The trouble with atheism
What do you think of the views of this progam? This program is called The Trouble with Atheism.
The trouble with atheism
What do you think of the views of this progam? This program is called The Trouble with Atheism.
I find that comparing Atheism to Theism in this respect is a bit off.
Surely there are many idiots, but atheism is not actually a set belief system, if you want to be a radical and say that atheism should be the only acceptable view you can do that, but there are no spokespeople for atheism, it is not actually as institutionalized as Religions are.
And to say that the deaths caused by communism should count for atheism is nonsense, none of the leaders killed for atheism, they just happened to be atheist, just as some scientist happen to be Religious.
There is a big difference. One are killing because they are Religious the other are killing and happen to be non-religious.
people who compare atheism with theism ive always believed are NORMALLY for the most part theists themselves who dont seem to win any logical debates against atheists and as a last ditch or just to add sumthin extra try to compare theism to atheism n trying to prove that atheism is just as much FAITH BASED as theism , in doing so trying to bring the two on the same ground and making th masses believe that phenomenon wise there's no difference between the two. this is done to hide the fact that theism itself is crumbling due to lack of logic and is FAR inferior logically to atheism and this way they can falsely try n decrease the difference between the two to make their own dogmas sound not THAT much less appealing to the rational mind than atheism. overall its completely false. THEISM, is belief/dogma in ur version of god and his commandments/heaven/hell soul etc, while athesim isnt an OPPSING belief but simply LACK of that belief and thus not the same in anyway. atheism dose have a FUNDAMENTALLY faith based foundation but this faith is more AXIOM based as opposed to based on large non axiomic dogmas.
Originally posted by Bardock42
I find that comparing Atheism to Theism in this respect is a bit off.
Well of course thats relative.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Surely there are many idiots, but atheism is not actually a set belief system, if you want to be a radical and say that atheism should be the only acceptable view you can do that, but there are no spokespeople for atheism, it is not actually as institutionalized as Religions are.
Well here the problem. What is an athiestic ideaology? An ideology that doesnt belive in God and it doesnt matter how you spin it Communism comes under that banner therefore they speak for atheism.
Originally posted by Bardock42
And to say that the deaths caused by communism should count for atheism is nonsense, none of the leaders killed for atheism, they just happened to be atheist, just as some scientist happen to be Religious.
Well this is interesting it seems that the creator of the program has the same views as me. Do you think its possible, maybe just maybe you are creating some boundaries that do not exist?
Communism did kill in the name of atheism because they were trying to make atheism the prevailing belief.
Originally posted by Bardock42
There is a big difference. One are killing because they are Religious the other are killing and happen to be non-religious.
There is no difference you are creating something that isnt there. Part of Communism is that religon is the opium of the masses. This is one of Communism's "pillars", they persecuted religous people because there ideology believed that religon was inferior. So no they are killing in the name of Communism which is an atheistic belief system.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well of course thats relative.Well here the problem. What is an athiestic ideaology? An ideology that doesnt belive in God and it doesnt matter how you spin it Communism comes under that banner therefore they speak for atheism.
Well this is interesting it seems that the creator of the program has the same views as me. Do you think its possible, maybe just maybe you are creating some boundaries that do not exist?
Communism did kill in the name of atheism because they were trying to make atheism the prevailing belief.
There is no difference you are creating something that isnt there. Part of Communism is that religon is the opium of the masses. This is one of Communism's "pillars", they persecuted religous people because there ideology believed that religon was inferior. So no they are killing in the name of Communism which is an atheistic belief system.
No, there is a difference.
People are killed because of Religion..
They are not killed because of Atheism.
I mean, every rational being can see the difference. When you talk to a Religious fundamentalist they say "I killed them because God says we should kill the nonbelievers" if you talk to a communist they'd say " He got killed for the good of the community" or something, they would not say "He got killed because atheism told me to kill him".
You keep bringing up that point at we keep telling you that it is just not logically the same.
The person that made that documentary by the way, somehow assumes that just because he sees no difference between a scientific probable and a scientific improbable there is no difference.
Atheists themselves believe not in God because it is scientifically improbable and they usually are not trying to kill people in the name of their believe and they are not using legislature to forbid people to believe in what they want.
The belief that there is no God is ultimately much different from organized Religion, even if that documentary tries to imply different.
the topic is parallel to sayin, NOT BELIEVING IN SHIVA ALSO MAKES PEOPLE KILL JUST AS MUCH AS BELIEVING IN SHIVA. now thas nonesense, there arent only people in the world who either BELIEVE IN SHIVA or DONT BELIEVE IN SHIVA, there are many many different people in the world who ALL have one thing in common, ie, not believing in shiva, but this NOT BELIEVING isnt the thing responsible for their killing people, it is their PERSONAL beliefs which are in MANY things which might or might not prompt them to kill or not kill. NOT believing in shia is sumthing all killers and non killers OUTSIDE the shiva belief circle have in common. it isnt a causative factor and thus can not be held responsible just like atheism can not be held responsible for the killings that all people who dont believe in god partake. people are ATHESTS, and THEN have varying personal beliefs WHICH are responsible for the acts they commit. NOT BELIEIVING isnt a BELIEF SYSTEM.
Originally posted by Bardock42
No, there is a difference.People are killed because of Religion..
They are not killed because of Atheism.
Nonsense.
Originally posted by Bardock42
I mean, every rational being can see the difference. When you talk to a Religious fundamentalist they say "I killed them because God says we should kill the nonbelievers"
Yeah.
Originally posted by Bardock42
if you talk to a communist they'd say " He got killed for the good of the community" or something, they would not say "He got killed because atheism told me to kill him".
Yeah because Communism says that religon is the opium of the masses. Therefore he is doing it because his doctrine tells him to do it. The same way that the Quran says kill non-believers.
Originally posted by Bardock42
You keep bringing up that point
I and loads of other people including the maker of the program.
Originally posted by Bardock42
at we
Whose we?
Originally posted by Bardock42
keep telling you that it is just not logically the same.
If you look for differences you will find them. Identical twins have differences as well. Of course there are differences. 🙄
Originally posted by Bardock42
The person that made that documentary by the way, somehow assumes that just because he sees no difference between a scientific probable and a scientific improbable there is no difference.
I'll have to watch it again but I dont think so. From what I gathered in the whole series is that he thought that science was more rational but religon had its good points.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Atheists themselves believe not in God because it is scientifically improbable and they usually are not trying to kill people in the name of their believe and they are not using legislature to forbid people to believe in what they want.
Well again theres Communism....
Originally posted by Bardock42
The belief that there is no God is ultimately much different from organized Religion, even if that documentary tries to imply different.
Yeah I guess he doesnt know what hes talking about either. I guess I should just agree with you.
Originally posted by leonheartmm
NOT BELIEIVING isnt a BELIEF SYSTEM.
Communism isnt a belief system?
Originally posted by Alfheim
Nonsense.Yeah.
Yeah because Communism says that religon is the opium of the masses. Therefore he is doing it because his doctrine tells him to do it. The same way that the Quran says kill non-believers.
I and loads of other people including the maker of the program.
Whose we?
If you look for differences you will find them. Identical twins have differences as well. Of course there are differences. 🙄
I'll have to watch it again but I dont think so. From what I gathered in the whole series is that he thought that science was more rational but religon had its good points.
Well again theres Communism....
Yeah I guess he doesnt know what hes talking about either. I guess I should just agree with you.
Communism isnt a belief system?
When did communism is a system that has no believe in God. But it doesn't kill people because it doesn't have that, but because of other believes.
I mean, be fair here, if a Christian was a fascist, would you say that it is their believe in God that makes them kill Jews or their believe in fascism?
It is in fact two very different things. If you just can't see that we can't really go on talking about it.
I'll have to watch it again but I dont think so. From what I gathered in the whole series is that he thought that science was more rational but religon had its good points.
Well, I took it directly from the documentary, where he said that he can't see a difference between believing that a God started the Big Bang and not believing that, well, scientifically seen there is a difference.
Originally posted by Bardock42
When did communism is a system that has no believe in God. But it doesn't kill people because it doesn't have that, but because of other believes.
Ok the english is a bit mashed up here. Are you saying that its NOT their lack of belief in God that makes them kill?
Originally posted by Bardock42
I mean, be fair here,
I am, I think this is just a classic case of "You dont understand because you dont agree."
Originally posted by Bardock42
if a Christian was a fascist, would you say that it is their believe in God that makes them kill Jews or their believe in fascism?It is in fact two very different things. If you just can't see that we can't really go on talking about it.
Now that depends. Let me summarise your point.
1. Communists may have killed lots of people but they didnt do it in the name of atheism.
2. A Facist Christian kills Jews because of facism not because of Chrisanity BUT...
You are saying that religous people kill because it says so in the Bible for example. Correct?
Its the samething in Communism, part of Communism is that religon is the opuim of the masses and that relgion should be got rid of. So persecuting religous people is what a Communist is supposed to do and Communism is an atheistic belief system. Therefore they are doing it in the name of atheism, the same way a muslim fundies kills because the Quran tells him to.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, I took it directly from the documentary, where he said that he can't see a difference between believing that a God started the Big Bang and not believing that, well, scientifically seen there is a difference.
Well from what I understood is this. The Big Bang isnt a proven fact its just a thoery. Therefore there is no difference between belief in the Big Bang and God because belief in god is a theory as well.
Yes, there is a difference.
The religious people do kill because their Religion tells them to.
Communists don't kill because atheism tells them to. Atheism can't tell them, it is just a standard belief that there is no God. They kill because of Communism. And yes, one part of Communism is the Atheism, but, it is not atheism that said to do it.
You don't see the difference? Honestly?
And again, that's what you understand, there is an enormous difference between a general belief and a scientific theory. The Big Bang is hundreds of times more likely, it actually has evidence speaking for itself. It is a theory, just like Gravity. Are you saying that believing in furry little man that always pull you to the center of the earth is no different to the theory of Gravity?
Originally posted by ADarksideJediI agree.
I have a friend who is an atheist.So I ask him one day why he choose to be one.His answear he has no idea and that he just is.If someone wants to have faith in there religion they should be able to say why they pick a certain religion to come.JM
Though why are you religious?
Also, most atheists have good reason to believe what they believe.
Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
I have a friend who is an atheist.So I ask him one day why he choose to be one.His answear he has no idea and that he just is.If someone wants to have faith in there religion they should be able to say why they pick a certain religion to come.JM
Originally posted by Alfheim
Communism isnt a belief system?
if you count a poltical approach as a belief system, then yes,
But atheism isn't. Atheism is an attribute of certain views; it cannot be a belief itself, by definition. It's a lack of a belief.
Anyway, saying that Communism 'speaks' for atheism is insane, because that is trying to make atheism some sort of defined approach in of itself, which is nonsense.
All that speaks for is Stalin's brand of Communism. The fact that this happened to be atheist is neither here nor there. No-one has ever said that atheism automatically equals good. But the atheists do tend to say that religion normally = bad.