The strongest villain in X-Men

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
On panel evidence involves more than just the art im afraid to tell you, it also involves the captions, the speech and the story going on in said comic. When all of those things are taken into consideration a standalone piece of art can take on an entirely different meaning.

Please understand that. 🙂

And nowhere in the comics does anyone say that it is not the real Phoenix force. You like the Phoenix allot, I can understand that, but sometimes you have to accept that characters you like will lose battles as well.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Nope. Franklin Richards had reality manipulation. Onslaught had access to those powers while Franklin was in his possession. Without him he has the powers of Magneto and Xavier combined. They are his inherent powers, arguing that he had reality manipulation is like me arguing that Thanos has the inherent power to destroy the universe and defeat the abstracts and LT. Whats the flaw in that thinking? He could do those things only when in possession of an external source, in his case The Heart Of The Infinite. It was not something he could do as standard, not a feature of his inherent powerset.

Onslaught had telepathy and control of the electromagnetic spectrum.

When people say that Onslaught killed all of the avengers and such, they're referring to Onslaught fully powered up with Franklin's powers, aren't they?

That's the one I was referring to.

Yup. He also got a small bit of x-man's power as well.

Onslaught did not kill the Avengers, the X-men did when they attacked his form after the non-mutants and scarlet witch ran into it. Apparently while onslaught was being destroyed franklin subconsciously transported the Avengers into a pocket dimension inside his ball.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm

By your logic Xaviers head got peeled into sections like a banana and on the inside of his head is found not a skull and brain tissue but instead mini versions of him and the people in his life playing out scenes from his past and despite all that Xavier is alive and well to this day 🤨

That made no sense what so ever.

Originally posted by LordKaos
Onslaught did not kill the Avengers, the X-men did when they attacked his form after the non-mutants and scarlet witch ran into it. Apparently while onslaught was being destroyed franklin subconsciously transported the Avengers into a pocket dimension inside his ball.

I'm sorry, I thought he recreated them? Because they had no memory of the event whatsoever.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Onslaught trumps both of them.

True, but I normally don't count him since he's a fused being 😛 (of Magneto and Xavier).

As far as non-fused beings go however, Apocalypse takes the cake as the most powerful X-Men villain. 😎

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
True, but I normally don't count him since he's a fused being 😛 (of Magneto and Xavier).

As far as non-fused beings go however, Apocalypse takes the cake as the most powerful X-Men villain. 😎

Well, no.

Apocalypse is powerful, but he's not at the same level as Onslaught or Dark Phoenix.

I'd say Kid Omega is enough for Apocalypse 🙂

Originally posted by llagrok
Well, no.

Apocalypse is powerful, but he's not at the same level as Onslaught or Dark Phoenix.

I'd say Kid Omega is enough for Apocalypse 🙂

He's definitely not on the same level as Onslaught. I'm not denying that, though like I said, I normally don't count Onslaught because of the fact that he's a fused being. 😛

I have to disagree about Apocalypse not being on the same level as Dark Phoenix, though. While Apocalypse may not be destructive by nature in the same way Dark Phoenix is as to do something like consume an entire star (as if he could, not that he needs to), he still obviously has the potential to be as much of a threat as her (if not a greater threat) in the Marvel universe.

And Kid Omega is in no way "enough" for him, as En Sabah Nur also naturally possesses telepathy & telekinesis, and is also a Genius-level intellect...

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
He's definitely not on the same level as Onslaught. I'm not denying that, though like I said, I normally don't count Onslaught because of the fact that he's a fused being. 😛

I have to disagree about Apocalypse not being on the same level as Dark Phoenix, though. While Apocalypse may not be destructive by nature in the same way Dark Phoenix is as to do something like consume an entire star (as if he could, not that he needs to), he still obviously has the potential to be as much of a threat as her (if not a greater threat) in the Marvel universe.

And Kid Omega is in no way "enough" for him, as En Sabah Nur also naturally possesses telepathy & telekinesis, and is also a Genius-level intellect...

Let me make things clear for you.

KidOmega thinks over a thousand brilliant thoughts a second. His intelligence is far above any characters in Marvel universe. Emma stated that you could even compare him to normal geniuses. He also reanimated Sophie's corpse, which I have yet to see any telekinetic do.

Although Apocalypse's experience and versatility makes him a better fighter than Kid Omega and such. KidOmega has much more raw power. Give him 20 years and he'd be one of the stronger Marvel characters and the new Phoenix.

P.S Good to see another Apoc fan here. He's underestimated 🙂

Originally posted by llagrok
Let me make things clear for you.

KidOmega thinks over a thousand brilliant thoughts a second. His intelligence is far above any characters in Marvel universe. Emma stated that you could even compare him to normal geniuses. He also reanimated Sophie's corpse, which I have yet to see any telekinetic do.

Although Apocalypse's experience and versatility makes him a better fighter than Kid Omega and such. KidOmega has much more raw power. Give him 20 years and he'd be one of the stronger Marvel characters and the new Phoenix.

P.S Good to see another Apoc fan here. He's underestimated 🙂

Heh. I noticed. >.> It would seem that I underestimated Kid Omega though ;_;, but I see your point now about him. I didn't know that he reanimated Sophie's corpse...

he reanimated Sophie using power he borrowed from the phoenix, he would not be the new phoenix, if jean is the avatar then she is essentially immortal and would not need a replacement, he would become a phoenix, not the phoenix well not white crown anyway.

Originally posted by LordKaos
he reanimated Sophie using power he borrowed from the phoenix, he would not be the new phoenix, if jean is the avatar then she is essentially immortal and would not need a replacement, he would become a phoenix, not the phoenix well not white crown anyway.

Get with the program. Phoenix changes hosts and Kid Omega was the most likely one to get picked, thus why the Shi'ar were dead afraid.

KO still has his powers, he just didn't feel like fightin' anymore.

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
Heh. I noticed. >.> It would seem that I underestimated Kid Omega though ;_;, but I see your point now about him. I didn't know that he reanimated Sophie's corpse...

If you put them two of them in an Arena and said "fight" then Apocalypse would win. However, if you give Kid Omega a reason to fight and 10 more years, he'd win.

Originally posted by llagrok
Get with the program. Phoenix changes hosts and Kid Omega was the most likely one to get picked, thus why the Shi'ar were dead afraid.

KO still has his powers, he just didn't feel like fightin' anymore.

I am with the program, that's why i said he'd become a phoenix not the phoenix, if he was the most likely to be picked then why did the phoenix possessed firefly pass over him? it was looking for it's avatar, jean that's why. In endsong the fraction of the phoenix was confused and looking for a piece of itself not a host. the shi'ar believed he would be picked because of his omega mutant status, they obviously had no idea that the phoenix was coming to resurrect it's old body all they knew was that it retreated to earth where it would most likely possess an omega. If he were an avatar then the phoenix would have gone to him in warsong, since hosts fight the phoenix and an avatar would just let it do it's work after connecting with the consciousness. he was never there to fight, he was there to claim the power of the phoenix for himself so that he could fully resurrect Sophie, she was disgusted and both he and her choose to go back to wherever it was they were before the phoenix came to earth.
what powers do you speak of besides him being an omega level telepath? he never showed signs of any telekinesis until after the firefly made contact with him, and any telekinetic can reanimate a corpse he needed the phoenix to give her corpse life. him having tk not granted by the phoenix is just like back in the day when xavier could psi blasts robots into the ocean, a mistake.

I read the comics yes, there's no need to give me a summary 🙂

I also know that he couldn't grant Sophie life without the phoenix force, which it's not supposed to able to anyways. However, he still recreated her body, that's telekinesis on a molecular level.

Beast was partially able to resist Cassandra Nova's telepathy. He didn't have a shot at resisting Kid Omega's. I know he wasn't shown as a telekinetic until he had gotten some "aid" from the phoenix force. However, I still think it's possible that he might be one.

I don't know many cases where the Phoenix has granted some extra abilities. It might have though, I can't think of anyone right now.

the only instances i can think of is when it took over Emma it gave her body the ability to absorb Scotts optic blast, and when it took over Celeste she had vast power to at least manipulate energy and time, it didn't really give Rachel her time travelling ability but it amped it up high enough to go from astral to physical, and then that guy who Rachel is sleeping with, the avian shi'ar as far as we know don't have innate powers but the Phoenix possessed his ancestor and a sword for that matter. then there's that guy Giraud? I'm not sure if he had powers before the phoenix made him a host. or maybe you were talking about beings possessed by the phoenix and still exhibiting power they didn't have before, after the phoenix left, i guess that's where the sword comes in as it still has some residual phoenix power left in it.

Can't amp up nothing 🙂

Phoenix' appearance in Endsong, not so sure about that. Phoenix isn't supposed to grant life.

Phoenix sword? I don't buy it. The recent uncanny x-men comics have been a complete load. Some guy suddenly appearing with a big blue sword and then sleeping with Rachel an hour later on.

Excuse me for not trusting this Korvus guy and his information 🙂

I agree 100% about Korvus and the blade of the phoenix crap, but the phoenix has said over and over it is life and fire and all that good stuff, it being the resurrection force leads me to believe that it can grant life most cosmic beings can resurrect the dead, shit even odin can.