
Caps' childlike mind against an Amazon warrior with millineia of combat experience just rings in favor of Diana in my mind.
Cap may be a little stronger and a little tougher but I believe Diana's skill and myriad of equipment will net her the majority of wins.
Originally posted by Validus
Superman's heat vision and artic breath never mean anything in a fight. Artic breath is especially useless.
😐
It will slow her down a bit. And having your eyeballs frozen isn't gonna help your vision either....
Originally posted by Validus
I've already said I think WW can win with her weapons. It's without them where I said it's Cap's game to lose. Too durable, too strong.
You make it seem like Cap is leagues above her in strength like the Hulk to Ms. Marvel. They're comparitively even in strength. They get their speed from the same god. Cap has a slight edge in durability but it's nothing Diana has encountered before fighting the gods she's faced. Cap would just batter away like a brick, punching anything he sees. Diana is far more tactical and would attack at weak points like his eyes, his balls, and his throat. She's pretty damn nasty when she fights in bloodlust...
Originally posted by Draco69
😐It will slow her down a bit. And having your eyeballs frozen isn't gonna help your vision either....
Originally posted by Draco69
You make it seem like Cap is leagues above her in strength like the Hulk to Ms. Marvel. They're comparitively even in strength.
Originally posted by Draco69
hey get their speed from the same god.
Originally posted by Draco69
Cap has a slight edge in durability but it's nothing Diana has encountered before fighting the gods she's faced.
Originally posted by Draco69
Cap would just batter away like a brick, punching anything he sees. Diana is far more tactical and would attack at weak points like his eyes, his balls, and his throat. She's pretty damn nasty when she fights in bloodlust...
Originally posted by Validus
Superman's heat vision and artic breath never mean anything in a fight. Artic breath is especially useless.
He's used it effectively quite often. If he used those abilities to their full extent, most fights would be over as quickly as they began.
Originally posted by Validus
I've already said I think WW can win with her weapons. It's without them where I said it's Cap's game to lose. Too durable, too strong.
Agreed. Cap is the only other character who's taken a tesseract (probably spelled wrong) bomb and although hurt by it, survived. He's a top tier brick.
I do agree with Draco that WW has much better fighting skills than Cap and he fights like a brick. Id give Cap the edge in strength though, but it may be dampened due to WW's fighting ability enableing her to dodge hits. Speed is comparable, but i think its Billys superior durability that would put him over the edge for a defeat on WW.
Edit: Id also like to say that eventhough he fights lieka brick against bricks, knowing that shed be more tactical, im sure hed use Solomos wisdom to a much better extent.
Originally posted by Draco69
😐It will slow her down a bit. And having your eyeballs frozen isn't gonna help your vision either....
You damn right it would slow her down. If Superman would've continued to trounce on Diana after this, then Superman would've smashed her. Instead, he just went over to pick up a rock. 😐
Originally posted by Validus
Being frozen solid stopped her for what? A panel? It's always been a useless attack against anyone in the top tier. That's a fact unless Loeb is writing. Then it takes down Green Lantern.
Damn Loeb....
A batline can also apparently take out Black Lightening.
God help the Ultimates when takes over....
Originally posted by Validus
He's strong enough to make a difference. That's all I said.
A slight difference if (and I doubt it) he's stronger than she is. It's like a man who can lift 100 pounds versus a man who can lift 103 pounds. It's too close to really make any difference worth mentioning
Originally posted by Validus
Neither of them that many speed feats. It's likely even though Marvel has looked good against the Flash.
Besides Justice (which isn't remotely in continuity) Marvel has looked good against the Flash in some comics while Diana looked good with Jesse Quick when she managed to breach the door to the Speed Force.
Again, they get their speed from the same god so..
Originally posted by Validus
That's ABC logic. If Diana did as well against top tier bricks as she did those Gods, she could beat Superman for the majority.
Again, her resistance to magic is key to her go up against the god and winning against CM. Superman's myriad of powers will more often than not prove a little to much for Diana. Particularly heat vision + freeze breath + a flurry of speedblitz blows...at the same time.
What's really ABC Logic is:
Captain Marvel > Superman
Superman > Wonder Woman
=
Captain Marvel > Wonder Woman
Which is what everyone is thinking without ever really thinking about it...
Originally posted by Validus
Yeah, her skills net some wins. Never said differently.
Billy is powerful. But he sucks at fighting. He's used to just cannonballing everything he comes across. Diana will prove unlike any other opponent he's faced.
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Has either of them ever Hurt Superman Like Diana has? Has either of them taken the kind of punishment from Superman that Diana has?
Yes. And both can can withstand being grabbed by Superman without having their wrists broken.
What exactly puts them over her in a fight? Strength? So just how much stronger do you suppose they are than her? Considerable?
As much so as Superman in Marvel's case. Moreso in Black Adam's. For Marvel I give him the win because I think he's physically superior to her in every way. I think it would be a very good fight though. But Black Adam I think would punish her.
How come batman has Diana and Superman rated the same in strength? Speed? Same thing. [/B]
Probably because the rankings were so broad they both fit in the same top one. Like how Thor and Kurse are both in the same Marvel Class 100 when Kurse is over 2 times Thor's strength.
Originally posted by AvalonofthewindAgreed. Cap is the only other character who's taken a tesseract (probably spelled wrong) bomb and although hurt by it, survived. He's a top tier brick.
The tesseract bomb turns someone inside out for a split-second causing tremendous pain. It didn't appear to be a lethal weapon against them unless it turned them inside out permenantly. It's speculation to assume that anyone else could have survived with any ill effect other than his hearsay.
Originally posted by jrodslam
I do agree with Draco that WW has much better fighting skills than Cap and he fights like a brick. Id give Cap the edge in strength though, but it may be dampened due to WW's fighting ability enableing her to dodge hits. Speed is comparable, but i think its Billys superior durability that would put him over the edge for a defeat on WW.
You make it seem like her blows aren't going to do much. WW's durability is comparatively even to Superman or Captain Marvel in regardance to blunt force trauma. Which is exactly what Cap's assault will be.
Her blows will hurt him as much as it will hurt her.
I don't understand how Diana has numerous edges in fighting ability, tactical prowess, and experience but Cap's supposed edge in durability is what nets him the majority of wins?
Huh?
I
Originally posted by jrodslam
d also like to say that eventhough he fights lieka brick against bricks, knowing that shed be more tactical, im sure hed use Solomos wisdom to a much better extent.
The Wisdom of Solomon doesn't grant Billy fighting skills. It grants him moral intiution and guidance during crucial moments. It doesn't grant him complicated tactical scenarios to use against Diana.
And Diana can use the Wisdom of Athena in conjunction with the Eyes of Pallas which gives her semi-cosmic awareness as long as she looks at her object of focus.
A goddess of wisdom always thrumps some Jewish king who tricked two hags with a bluff....
Originally posted by Draco69
You make it seem like her blows aren't going to do much. WW's durability is comparatively even to Superman or Captain Marvel in regardance to blunt force trauma. Which is exactly what Cap's assault will be.Her blows will hurt him as much as it will hurt her.
I don't understand how Diana has numerous edges in fighting ability, tactical prowess, and experience but Cap's supposed edge in durability is what nets him the majority of wins?
Huh?
How was i making it seem as if her blows wouldnt do much? I personally think Cap is more durable than Supes and Supes more durable than her. Because of the durability and strength edge imo, i think shed be hurt moreso than Cap would.
Originally posted by Draco69
The Wisdom of Solomon doesn't grant Billy fighting skills. It grants him moral intiution and guidance during crucial moments. It doesn't grant him complicated tactical scenarios to use against Diana.And Diana can use the Wisdom of Athena in conjunction with the Eyes of Pallas which gives her semi-cosmic awareness as long as she looks at her object of focus.
I didnt say that Solomos wisdom would give him fighting skills. I mentioned that hed fight more tactical. He wouldnt just rush in and try to pound her out. Youre right, Solomos wisdom does grant Billy intuition and guidance and i think hed use that. It doesnt only have to be in crucial moments. You misunderstood my point.
Originally posted by Draco69
The tesseract bomb turns someone inside out for a split-second causing tremendous pain. It didn't appear to be a lethal weapon against them unless it turned them inside out permenantly. It's speculation to assume that anyone else could have survived with any ill effect other than his hearsay.
He only survived it because of his magical invulnerability. It I remember correctly, he even stated it.
It wasn't just some "pain bomb."
Originally posted by Draco69
A slight difference if (and I doubt it) he's stronger than she is. It's like a man who can lift 100 pounds versus a man who can lift 103 pounds. It's too close to really make any difference worth mentioning
Originally posted by Draco69
Besides Justice (which isn't remotely in continuity) Marvel has looked good against the Flash in some comics while Diana looked good with Jesse Quick when she managed to breach the door to the Speed Force.
Jesse's top speed is only .50c. I don't see how she can enter the speed force at all through conventional means.
Originally posted by Draco69
Again, they get their speed from the same god so..
Originally posted by Draco69
Again, her resistance to magic is key to her go up against the god and winning against CM. Superman's myriad of powers will more often than not prove a little to much for Diana. Particularly heat vision + freeze breath + a flurry of speedblitz blows...at the same time.What's really ABC Logic is:
Captain Marvel > Superman
Superman > Wonder Woman
=
Captain Marvel > Wonder Woman
Which is what everyone is thinking without ever really thinking about it...
Captain Marvel = Superman
Superman > Wonder Woman
=
Captain Marvel > Wonder Woman
At least in my opinion.
Originally posted by Draco69
Billy is powerful. But he sucks at fighting. He's used to just cannonballing everything he comes across. Diana will prove unlike any other opponent he's faced.