Originally posted by exanda kane
Before you do, I'll nitpick at some of your points, mainly that the worst prequel "kicks the shit out of most other sci-fi/action/comic book films". That is simply not true.My first example is Serenity.
Albeit, Serenity does not have the scope of Star Wars, it could never do, but it doesn't ask for any more than what it already has, and that is a solid, adventure film with enough humour, action and suspense to cater for a large audience. The Prequel trilogy had action, and that is it. (I feel for you if you found the C3PO jokes entertaining!)Another example is Minority Report. Technically, it delives a blow in the nuts to any Star Wars film, OT included, and has the script and characters to take it beyond anything from the Prequel Trilogy.
God, even the 5th Element, as self indulgent and overblown as it is, is better than any of the Prequel films, and the dodgy looking car chase is much more effective in that film, than the speeder chase in AOTC.
Alien and Aliens, Blade Runner, A Scanner Darkly, War of the Worlds (both incarnations) too name just a couple, are much better than one of the Prequel Trilogy.
As a closing comment, I'd like to ask you again, do you seriously consider the worst of the PT to be superior to any of these films? Even when the other films mentioned include a great deal more talent, direction and focus than even the best of the PT?
Suppose I should've clarified that post.
I know that for example Minority Report is better acted, directed, etc... than TPM and probably AOTC, and I loved it when I saw it in the theater.
But, I've seen it only once or twice since and while good, I've no desire to keep watching it.
Not so with any of the Starwars films.
They are simply better movies to me.. and I think that most sci-fi/action/comicbook fans would rather see ROTS than The Fifth Element, A Scanner Darkly, or War of the Worlds. (another great film, but only a one or two time repeater.)
Certainly they'd rather see it or AOTC or TPM than that boring ass Serenity movie. 👇 😛
So, I loved the prequels.
So did most people.
Don't let the popular backlash fool you, most reviewers praised TPM. AOTC was given so-so's, and ROTS ruled with just about every reviewer.
So critics opinions were fair to fantastic, of all three films.
Regular movie going audiences ate them up... a testament of this is that both TPM and ROTS are now in the top 10 films of all time. (and all six SW films are in the top 25)
Regular folks liked it.
The only people that feel the PT is some god-awful bastard child of the OT are the hardcore SW fans.... and that camp is split right down the middle, with some praising the PT and some bemoaning it.
So lets cut all the crap about "everybody hated the PT."
Bullshit.
I see the depth, the interweaving themes, the grand story, the character arcs, the battles, the worlds, and I love it.
I love it the way I loved Star Wars, Empire, and Jedi, as a kid of the 80's before I realized at 13 those films had Episode numbers in front of them.
I still remember to this day how it was when I saw the first TRAILER for the Special Editions coming to theatres..."for an entire generation, people have experienced starwars the only way its been possible, on the T.V. screen..."
Oh what a glorious time to be a Starwars fan!
Those films returned to theatres and WTFpWnEd everything for about 5 weeks straight.
StarWars SE beat out a new Tom Cruise film for first in the box office, and was replaced two weeks later by Empire. 😄
And I got it.
StarWars was gonna come back to theatres.
Having watched them all on VHS and Super-BETA tape since the age of 4, I was that second generation of kids that grew up with the OT. Too young for the theatrical releases, but born with them all around. (I actually was born in Feb. of '83 so I guess technically I was around for part of the original release.) 😛
And I realized that Empire was called V, and Jedi was called VI, so there had to be a I,II, and III.
And seeing the SE's I knew what Lucas was doing. He was getting us ready.
Hell, I still remember seeing the first Teaser POSTER for TPM, just the solitary image of the young boy Anakin against the desert of Tatooine, with a looming shadow. I was walking through a theatre after some crappy movie, Mimic I think, and I spotted it across the hall and ran over to it. 😛
When the movie arrived, I was 16.
No spoilers, no internet, just the Teaser trailer that I went bat-shit over when it played in front of some movie in '98 that I can't remember now.
I went in expecting a new Starwars movie, one that would begin to show me the old republic and how it ended in the empire with vader.
Boy, did I get both!
I took a bus and a light rail train to the best theatre in the next town and about 9 of my friends to watch it opening day, and see it at about noon.
I don't know about you, but my screening was packed.
I loved the expanded worlds, the amazing visuals, the seriousness of Qui-gon when he realizes what he's found, and the action at the end.
And believe me, those in our showing cheered and clapped when Darth Maul got cut in half.
I was impacted hard by Qui-gon's death, just because I wasn't spoiled.
The ending was great, with Obi defiantly taking anakin, and Palps promising to "watch him with great interest" and with the promise that stuff was just gonna get crazier in the next one.
AOTC I also saw on opening day, and I was totally spoiled for that one. 😛
Can't apologize for loving it.
It has a slow start, but the speeder chase is awesome, Obi-wan and Anakin in the club is great, it reeks of the classic starwars feel.
Just how I imagined old Jedi Knights would have been.
The Kamino stuff was pretty good, but it pics up greatly as Obi and Jango fight.
The tatooine stuff is brilliance.
Seeing the homestead, Owen and Beru's relationship revealed, the scene where Anakin contemplates against the twin suns is reversed from Luke's position and we look in on his choice, whereas with Luke we look out on his destiny. Shmi's death is done quite well, and I feel for the guy. His major outburst is not explicitly shown, but is a hint of where he will go.
The scene in the garage is great. "I killed them. I killed them all. There dead, every single one them. And not just the men," (slow darkside music starts playing 'oh-ohhh-ohh'😉 "but the women," (anakin looks aside as the pain and guilt hit him for his next statement) "and the children too." (just as quick he switches back) "There like animals and I slaughtered them like animals. I hate them!"
Dude, there was dead silence and shivers all around my packed out screening.
Then you have the fun in the droid factory and the arena followed by the awesome sight of Jedi running with lightsabers ignited like the Braveheart elite.
Followed up by the duels, which together all 3 short ones make one great sequence.
And the end, you see palps with the army, you know it's gonna hit the fan, you see poor anakin and padme married, knowing that their choice is going to damn everybody but feeling bad for them anyway since they really love each other, and BAM! roll credits.
People screamed dude. People cheered.
I asked somebody walking out of the show ending before ours went in "How was it?" hoping for some indicator. He said: "It's the best one ever!"
I agreed. 🙂
I won't spend any time really defending ROTS, as it's critical reception and status with just about all fans defends itself. (sorry Bites!) 😛
Suffice to say that there were more cheers, and gasps, and held breath moments (think of the ruminations scene) in the last one than the others put together, and I saw quite a few grown men and women crying when it was all said and done. (I was close, but I didn't crack.) 😛
So that was my theatrical experience of the PT.
Obviously, seeing them again and again on DVD I've become aware of the limitations more and more now that I'm not on a "new SW in theatres" high...
And "bashers" are right. They are there.
The dialogue is corny and silly in places in TPM. The kid isn't a great actor. The plot moves slowly. It has drawn out senate sequences, and boring trade federation stuff.
The love scenes are over-the-top and wooden in AOTC. CG is dodgy in a few places.
ROTS is not without warts, having cheezy lines and stiff acting, as well as cartoony CG in some places. Anakin's fall is rather fast.
I see all this as a young adult, and not a teen raised on SW going nuts for new SW.
I also see the OT with a more critical eye as well, but that's another discussion.
(Empire is still my favorite of all six.)
But you know what, I see the problems, the detractions, and .....
I don't care!
They bug me, but not enough to stop watching awesome starwars films, and certainly not enough to say that these incredibly revolutionary, magical, fantasy films are "horrible", or "Terrible" or the infamous "raped my childhood" BS that got bantered about.
I see all the care and time that Lucas took to make his story, to add new parts, to have the plots and themes connect to the OT and within each other as well and I'm one of the firm believers that he pulled off something unprecedented in film history by completing and changing his original trilogy into a six movie saga, an incredible story in itself, many years in the making.
starwars
Originally posted by sithsaber408"And then you took the words right out of my mouth, it must have been while you were ki---" Not finishing that line.
Suppose I should've clarified that post.I know that for example Minority Report is better acted, directed, etc... than TPM and probably AOTC, and I loved it when I saw it in the theater.
But, I've seen it only once or twice since and while good, I've no desire to keep watching it.
Not so with any of the Starwars films.
They are simply better movies to me.. and I think that most sci-fi/action/comicbook fans would rather see ROTS than The Fifth Element, A Scanner Darkly, or War of the Worlds. (another great film, but only a one or two time repeater.)
Certainly they'd rather see it or AOTC or TPM than that boring ass Serenity movie. 👇 😛
So, I loved the prequels.
So did most people.
Don't let the popular backlash fool you, most reviewers praised TPM. AOTC was given so-so's, and ROTS ruled with just about every reviewer.
So critics opinions were fair to fantastic, of all three films.
Regular movie going audiences ate them up... a testament of this is that both TPM and ROTS are now in the top 10 films of all time. (and all six SW films are in the top 25)
Regular folks liked it.
The only people that feel the PT is some god-awful bastard child of the OT are the hardcore SW fans.... and that camp is split right down the middle, with some praising the PT and some bemoaning it.
So lets cut all the crap about "everybody hated the PT."
Bullshit.
I see the depth, the interweaving themes, the grand story, the character arcs, the battles, the worlds, and I love it.
I love it the way I loved Star Wars, Empire, and Jedi, as a kid of the 80's before I realized at 13 those films had Episode numbers in front of them.
I still remember to this day how it was when I saw the first TRAILER for the Special Editions coming to theatres..."for an entire generation, people have experienced starwars the only way its been possible, on the T.V. screen..."
Oh what a glorious time to be a Starwars fan!
Those films returned to theatres and WTFpWnEd everything for about 5 weeks straight.
StarWars SE beat out a new Tom Cruise film for first in the box office, and was replaced two weeks later by Empire. 😄
And I got it.
StarWars was gonna come back to theatres.
Having watched them all on VHS and Super-BETA tape since the age of 4, I was that second generation of kids that grew up with the OT. Too young for the theatrical releases, but born with them all around. (I actually was born in Feb. of '83 so I guess technically I was around for part of the original release.) 😛
And I realized that Empire was called V, and Jedi was called VI, so there had to be a I,II, and III.
And seeing the SE's I knew what Lucas was doing. He was getting us ready.
Hell, I still remember seeing the first Teaser POSTER for TPM, just the solitary image of the young boy Anakin against the desert of Tatooine, with a looming shadow. I was walking through a theatre after some crappy movie, Mimic I think, and I spotted it across the hall and ran over to it. 😛
When the movie arrived, I was 16.
No spoilers, no internet, just the Teaser trailer that I went bat-shit over when it played in front of some movie in '98 that I can't remember now.
I went in expecting a new Starwars movie, one that would begin to show me the old republic and how it ended in the empire with vader.
Boy, did I get both!
I took a bus and a light rail train to the best theatre in the next town and about 9 of my friends to watch it opening day, and see it at about noon.
I don't know about you, but my screening was packed.
I loved the expanded worlds, the amazing visuals, the seriousness of Qui-gon when he realizes what he's found, and the action at the end.
And believe me, those in our showing cheered and clapped when Darth Maul got cut in half.
I was impacted hard by Qui-gon's death, just because I wasn't spoiled.
The ending was great, with Obi defiantly taking anakin, and Palps promising to "watch him with great interest" and with the promise that stuff was just gonna get crazier in the next one.
AOTC I also saw on opening day, and I was totally spoiled for that one. 😛
Can't apologize for loving it.
It has a slow start, but the speeder chase is awesome, Obi-wan and Anakin in the club is great, it reeks of the classic starwars feel.
Just how I imagined old Jedi Knights would have been.
The Kamino stuff was pretty good, but it pics up greatly as Obi and Jango fight.
The tatooine stuff is brilliance.
Seeing the homestead, Owen and Beru's relationship revealed, the scene where Anakin contemplates against the twin suns is reversed from Luke's position and we look in on his choice, whereas with Luke we look out on his destiny. Shmi's death is done quite well, and I feel for the guy. His major outburst is not explicitly shown, but is a hint of where he will go.
The scene in the garage is great. "I killed them. I killed them all. There dead, every single one them. And not just the men," (slow darkside music starts playing 'oh-ohhh-ohh'😉 "but the women," (anakin looks aside as the pain and guilt hit him for his next statement) "and the children too." (just as quick he switches back) "There like animals and I slaughtered them like animals. I hate them!"
Dude, there was dead silence and shivers all around my packed out screening.
Then you have the fun in the droid factory and the arena followed by the awesome sight of Jedi running with lightsabers ignited like the Braveheart elite.
Followed up by the duels, which together all 3 short ones make one great sequence.
And the end, you see palps with the army, you know it's gonna hit the fan, you see poor anakin and padme married, knowing that their choice is going to damn everybody but feeling bad for them anyway since they really love each other, and BAM! roll credits.
People screamed dude. People cheered.
I asked somebody walking out of the show ending before ours went in "How was it?" hoping for some indicator. He said: "It's the best one ever!"
I agreed. 🙂
I won't spend any time really defending ROTS, as it's critical reception and status with just about all fans defends itself. (sorry Bites!) 😛
Suffice to say that there were more cheers, and gasps, and held breath moments (think of the ruminations scene) in the last one than the others put together, and I saw quite a few grown men and women crying when it was all said and done. (I was close, but I didn't crack.) 😛
So that was my theatrical experience of the PT.
Obviously, seeing them again and again on DVD I've become aware of the limitations more and more now that I'm not on a "new SW in theatres" high...
And "bashers" are right. They are there.
The dialogue is corny and silly in places in TPM. The kid isn't a great actor. The plot moves slowly. It has drawn out senate sequences, and boring trade federation stuff.
The love scenes are over-the-top and wooden in AOTC. CG is dodgy in a few places.
ROTS is not without warts, having cheezy lines and stiff acting, as well as cartoony CG in some places. Anakin's fall is rather fast.
I see all this as a young adult, and not a teen raised on SW going nuts for new SW.
I also see the OT with a more critical eye as well, but that's another discussion.
(Empire is still my favorite of all six.)
But you know what, I see the problems, the detractions, and .....
I don't care!
They bug me, but not enough to stop watching awesome starwars films, and certainly not enough to say that these incredibly revolutionary, magical, fantasy films are "horrible", or "Terrible" or the infamous "raped my childhood" BS that got bantered about.
I see all the care and time that Lucas took to make his story, to add new parts, to have the plots and themes connect to the OT and within each other as well and I'm one of the firm believers that he pulled off something unprecedented in film history by completing and changing his original trilogy into a six movie saga, an incredible story in itself, many years in the making.
starwars
But still, feckin' awesome man. Right on the ball.
😂
I think Serenity is a bad comparison. Not a very good film.
Well, most of you know my opinion, but in short. I find the PT disappointing. The OT is a classic, groundbreaking in its time and two of the films still rank high in the top ten most favourite film lists. The PT had nothing of that grandeur or lasting effect. We had LOTr simultaneously and that kinda did what SW did in the 70s and 80s. It was the grand effects opera everyone went to see and will cherish. The PT is fairly well made but it kinda misses the point on some crucial moments, leaving a lot of non-geek fans like us luke-warm. Judging by its lasting effect, it's clear to me none of the PT films will ever reach a classic, lasting status like the OT did. And without the many limitations Lucas had in the 70s and 80s I think it's fair to say we can consider it a failure.
i was going to write a long post about being a fan of the OT and seeing the films pretty much when they were released up to the PT but it would be zzzzz worthy
in regards to Sithsabres comments to the guy leaving AOTC as they were going in and the comments of "its great...the best one ever" myself and my mate came out of the cinema and told everyone it was ****ing terrible
ill never forget the look on some of their faces
ill agree with the Anakin "i killed them " scene
that was a PT highlight...along with the Opera scene in Sith
funny that....two quiet dialogue scenes in loud cgi action heavy films being highlights
as for the Cantina scene in AOTC they are like a pair of cops...a Freebie and the Bean in outer Space...as far away you can get from my pre PT visions of the Jedi
the droid factory scene is an unessasary late addition that feels like it was made for level 9 of AOTC the videogame
ive commented on the Jedi battle and the swordfights are lame with lamer facial reaction shots
anyone else think that every Yoda fight in the PT looks ****ing ridiculous...surely im not on my own
they look stupid
im a long time SW fan
the thrill turned to chill the first time i saw the S.E trailer and thought "what the **** is that big mouthed cgi singing alien???"
its been downhill from there on
i got a buzz when i saw the TPM poster in my cinema too
but that disappeared when i bought the illustrated screenplay read it and thought that they had left out a few pages
i went to see TPM on the midnight screening the first night and before the flick everone had the expression of someone about to get blown by Baywatch era Pamela Anderson
when the movie finished most of them looked like theyd been blown by Jackie Goody
i remember people being interviewed and saying "well it was poorly written,no stand out characters and Jar Jar was annoying" and then when asked for what they thought of it as a whole they said "it was sattisfying"
that sums up TPM...never have i heard people sticking up for a film that they know 75% of is crap
its like( and i think ive said this before ) having a nice breakfast with two turds instead of sausages knowing they are made out of turd and eating them and going "HMMM YUMMY! that was completley satisfying"
but i never learned
i remember ringing a pal after AOTC and he asked what it was like
he knew..his voice was like someone asking how a relative was after a car crash
AOTC was an abysmal experiance as you thought Lucas would have listened to some crtisisizm
but he didnt
he was surrounded by Yes men
he needed a Kurtz involved with the PT
McCallum just sucked Georges **** and did has he was told
Lucas is The Emperor who answers to no one
and that is why with the PT he failed
So a long post after all.... hehehehe.
I remember talking to non-SW fans after TPM came out. who knew I was a big fan. They all said: it looks great but there's no story. And I thought (Having read the novel before the movie came out): that is shocking, there's a lot of story but LUcas decided to hide it all. I still think that's what he did with the entire PT: he hid the story so we mainly got a lot of fluff.
Originally posted by sithsaber408Regular movie going audiences ate them up... a testament of this is that both TPM and ROTS are now in the top 10 films of all time. (and all six SW films are in the top 25)
I'll start with that point. It's wrong; no one in their right mind could even put any of the Prequel films, or even all of the originals on a pedastel that high, and if they do, they must be some of the most drall, grey people with little to no intelligence about them. I mean, I'm talking cretins of neandertal taste here.
I'll continue and conclude with my argument after I've shoved your ill founded and porly concieved statements later.
Originally posted by queeq
😂I think Serenity is a bad comparison. Not a very good film.
Not at all; its certainly a movie of B movie calibre, but then, so is Star Wars, and Lucas should not kid himself that its anything more. Serenity doesn't have the expanse of Star Wars, but it doesn't ask for that much, all it is is a tight script, acted as best as it could be, with some great archetypal characters. That is what the originals had, but what the prequels certainly lack.