Originally posted by srankmissingnin
It has been stated in Wolverine's narrative at least once that every one of the Hulk's punches liquefy his organs, he just heals before the next blow lands.
That was clearly false in that we've all read stories during which Wolverine needed time to recover from less devastating damage than LIQUIFIED ORGANS.
Originally posted by llagrok
Right.This fight is almost impossible to decide.
Wolverine has been shown needing months to grow a new eye. 2007 grew a pair in hours. We both have feats that support and contradict Wolverine winning this battle, so it's so hard to reach an agreement.
It's not hard. If there are severe inconsistencies in his continuity showing his powers not functioning correctly, then you can't take the obviously wrong feats as cannon.
Bottomline.
Originally posted by MRasheed
1.) The only reason why the ankle wings don't make sense is because some clever and innovative writer hasn't come along yet to explain them.
Oh please! that is such a cop out.. likewise I could very well claim that the only reason these things that don't make sense to you don't make sense is because a writer hasn't come along yet to explain them...
Originally posted by MRasheed
2.) Wolverine is supposed to do impressive feats, that's why he's a superhero. But within the realm of the superhero/sci-fi genre there are rules that are supposed to be upheld. Do not pretend that you don't understand that. A professional athlete with a samurai sword cannot cut through battleship with it because he's not strong enough and the metal of the blade would give out. If the sword was adamantium he STILL wouldn't be able to do it because he would lack the strength needed for the blade to penetrate.
Originally posted by MRasheed
Strength comes from DENSITY of muscle. The stronger someone is the harder their muscles are. Bullets bounce off of Namor's hide (and the Hulk's hide) because their muscles are so dense they are impenetrable. Wolverine is NOT strong enough to penetrate the skin of a being who can benchpress a blue whale. Any depictions of him doing so were based on ignorance and plot induced stupidity from the writers. It should not be allowed here where more logical rules apply.
And logic.. logic is based on a set of rules and principles... obviously in comics those principles are different than in the real world...
Originally posted by Ytse
I didn't ignore anything. And I never said I didn't like Logan's ability to heal. That would make no sense.It's just that his healing factor is portrayed inconsistantly.
Originally posted by MRasheedso we ignore the more consistent higher end showings in place of lower end showings that happen less often because?
That was clearly false in that we've all read stories during which Wolverine needed time to recover from less devastating damage than [b]LIQUIFIED ORGANS. [/B]
Originally posted by Rewmac
Jinzin please, Namor could knock out Wolverine, his abilities allow him to even hurt him bad. Just let's go by when he grabbed Iron Man and he couldn't do a damn thing or go by strenght feats he is much more stronger and durable for Wolverine.
I'm not saying it's impossible for namor to knock logan out... I'm just saying that in a fight it's definitely not likely to happen..
his strength is damn near irrelivent.
and he's anything but too durable for wolverine I would have thought that to be obvious considering that wolverine's stabbed or eviscerated him on 4 out of 4 occassions now.
Originally posted by MRasheed
It's not hard. If there are severe inconsistencies in his continuity showing his powers not functioning correctly, then you can't take the obviously wrong feats as cannon.Bottomline.
and yet:
Originally posted by MRasheed
That was clearly false in that we've all read stories during which Wolverine needed time to recover from less devastating damage than [b]LIQUIFIED ORGANS. [/B]
that's exactly what you did.. 🙄
Originally posted by jinzin
perhaps I was getting ahead of myself then.. it seems like you're trying to argue that namor's ability to knock logan out is going to be more capible than it is in the comics.. His healing factor is inconsistent granted..however there's usually one to several explainations for why and in spite of incosistency we take what goes by majority.
The rules of this forum state we go by what is logical and corresponds to what we know about the characters powers and abilities. If logan pushes his claws through someone's skin whom he's not supposed to be able to, we do not accept that as real no matter how often it's happened. The Marvel writers are human just like the members here. they mess up all the time, especially in these new stories. let's stick to what we know about the character not the inconsistencies.
Originally posted by MRasheed
uh, NO. I was pointing out the inconsistency by showing that if his organs were actually liquifying then he shouldn't be fighting anymore since we've all read stories where he needed significant recovery time from far less damage.
yes we've read even MORE stories where he heals near instantaneously though.. which again corresponds with your ideal that the majority of showings is what sets a standard... so.. "UH YES".
Originally posted by MRasheed
Because they were ignorant.
Originally posted by MRasheed
The rules of this forum state we go by what is logical and corresponds to what we know about the characters powers and abilities. If logan pushes his claws through someone's skin whom he's not supposed to be able to, we do not accept that as real no matter how often it's happened. The Marvel writers are human just like the members here. they mess up all the time, especially in these new stories. let's stick to what we know about the character not the inconsistencies.
and again, "UH YES" you've accepted that spiderman can benchpress trucks and jump to the ground from a rooftop.. logically he can't do these things since an increase in strength doesn't dictate an increase in the amount of bone density he has. bone density is supplemented through trauma so there's no logical explaination that he should do these things without his bones breaking...
likewise.. his organic webbing.. logically there's no place to house the webbing inside his body.. he would need sacks hanging off his arms or in his back for that to work..
likewise.. tony starks original iron man suit was made of.. IRON yet it clung on to him like latex which makes no sense whatsover...
I suppose we just ignore all of these things in place of what makes snese to us?
ooooooorrrr not.. since AGAIN you're subjecting yourself to a fictionalized media and are HENCE SUBJECT TO IT'S LAWS, RULES, and/or lack thereof...
Originally posted by jinzinI didn't say that Wolvie can't stab him. But couple punches then a throw to make him airborne and then full speed smash into the ground or a wall that should do some damage.
I'm not saying it's impossible for namor to knock logan out... I'm just saying that in a fight it's definitely not likely to happen..his strength is damn near irrelivent.
and he's anything but too durable for wolverine I would have thought that to be obvious considering that wolverine's stabbed or eviscerated him on 4 out of 4 occassions now.
Originally posted by jinzin??? WTF, The muscles surrounding your bones are a real point int the whole density. For example if I jump down from 2 meters I might twist my ankle or break my leg, but a guy who can legpress about 500 kilos won't. Because the force of his own weight doesn't effect him as much as it effects me. It's simple physics.
yes we've read even MORE stories where he heals near instantaneously though.. which again corresponds with your ideal that the majority of showings is what sets a standard... so.. "UH YES".So you're ignoring more consistent showings based on a claim to ignorance.. fair enough.. 😛
Show me. 😐
and again, "UH YES" you've accepted that spiderman can benchpress trucks and jump to the ground from a rooftop.. logically he can't do these things since an increase in strength doesn't dictate an increase in the amount of bone density he has. bone density is supplemented through trauma so there's no logical explaination that he should do these things without his bones breaking...
likewise.. his organic webbing.. logically there's no place to house the webbing inside his body.. he would need sacks hanging off his arms or in his back for that to work..
likewise.. tony starks original iron man suit was made of.. IRON yet it clung on to him like latex which makes no sense whatsover...I suppose we just ignore all of these things in place of what makes snese to us?
ooooooorrrr not.. since AGAIN you're subjecting yourself to a fictionalized media and are HENCE SUBJECT TO IT'S LAWS, RULES, and/or lack thereof...
Originally posted by jinzin
bone density is supplemented through trauma so there's no logical explaination that he should do these things without his bones breaking...
What does that even mean? What trauma do we experience as our bone naturally grows denser from infancy to childhood? What are we slamming babies on the floor all day so their bones will become denser?
Originally posted by jinzin
I suppose we just ignore all of these things in place of what makes snese to us?
Exactly. If it is illogical from a physics standpoint and does not make sense we ignore it. It's place in continuity is born only out of the ignorance of the writers involved and should have no place in this battles forum.
Sense and logic should easily trump popularity based power-ups and feats performed out of the stupidity of the storyteller.
Originally posted by Rewmac
I didn't say that Wolvie can't stab him. But couple punches then a throw to make him airborne and then full speed smash into the ground or a wall that should do some damage.
probably... of course there's the little problem with the fact that
A) it won't be enough damage.
B) wolverine's a better fighter than namor so that many blows unanswered is a bit unrealistic in terms of character portrayal.
and C) Wolverine's as fast if not faster than namor with a definite reach advantage..
Originally posted by jinzinNamor punch>>>>>>deer kick.
probably... of course there's the little problem with the fact that
A) it won't be enough damage.
B) wolverine's a better fighter than namor so that many blows unanswered is a bit unrealistic in terms of character portrayal.
and C) Wolverine's as fast if not faster than namor with a definite reach advantage..
Namor one shots him.
durfist
Originally posted by Rewmac
??? WTF, The muscles surrounding your bones are a real point int the whole density. For example if I jump down from 2 meters I might twist my ankle or break my leg, but a guy who can legpress about 500 kilos won't. Because the force of his own weight doesn't effect him as much as it effects me. It's simple physics.
for instance, a smaller man with low muscle density can jump off a two story building without hurting himself just by knowing how to land.. it has relatively little to do with strength per se.
sigh... you don't get it....
any and all showings of spiderman taking superhuman punches and or damage without having his skeletal structure reduced to debris is realistic.. no matter how strong his muscles are; with his body size the bones can't take that kind of force..
"simple biology" dictates this...