Sparrabeth

Miz WilloftheWisp, that your heart of hearts spoke to you and let you read those feelings with Jack and Elisabeth means it is true. I can wholly accept that. Do we always (ever?) get to dance every dance with the one our heart desires--I rage against this but I don't think so. I want it, I yearn for it, but that may not make it be so.

I finally figured out for me just a short while back that the best I can do is move toward that which I desire or love, instead of what most people do, myself included, which is run away because they fear. They fear it won't work out, so they don't try. They won't "win" so they don't try.

I know you're sad. that makes me sad becos Sparrabethers are passionate and unrequited love or misguided love doesn't make it any less. oh, yeah, I remember now, growing pains...I thought I'd be all done with them once I got my full height. Boy was I ever wrong on that one. They keep coming and are on the inside mostly where you can't even show a skint knee or a booboo finger hurt as evidence. peace at heart, sweet dreams, MizWillofthewisp.

Originally posted by IheartPocky
ahhh mina hello 🙂

mina and piratediva back again. for however brief of time!!

just like old times.. *tear*

awwww yes!!! I missed My Mina!!! I also really miss the old gang too!!!

Hey Diva!!

Yeah I miss the old gang too...I started lurking around here about this time last year and I knew all of you guys by heart before I signed up. I would check on here to read the posts. Like that version of pirates3 and pirates4...that was awesome.

Oh and I remember the endless discussion threads where we tore DMC to bits and pieces and psycho analyzed ever tiny detail.
Good times! Good times!

We'll still have DMC and COTBP though and we have the JE moments and the DVD special features.

Originally posted by PirateDiva
Also im currently reading "So much to Learn".....so far Jack and Liz seem to be avoiding each other, i'm on Ch. 23, please tell me that the action between Sparrabeth is gonna get better!!!!!?? Not that the story isnt interesting, because it is.....I just want to know if there is some Sparrabethy goodness up ahead in the story? Can anyone who has read the story answer that for me?? Please! simple yes or no answer will do!!!

Oh yes! It'll get much much much better. Although I skipped the last two chapters because...well you'll see but there will be sparrabethy goodness for definite.

willo I agree about your 'kiss if death' idea. I think that perhaps the relationship COULD be repaired by the end of AWE where they regained the old playful relationship but that ship has sailed and that's that and I'll always love JE in COTBP and DMC...just being in that moment. Frankly I think Jack still has feelings for her if not like before.

And during her speech to the pirates. When she said they'll see 'free men' and 'freedom'...all I could think was that Elizabeth and Will weren't right for each other. No chemistrey whatsoever...frankly Barbossa and Elizabeth have more chemistrey. Even Beckett and Elizabeth have more chemistrey...I think. But Will and Elizabeth truly and purely love eachother and I guess that's all that counts.

BTW...have you noticed how Beckett is so keen on JE? I mean first in DMC with his whole 'fate intervened' speech and claiming that she wanted to save Jack. Next in AWE when he asks Jack about 'Miss Swann' and in originally there was supposed to be a part in the parley scene where he tries to turn Elizabeth and Will against Jack by saying that Jack traded the pirate so he could have Elizabeth. How's that for a Sparrabeth shipper? Or perhaps he only sense the OBVIOUS chemistrey and decided to take advantage.

Originally posted by tee_pirategirl
Oh yes! It'll get much much much better. Although I skipped the last two chapters because...well you'll see but there will be sparrabethy goodness for definite.

willo I agree about your 'kiss if death' idea. I think that perhaps the relationship COULD be repaired by the end of AWE where they regained the old playful relationship but that ship has sailed and that's that and I'll always love JE in COTBP and DMC...just being in that moment. Frankly I think Jack still has feelings for her if not like before.

And during her speech to the pirates. When she said they'll see 'free men' and 'freedom'...all I could think was that Elizabeth and Will weren't right for each other. No chemistrey whatsoever...frankly Barbossa and Elizabeth have more chemistrey. Even Beckett and Elizabeth have more chemistrey...I think. But Will and Elizabeth truly and purely love eachother and I guess that's all that counts.

BTW...have you noticed how Beckett is so keen on JE? I mean first in DMC with his whole 'fate intervened' speech and claiming that she wanted to save Jack. Next in AWE when he asks Jack about 'Miss Swann' and in originally there was supposed to be a part in the parley scene where he tries to turn Elizabeth and Will against Jack by saying that Jack traded the pirate so he could have Elizabeth. How's that for a Sparrabeth shipper? Or perhaps he only sense the OBVIOUS chemistrey and decided to take advantage.

Oh God! Tee this is EXACTLY what i was thinking so so long ago!!!!this thing with Beckett,i mean... Really!So glad someone noticed it too!!! 🙂 He just see something on it...i don´t know but..had he ever seen them both (JE) together? i don´t think so...he just.. knew it,knew something or what eer isn´t it strange a bit???strange but wonderful! 🙂 How could he know everything?probably the way liz jack were talking about eachother or the things they were doing ...beckett was great man,he knew probably more than whoever...but it was not enough to keep him alive...but i liked the man... he could tell SO SOmuch things which could reveal important facts..
...and he was great for JE... AHA!so that´s why he had to die! 😠
well well sorry i´m just kidding 🙄

Originally posted by T.Maria
i was once an optimistic sparrabether....but i think i have turned into a bitter one....

I mean, thousands of people CAN'T be wrong!
hell, even the critics in the papers were asking where the 'love triangle' had gone !!!!!!

Im guessing that something went on...
To me, i dont blame the writers. Some kind of discussion obviously went on concerning sparrabeth...i actually think that the writers WANTED sparrabeth, but the higher powers decided that it wasnt to be...

theres something fishy about it...some kind of intentional saboutage... im sure of it....

yes!i´m 100% sure as well! remember when writers said that missed chances,COMPROMISES,...and such things they WANTED sparrabeth i´m sure (missed chances),but i suppose mr. gore(coz hundered times he had said that jack was only bump in the road and that when we see the davy/tia story we´ll understand w/e story and such things ,you remember?) from the very beginning i knew gore wanted w/e SADLY coz writers wanted JE even in cotbp(will gave him a sword elizabeth quick kiss and deleted scenes...all written for JE) so then gore just didn´t agree with writers and then everything started with w/l JE thing...and in the interview these missed compromises were because of gore who always wanted bloody w/e...
This is what i think and i´ve always thought that this whole mess was somehow this way...and TnT didn´t mean to lie to us..did they have any other strong reasons to lie to us,actually?
Really i think whole thing was because some people who made this story were ok with w/e some were not so ok and wanted it different way...
But who knows?we don´t know nothin,actually...any thing which happened between them or whatever...so i´m not telling my speculations are true because i don´t know nothing...so you don´t have to agree with me- these were only my opinions 🙂

I agree.

Can you guys do something for me? Head to www.wordplayer.com , click on the 'Forums' on the main page and the pick 'Movie forums'. Look for a thread called potc: a question for the writers...or something like that. There's an interesting JE vs. WE discussion going on there that I think you guys would enjoy. 😄

I rarely post on wordplayer and when I do I don't like to post on a 'shipping' matter. I feel more at home here and not so comfortable there...I dunno why. It's a great place though. I love T&T's quotes on top of the page and the discussions are all great too...I might start posting a bit more once I feel more at home.

I used to go there a lot after DMC but...you know the rest.

I can't enter their site. "Okay, Houston, we've had a problem here. OUR SITE'S A-OK but sorry, apparently there's something iffy between your browser OR
connection and our site. So please copy-paste ALL the info below ... "
I think I should mail them. 🙁

Awwwwww! That stinks. Hope you can check it out eventually...I thought it was interesting

Originally posted by tee_pirategirl
Oh yes! It'll get much much much better. Although I skipped the last two chapters because...well you'll see but there will be sparrabethy goodness for definite.

willo I agree about your 'kiss if death' idea. I think that perhaps the relationship COULD be repaired by the end of AWE where they regained the old playful relationship but that ship has sailed and that's that and I'll always love JE in COTBP and DMC...just being in that moment. Frankly I think Jack still has feelings for her if not like before.

Awwww im excited!! I'm at ch. 40 already!! this story is great!! Slow in the Sparrabethy stuff....but thats ok cause it just makes me want more!! But Chappies 32-38....Lovin them!!! Serioulsy i went to bed at 5 am reading this story!! Thanks Tee....i hope there is more coming up!!! Eeek!!

And honestly IMO Jack definately still has feelings for Liz....if not more! Liz is the the woman that Jack fell in love with, something he never thought was possible for him!! Jack has lived a life of never really getting what he wants. The Pearl for example, He has her briefly just enough to tease him, then he looses her again....and the cycle continues! Same with Liz he fell for her in COTBP, but knew he couldnt have her....he left Port Royal vexed by Liz....then in DMC she pops back into his life w/o him looking for her, Jack must have believed it was fate! He went as far as to propose marriage to her!! The whole time he respected her enough not to touch her or have his way with her!!

She saw the goodness in him, something different to Jack for a change since everyone only see's him as a Pirate and Pirate= "evil"....but not Liz she see's good in him! He went back saved them and gained the reward that followed...One last Kiss by the one he loves! She left him to his death, sure he felt betrayed, who wouldnt! the last memory he had of this earth was that Kiss!! That Kiss haunted him in the locker! But in the end Jack knew Liz did what she had to do...and he respected that!! She went back for him and saved him from the locker! He respected her for that too!

Point is that Love is Blind....there is no doubt that Jack loved her! Look at us, I mean how much do we take from our significant others?? We fight, we say things to each other, we do things to each other...but because we love them, we forgive them! I understand that in this case she Killed him, but she redeemed it by risking her life and bringing him back from the dead! Jack cant hate her for that!

Jack, Liz, and Will were wrapped in a Triangle!! and one of them had to be the bigger person and give up the one he loved! Jack has always been one to step up to the plate he did it when he had to give up his immortality to save Will, he risked getting caught by the Royal Navy to save Liz, so in this case he had to love Liz enough to let her go!! So IMO Jack still had feelings for her, enough to want whats best for her, enough to let her go!! Something Will should have done!!

I dont care what anyone says!! Jack and Liz should have stayed together! I bet u anything if, after a couple of years, Jack had shown up on the shore she had been staying at, the second her eyes met his she would be love struct! Her heart would pound a million miles per minute causeing herself to faint!! Her feelings for him would overwhelm her!! She Loves him too!! and thats a Fact!!! Dam the AWE Ending....It was WRONG!!!!!! It's like she took back everything she said about freedom in her speech!!! It was WRONG!!!!!! Ugh!! 😠 ok im gonna go read a SparrABETH Fic to calm down!!!

Sorry for the essay...Most of it its just Rant!!

I love to rant...and I think ranting is good and that all that you said makes sense.

You see Terry himself a long time a go on a blog: "The character isn't necessarily what he says but what he does."

Well yes Elizabeth DID marry Will, she DOES love Will and I don't doubt that for a second...only saying that given the opportunity JE could've happened...Elizabeth's feelings could've led to love.

Elizabeth IS what she does...not what she says...and so we aren't wrong...we aren't kidding ourseleves when we 'over analyze' (is that what they call it?) because every gesture IS what the character is.

Words are easy...valuable and fascinating but easy. Actions our louder...there are a lot of actions that add stregnth to JE. That being said I'm not disregarding the actions that benifit WE either...I'm just saying we weren't wrong for looking deeper.

BTW...have you noticed how Beckett is so keen on JE? I mean first in "DMC with his whole 'fate intervened' speech and claiming that she wanted to save Jack. Next in AWE when he asks Jack about 'Miss Swann' and in originally there was supposed to be a part in the parley scene where he tries to turn Elizabeth and Will against Jack by saying that Jack traded the pirate so he could have Elizabeth. How's that for a Sparrabeth shipper? Or perhaps he only sense the OBVIOUS chemistrey and decided to take advantage."--------------tee

Lol, I've thought about that a lot. No, Beckett's never seen them together. I wish they would have gone into Jack and Beckett's past in the movie, but that was another thing they had a lot of opportunity with and missed it. There are a couple of reasons I think Beckett takes a definite interest in Jack's love life.

- The simplest reason is that he wants to be able to hang something over Jack's head, to give himself the upper hand, so I think Beckett feels that if he can prove these two love each other, he can exploit it. He is a villain.

- The Freudian answer is what's been implied since DMC: Beckett is gay and attracted to Jack. He never mentions the mark Jack left on him, and while you can take that metaphorically as being the pirate/enemy Beckett could never catch, you can go the romantic way and say maybe Beckett's heart got broken or something. As...uh, weird as Jack can be sometimes, he's proven he's not gay, so Beckett is left in the dust. He fishes for information about Liz to see if Jack's heart is taken....a sad, twisted take on it.

- Villains in POTC are just smarter and more observant. A line cut from COTBP was Barbossa warning Jack not to get too close to Liz because she was the kind of girl that could really screw a guy up (paraphrasing that of course). Norrington (NOTE: James is a wonderful, WONDERFUL man, but he does a mean thing by taking the heart in DMC so he has a villainous moment) is the only one who notices the attraction between Jack and Liz on the Pearl. A cut line from DMC with Davy has him conclude that Will is in love with a woman and that only leads to heartbreak, implying that what's going on between her and Jack is sabotaging Will's relationship with her.

It's a very fascinating character trait in Beckett.

ooooh yay! psychoanalyzing beckett! fun! 🙂

he is a very good character, a very good villain, as villains go. i have always preferred T and T's villains to other villains.. Jafar being my favorite of course.

i think Beckett is very perceptive, and i agree fully that he is a J/E shipper... but probably not just for speculative reasons... i know after DMC we talked a lot about how much Beckett implied about Liz and Jack, but I always thought it was sort of "wishful thinking" on Beckett's part because it would help his evil plan if there were something between Jack and Elizabeth--- Beckett probably knows Jack is something of a womanizer, and it would provide good leverage for beckett if the daughter of the governor were involved with him.

im sorry if you lot already know about this but i was browsing johnnydeppzone.com last night and i came across an interesting article in the porch general discussion section of the forum and found this :Terry Rossio ~ Updates his Blog with Great Pirates Tidbits. On it Terry wrote quite a bit about shipping!!!!
"In the midst of filming, we all become more and more aware of the fan base. People are talking about something called 'shipping' which, if you're working on a pirate film, can be a bit confusing, as we do have a lot of ships, and they do have personalities. Eventually it becomes clear that 'shippers' and 'shipping' is derived from the word, 'relationship' and is shorthand for fans who are promoting different romantic entanglements among the characters. So if you were in favor of the Jack Sparrow/Elizabeth Swann pairing, that would make you a Sparrabether, or Sparrabeth shipper. As opposed to the Willabethers, who were in favor of Will and Elizabeth romance. I explain it to Gore in between shots and he responds with a bemused, pained look and goes back to work ... " theres more but i don't know how to link! sorry lol x x x

FAIIIIIIINTS!!!!!!! *Sprawled on the ground* That's interesting...I'll go check it out! THANK YOU!

BTW Kate...I love T&T's villians too. At the very least they aren't 2 dimensional like other villians. Jafar is by far my favorite too...
I always thought that about beckett ...he knows what to take adavantage of. He knows that Jack/Liz know each other and that she even goes so far as to add the "captain" to his name. Great opportunity for Beckett eh?

yeah... and, like we've all mentioned before, it seems that during the filming for DMC, they hadn't settled on a script for AWE yet... (well, it seems that during the filming of AWE they hadn't settled on a script yet either.... haha) but were running with some basic story lines.... most of which got lost in the script that was finally decided upon.
there are multiple story lines, foreshadowing, etc, that are totally dropped in film 3, making for some confusion. Beckett's interest in Elizabeth's connection to Jack is one of them--- they play it up enough in film 2 as to suggest there will be some plot ties to it in film 3, but like lots of other things, it just disappears.

(well, it seems that during the filming of AWE they hadn't settled on a script yet either.... haha) ----kate

You crack me up.
Yes yes some things from DMC were dropped...which I guess weren't big enough for anyone else but the fans to notice but would've been nice to see nonetheless.

i know...

xbritt, i LOVE your sig. laughed for a long time. brilliant.

tee, i think more than just the fans noticed it. i went with people who had only seen the first two films once and weren't that into it, and they were beyond confused. they kept asking questions like "wait, what happened to this-and-such part from film 2?" or "i thought that character was going more for XXX" etc... so even though it was a great film and turned out fairly well, there were major plot holes that were noticeable to anyone who had seen film 2. but since this is the sparrabeth and not the rant thread, i'll leave it at that.

i am looking forward to seeing deleted scenes and how that may help to resolve some character's emotional arcs... in the sparrabeth realm, that is. because in all the early scripts for AWE, there was a lot more going on there-- not necessarily shipping wise, but just in terms of elizabeth's final decision making more sense and bringing Jack's character back to a better place...

hey kate thank you, i like your sig to! i wanted originally to make something all sparrabethy and all grand sweeping romance by the ocean with the sun set...but i couldn't be bothered! LOL

Im sure i read somewhere on this forum that there wouldn't be any deleted scenes with the AWE dvd 🙁