Yoda v.s RotS Anakin

Started by kamikz3 pages

"Wrong".

He said that it was if he had not been wounded on Mustafa, I've never heard anything else. And he doesn't need to spell it out to you, he has talked about "IF Anakin never got wounded" so many times that anyone who watches it will get WHY Anakin could beat him had he not sustained those wounds.

You're gonna have to show me the exact quotes of Lucas saying "He can take him" without him even mentioning the Mustafar incident.

Oh and btw, we might have missunderstood eachother. Are you ONLY thinking in a saber match? Cause then I agree, Anakin does have a chance against Sidious. I thought you meant that Anakin was superior to Sidious overall, which was what the quote was about (the one GL said). So that one does not hold any ground, but if you are arguing swordsmanship then I agree.

[continued from the previous page]

Furthermore, you apparently haven't realized that I'm not stating that Kit would have done the same against Anakin. I'm saying that Obi-wan would have been butchered by Sidious just as Kit was; just as Anakin would be if they ever truly fought, even in a lightsaber fight.

Wrong. Someone who can outduel and defeat Count Dooku in lightsaber combat won't be "butchered" by Sidious. In fact, given how effortless the feat was, Anakin would defeat Sidious or Yoda in lightsaber combat.

Obi-Wan "butchered" by Sidious? Unless Sidious could use the Force, hardly. Dooku couldn't do it either.

Yoda has knowledge of every single lightsaber form as well as more than 10x Sidious' experince and has presumably faced far more opponents.

That's pretty amazing... and this ten times superior experience didn't permit him to kill Sidious. The disparity in their age, experience, and knowledge should translate to Yoda "pwning" pretty much anybody. Sadly, it doesn't. Experience means a hell of a lot in technique, but means precious little to actual power.

Sidious has until Yoda never fought an opponent of extreme caliber. The strongest person Sidious ever sparred as of ROTS was Maul, cause he was likely the only person.

This is true, but again... it's irrelevant.

Yoda on the other hand has sparred with Mace and Dooku, each of which are beyond the strongest person Sidious has ever sparred.

...If we were basing our arguments on irrelevant issues, you'd undoubtably win; but this isn't the case. Sidious's 'experience' in comparison to Yoda does not mean anything - because in their confrontation, Yoda didn't pwn Sidious.

Any fighter knows that when training you don't get better by fighter people half as good as you, you get better by fighting people who can really challenge you and push you to your limits.

You must not be a fighter, because what you're saying is absolute bullshit. Yoda's eight centuries > Sidious's six decades would translate to a vast disparity between quality and refinement of swordsmanship if greater experience = greater skill. You're trying to fellate Yoda's experience without putting it into perspective.

Sidious had no one who could do that because of his isolation, not because he was simply more powerful than everyone else. That's a massive advantage for Yoda.

And yet this "massive advantage" didn't manifest itself during the actual fight. What the hell does that mean, I wonder.

Also note the simply fact that Sidious fled to the Senate Pods where the battle would swith from a lightsaber fight to a more Force-oriented one.

Could it be because Darth Sidious is the smarter fighter, and opted for a long ranged assault? That would certainly coincide with his goals: to end the fight and live to fight again. Saber-to-saber against a person who is his equal? Big risk for Sidious.

The probable reason for this is Yoda was too strong with the saber, so Sidious fought him where he's best.

Actually, the most probable reason would be that Sidious fled to try a different type of assault. Obviously the lightsaber battle wasn't getting either of them anywhere, the difference being: Sidious is smarter and Yoda's primary source of offense and defense is his lightsaber.

Furthermore, they are apparent equals and in order for that to happen, they have to be equal in Force powers and in lightsaber skills.

Why would they have to be equals for my argument to work?

You're missing the point. Yoda and Sidious are equals, but Sith and Jedi don't necessarily have to be. Anakin isn't 'more powerful' than they are, but he is the stronger and more capable swordsman.

You really think Anakin would beat Yoda? Do you plan to raise any points for Anakin being better of your own or just continue arguing the points that I've already raised, cause I frankly don't see a thing shown here that puts Anakin as better. You can't just attack my case, you have to build one of your own.

I really do think Anakin would beat Yoda in a lightsaber battle. I think Anakin could beat anyone in the movies in a lightsaber battle short of special or exenuating circumstances.

I am with yoda. He was stated as the greatest jedi ever at that time (and anakin was a jedi knight). Also, anakin could have killed dooku but yoda was not having much trouble with him, and as soon as dooku fought him for a while, he decided to run instead of being killed, while he though he could beat anakin.

Yoda wins in all aspects, even though the difference wouldn't be that big.

He was stated as the greatest jedi ever at that time

That doesn't mean that he'd win in every category, just that he is more pwoerful overall.
(and anakin was a jedi knight).

Oh yeah, he was, and Coleman Trebor is a Jedi Master and a Council Member and Anakin would curbstomp him. The fact that Anakin is only a Knight is hardly proof that he'd lose.
and as soon as dooku fought him for a while, he decided to run instead of being killed, while he though he could beat anakin.

Against Yoda he ran because he was smart, and realised that he couldn't win. Against Anakin, Sidious had given him instructions to fight him, and if, by chance, Anakin won he said that he would intervene and save Dooku's life. That's why Dooku looks so surprised when Palpatine says "kill him." Personally, if I were Dooku and my master had just betrayed me, my last words would gave been "He's the Sith Lord!"

1. Anakin
2. Yoda
3. Yoda

Personally, if I were Dooku and my master had just betrayed me, my last words would gave been "He's the Sith Lord!"

Precisely. Dooku's silence reflects poor writing and directing on Lucas's part (proving that though he is a masterful storyteller, he is a sub-par director). "Treachery is the way of the Sith", and Dooku knows that - it becomes his mantra in the RotS novelization - so he should have expected that he was expendable, and even if he didn't, Dooku has absolutely no excuse to not turn Sidious in, since he is also a treacherous, dishonorable hypocrite like his master.

Really, this is Count Dooku. When would he ever be surprised to the point of being speechless?

Originally posted by Gideon

Really, this is Count Dooku. When would he ever be surprised to the point of being speechless?

I don't know, maybe when he's about to die?

Maybe GL tought it would be against his noble background.

Originally posted by RocasAtoll
I don't know, maybe when he's about to die?

...Which one could argue would be the last place for Dooku to be 'speechless'. Darthsith is right, Dooku had every reason to turn Palpatine over to the Jedi now that he knew Palpatine was going to betray him. Dooku strikes me as the 'I'll-take-you-with-me!' type. Not saying that this would necessarily work (lmao, known Sith Lord and criminal against the word of the Supreme Chancellor?), but he'd sure as hell seem the type to try.

Yeah, and at least then the Jedi could have been a little bit on guard. They didn't believe him about Sidious controlling the senate but they still kept a closer eye on the senate. They wouldn't believe him again but they could keep a closer eye on the chancellor, especially seeing as they were beginning to suspect that he was trying to overthrow the Jedi anyways.

Solidus wins.

Originally posted by Nikkolas
Solidus wins.

😕

Anakin CAN win the lightsaber duel, but its not a 100% guaranteed victory...but he can do it, no doubts there. The other two he would get pwned though.

Originally posted by Nikkolas
Solidus wins.

Nah, Solidus sucks monkey nuts.

Actually, in an all out battle, it would probably go to Anakin. Anakin is the kind of guy who goes straight with sabers, plus Yoda doesn't have any offensive Force powers that'll help him, and I don't think Yoda will be able to handle Anakin's raw power and his masterfulness of the Djem So.

Yoda would definitely win in the force duel.

Originally posted by vader11
Yoda would definitely win in the force duel.

Nobody ever disagreed with that...

Just one thing: wasn't stated that only yoda or possibly windu (due to vaadpad obviously i think) could win against sidious?

Originally posted by ((The_Anomaly))

Nah, Solidus sucks monkey nuts.

Nu uh!!!

Originally posted by kamhal
Just one thing: wasn't stated that only yoda or possibly windu (due to vaadpad obviously i think) could win against sidious?

This has nothing to do with the thread. However, Anakin as in RotS could also prove to be a very, very tough match for Sidious in saber combat.

Ok, what about the fact yoda sent obi-wan fight anakin instead of sidious, since obi-wan wasn't powerful enough to beat sidious? Or why sidious said "Darth vader WILL become more powerful then either of us".

It was pretty obvious in the movie that the fight between yoda and sidious was the fight between the top jedi vs the top sith. I think this says something.