Enigma Force Vs. Phoenix Force

Originally posted by Mr Master
Give the Silver Surfer enough time and he can destroy the contents of the universe too.

Well, might be stretching a bit but my point is, that's something they "may have" accomplished with time,
but Rachel also literally stated:
that neither herself or Necrom had the power out-put to take out the Solar System,
which is why Necrom had to use his surroundings to do it.
(a couple moons, a planet or two, and finally the gas giant to finish the job)

So whatever her "not holding back" potential is ... it's below Solar System buster.

She held back.

Originally posted by zopzop

Yes, but the very next panel says that the PF isn't a power in and of itself but that it has the ability to tap into the elemental forces of the universe and they are near infinite. That's why she didn't want to resort to attacking him like he was her, they would have destroyed the universe.

She held back.

But the scan is cut and dry. She literally gauged her max power.
Rachel not only stated it, but it was proven with Necrom's actions.
She isn't "holding back" ... she had to resort to plan b tactics to win.
"destroy the universe?" ... yea well, a solar system at a time perhaps using gas giants to help with the solar systems.

Anyway, classic full PF is a power that can destroy the contents of a What If reality, not bad.
But with paltry durability always at its side.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Wut up SunnyD, that wouldn't have been enough for me,
but after reviewing the issue just now, I noticed many occurrences
were going on "while" they were battling. Your logic is sound.

So, I must agree with you, and with Kandy's assertion.

But I disagree, that it's a better feat than sustaining indefinitely the cosmic size Microverse.
(it makes it worse for Rachel ... she was stalemated for a good while by Hungry G)

That aside, Alan Davis artwork, man I remembah! 👆

I agree that the feat pales in comparison although I wouldn't call it a stalemate. It was more like Big G steadily losing until he was finally depleted of energy to near death.

Yeah the artwork was great. That's why I blew up the scans. 👆

Originally posted by Mr Master
That's inconsequential concerning the amount she did possess.

But the scan is cut and dry. She literally gauged her max power.
Rachel not only stated it, but it was proven with Necrom's actions.
She isn't "holding back" ... she had to resort to plan b tactics to win.
"destroy the universe?" ... yea well, a solar system at a time perhaps using gas giants to help with the solar systems.

Anyway, classic full PF is a power that can destroy the contents of a What If reality, not bad.
But with paltry durability always at its side.

And regarding the Rachel/Necrom fight :

Who knows how long it would have taken before they would have destroyed the universe if she fought using Necrom's tactics, keep in mind the escalation that was going on : planets, igniting worlds, then destroying solar systems (he was ramping it up pretty fast until Rachel kamikazeed him), but according to her (and hence the writer) they WOULD have destroyed 616.

Keep in mind I'm not saying current PF wins (I already said I think it'd lose), but Classic PF is a different story.

Originally posted by Mr Master
But I disagree, that it's a better feat than sustaining indefinitely the cosmic size Microverse.

👆

^🙂

Originally posted by zopzop

I don't know my friend, I think you're selling the Classic PF short. Remember when it looked like the PF was about to bite the dust? All the stars in the universe winked out. The Watcher even commented that the universe would be nothing more than an infinite void with not even the smallest potential for life :

That's a pretty major power right there. Every star in the universe, according to Kubik "the first and in many ways the greatest of the principalities".

But time and space would go on, so would the other concepts who do not need humanity to be.
So would self sustaining civilizations, or lone beings that don't need stars.
I'm not just talking its been done before On Panel. Like even without Eternity,
a self-sustained world kept on existing forever while their universe around them imploded,
into literally nothingness immediately after Eternity/Death took their consciousness elsewhere.

Stars are only important (in the Kubik scenario) due to the fact they sustain most life. (humanoid/alien whathaveyou)
But like he also added, they are "fragile" things. (a jelly bean in his hand)

Hey did you know that it's common life that needs stars that actually empowers the PF.

Originally posted by zopzop

And regarding the Rachel/Necrom fight :

Who knows how long it would have taken before they would have destroyed the universe if she fought using Necrom's tactics, keep in mind the escalation that was going on : planets, igniting worlds, then destroying solar systems (he was ramping it up pretty fast until Rachel kamikazeed him), but according to her (and hence the writer) they WOULD have destroyed 616.

Imo, Rachel would've helped destroy solar systems faster if she had joined Necrom's maneuvers,
but I also think that statement is hyperbolic, cause the circumstances
would've had to been them fighting without interruption for a very long time, (many solar systems in a galaxy)
before taking out the universe imo.

Originally posted by zopzop

Keep in mind I'm not saying current PF wins (I already said I think it'd lose), but Classic PF is a different story.

While Rachael in her clash with Shadow King, are tearing asunder the boundaries of reality witnessing the forces that can reshape creation.

http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/5139/xtf3p2627.jpg