Originally posted by King_Mungi
Guardian.
He didn't even manage to ko him...
'Sides he hit Wolverine with one hell of a punch. Wolverine and Guardian where fighting off in a forest and the prospective turns back to the X-Men swimming at a lake, where the caption at the top of the page says "Several Miles Away" and then Wolverine comes rocketing into the picture. He was launched miles from Guardian's attack and he was only down for a second, the next time you see him he is telling Storm (was it Storm?) that Guardian is his.
Also, I think in the last issue (Uncanny 108?) he was knocked into orbit and was pretty badly injured. Wolverine didn't have a healing factor written into his orgins yet so who can say if he was on his best game?
Originally posted by King_Mungi
and yet still the likes of Captain America, Daredevil, etc. who are considerably a lot weaker can take it to him.
Only in highly situational fights
Daredevil: Wolverine is mind controlled
Daredevil: Wolverine is written by Ennis
Captain America: Wolverine's healing factor is in a slump, he's just finish fight Nuke and... hey is that a magic sword?
Captain America: Wolverine has just been put through the meat grinder by the entire x-men roster. I believe it was stated he had never been hurt so badly in his life.
The only thing resembling a fair fight between Wolverine and Daredevil ended in three panels with DD in a full nelson...
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
He didn't even manage to ko him...'Sides he hit Wolverine with one hell of a punch. Wolverine and Guardian where fighting off in a forest and the prospective turns back to the X-Men swimming at a lake, where the caption at the top of the page says "Several Miles Away" and then Wolverine comes rocketing into the picture. He was launched miles from Guardian's attack and he was only down for a second, the next time you see him he is telling Storm (was it Storm?) that Guardian is his.
Also, I think in the last issue (Uncanny 108?) he was knocked into orbit and was pretty badly injured. Wolverine didn't have a healing factor written into his orgins yet so who can say if he was on his best game?
Ummm...yes he did. "Wolverine! He is uncouncious Peter!"
Incorrect, they even directly commented Wolverine was out, and then Storm, Colossus and Banshee attacked Guardian while Wolverine was still out. Then after the took the fight to the sky and returned back Wolverine was up
UXM #109 and yes he did, even Bryne had an interview afterwards explaining Guardian and his future apperance and mentioned Wolverine's healing factor. Would he even stand a chance against Guardian if he wasn't? Wolverine: "Big talk Logan that punch nearly took off my head"
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Only in highly situational fightsDaredevil: Wolverine is mind controlled
Daredevil: Wolverine is written by Ennis
Captain America: Wolverine's healing factor is in a slump, he's just finish fight Nuke and... hey is that a magic sword?
Captain America: Wolverine has just been put through the meat grinder by the entire x-men roster. I believe it was stated he had never been hurt so badly in his life.
The only thing resembling a fair fight between Wolverine and Daredevil ended in three panels with DD in a full nelson...
Are you kidding me? Apparently no one can match Wolverine by your standards.
Did Wolverine or Cap use the magical sword in their fight? no. Captain American even crushed Wolverine's tendons preventing him from unsheating his claws.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Ummm...yes he did. "Wolverine! He is uncouncious Peter!"Incorrect, they even directly commented Wolverine was out, and then Storm, Colossus and Banshee attacked Guardian while Wolverine was still out. Then after the took the fight to the sky and returned back Wolverine was up
UXM #109 and yes he did, even Bryne had an interview afterwards explaining Guardian and his future apperance and mentioned Wolverine's healing factor. Would he even stand a chance against Guardian if he wasn't?
well yeah, he wasn't originally intended to have a healing factor, the mention of which wasn't until years after logan's first appearance...
he was supposed to simply have an amazingly strong constitution... remember: when he was created he was going to have the same physical stats as spidey...
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Are you kidding me? Apparently no one can match Wolverine by your standards.
no he's not kidding, he stated FACTS that entire post... 😐
and he didn't say no one can match wolverine, just because your examples have been highly suspect by way of his evidence doesn't mean he thinks wovlerine's unbeatable.. 😕
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Did Wolverine or Cap use the magical sword in their fight? no.
hmmm wolverine's gigantic red scar on his chest from the muramasa blade says different... cap also used it at the end of the fight swinging it at logans head..
Originally posted by King_Mungiyup, when he threw his sheild at wolverine via suckerpunch: wolverine was in mid conversation and had his back half turned to cap.
Captain American even crushed Wolverine's tendons preventing him from unsheating his claws.
Originally posted by jinzin
well yeah, he wasn't originally intended to have a healing factor, the mention of which wasn't until years after logan's first appearance...he was supposed to simply have an amazingly strong constitution... remember: when he was created he was going to have the same physical stats as spidey...
no he's not kidding, he stated FACTS that entire post... 😐
and he didn't say no one can match wolverine, just because your examples have been highly suspect by way of his evidence doesn't mean he thinks wovlerine's unbeatable.. 😕
hmmm wolverine's gigantic red scar on his chest from the muramasa blade says different... cap also used it at the end of the fight swinging it at logans head..
yup, when he threw his sheild at wolverine via suckerpunch: wolverine was in mid conversation and had his back half turned to cap.
Naaaa...same year when Alpha Flight and Guardian appeared there was a question about Wolverine and Bryne explained AF and Wolverine and explained Wolverine had a healing factor
So no one can match Wolverine in a one on one fight? hmmm...
No they fought one on one when Cap didn't have the sword, only till later did he have it and then tried to use it.
It's an example of how people even less than Hulk strength have hurt Wolverine. As apparently only Hulk level beings by the comment in this thread can hope to knock out Wolverine.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Naaaa...same year when Alpha Flight and Guardian appeared there was a question about Wolverine and Bryne explained AF and Wolverine and explained Wolverine had a healing factor
chronologicaly speaking I could care less.. (I always though mac knocked him out due to the nature of his suit)
but you asked if old school wolverine would stand a chance without a healing factor and I answered... assuming he was written the way he was originally intended..
Originally posted by King_Mungi
So no one can match Wolverine in a one on one fight? hmmm...
Originally posted by King_Mungi
No they fought one on one when Cap didn't have the sword, only till later did he have it and then tried to use it.
and how do you think the fight came to a halt? duhhhhh after cap got ahold of the sword... no offense, but are you seriously trying to argue that the sword didn't make a difference in that fight?
Originally posted by King_Mungi
It's an example of how people even less than Hulk strength have hurt Wolverine. As apparently only Hulk level beings by the comment in this thread can hope to knock out Wolverine.
i mean, sure black widow has "hurt" logan before.. doesn't mean anyone even pretending she's about to knock him out here though.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Ummm...yes he did. "Wolverine! He is uncouncious Peter!"Incorrect, they even directly commented Wolverine was out, and then Storm, Colossus and Banshee attacked Guardian while Wolverine was still out. Then after the took the fight to the sky and returned back Wolverine was up
UXM #109 and yes he did, even Bryne had an interview afterwards explaining Guardian and his future apperance and mentioned Wolverine's healing factor. Would he even stand a chance against Guardian if he wasn't? Wolverine: "Big talk Logan that punch nearly took off my head"
Are you kidding me? Apparently no one can match Wolverine by your standards.
Did Wolverine or Cap use the magical sword in their fight? no. Captain American even crushed Wolverine's tendons preventing him from unsheating his claws.
Last I checked Storm wasn't a doctor. 😉
Anyway on a serious note, the time between Wolverine being koed and him getting up was seconds. Colossus says that Guardian will have to go through him if he wants to get to Wolverine, changes into armored form and decks Guardian. Guardian gets up and picks up a tree... and Wolverine is getting to his feet behind storm.
I haven't read this Bryne interview so I won't comment on what he did or didn't say but I will say this, I find it very odd that circa Uncanny X-Men 109 Bryne would be mentioning a healing factor that was never part of Wolverine's mutant abilities until he was infected with a Brood embryo some where around Uncanny X-Men 160-170.
How would Wolverine survive a hit from Guardian if he didn't have a healing factor? Early x-men Wolverine just had insane durability, in fact even stated something along the lines of "I'm pretty much invulnerable" once. Before the whole Brood thing there was never anything said concerning Wolverine and a healing factor on panel... except for a throw away one liner in the savage lands.
... and I'm not sure how Captain America and Daredevil not being able to beat Wolverine translates to him being unbeatable. Those two are hardly big fish.
EDIT: I said Wolverine's healing factor was never mentioned until the Brood but that was wrong. I remembered that it was mentioned during DoFP when Pyro picked Wolverine up in a fiery claw. So... some where in Uncanny X-men 142. The Brood story lines was when it first became an major part of his character though.
Originally posted by jinzin
uh yeah...chronologicaly speaking I could care less.. (I always though mac knocked him out due to the nature of his suit)
but you asked if old school wolverine would stand a chance without a healing factor and I answered... assuming he was written the way he was originally intended..
He was like I said Bryne before UXM #139-140 and the eventual tie-in to AF #1 stated Wolverine had a healing factor then.
Originally posted by jinzin
?
again no one said that.
stop putting words into our mouths here..
Actually yeah they did, not you or Srank.
Originally posted by jinzin
and how do you think the fight came to a halt? duhhhhh after cap got ahold of the sword... no offense, but are you seriously trying to argue that the sword didn't make a difference in that fight?
Not at all, I mentioned examples of a person far less stronger than Hawkgirl severely damaging him and even excluding that fight various street level characters have gone toe to toe with him.
Originally posted by jinzin
well I wouldnt't say that.. but your counter argument is flawed, there's a huge difference between crushing his tendons on a circumstantial nature and knocking him out.. sure cap crushed his tendons, but he's failed to knock wolverine out on 3 occassions.. the only time he's ever done it was during eots after all the shit that logan went through before he arrived..i mean, sure black widow has "hurt" logan before.. doesn't mean anyone even pretending she's about to knock him out here though.
You remove Wolverine's claws what does he have? the person earlier made a comment that without Hakwgirl's mace she is nothing. That point I made goes a long with that as even if you remove their "weapons" their far from helpess.
Sure, but Hawkgirl is vastly higher than those people. Physically, speed, mentally, etc.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Last I checked Storm wasn't a doctor. 😉Anyway on a serious note, the time between Wolverine being koed and him getting up was seconds. Colossus says that Guardian will have to go through him if he wants to get to Wolverine, changes into armored form and decks Guardian. Guardian gets up and picks up a tree... and Wolverine is getting to his feet behind storm.
I haven't read this Bryne interview so I won't comment on what he did or didn't say but I will say this, I find it very odd that circa Uncanny X-Men 109 Bryne would be mentioning a healing factor that was never part of Wolverine's mutant abilities until he was infected with a Brood embryo some where around Uncanny X-Men 160-170.
How would Wolverine survive a hit from Guardian if he didn't have a healing factor? Early x-men Wolverine just had insane durability, in fact even stated something along the lines of "I'm pretty much invulnerable" once. Before the whole Brood thing there was never anything said concerning Wolverine and a healing factor on panel... except for a throw away one liner in the savage lands.
... and I'm not sure how Captain America and Daredevil not being able to beat Wolverine translates to him being unbeatable. Those two are hardly big fish.
Your right soon as when Oro shot the lightening he was getting up grogy
All he said was "accelerated healing", he didn't go indepth on the mechanics just a brief descprition of his powers.
Why would he die from a hit from Guardian? First apperance against the Hulk Wolverine survived and his powers were as of yet undefined. Bryne stated in an interview as people were asking about Guardian and Wolverine's past.
Captain America is, well considering who he has faced and beat.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Your right soon as when Oro shot the lightening he was getting up grogyAll he said was "accelerated healing", he didn't go indepth on the mechanics just a brief descprition of his powers.
Why would he die from a hit from Guardian? First apperance against the Hulk Wolverine survived and his powers were as of yet undefined. Bryne stated in an interview as people were asking about Guardian and Wolverine's past.
Captain America is, well considering who he has faced and beat.
When was this Bryne interview? Because until around UCX 141-142, Wolverine technically didn't have a healing factor. When Guardian thrashed him in 109, Wolverine was relying purely on durability.
And he'd have to be stronger then 1.5 ton to punch Wolverine "a few miles"... especially considering they were in the forest and there where lots of obstacles to slow Wolverine down.