Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by [BAW]Endrict
The last thread was crap....made new one.Apocalypse
Onslaught
Mr. Sinister
Omega Red
Nimrod
Classic juggernaut
Magneto
Dark PhoenixApollo
Midnighter
Doctor
Jack
Jenny Q
Jenny S
Swift
EngineerCan the A-Team win this?
This matchup is so bad it should scream "spite thread"
Dark Phoenix and Onslaught are both essentially unstoppable. They'd wipe out the authority in seconds.
even without them, Apocalypse has an unlimited supply of powers to choose from, and celestial level technology. Sinister, Nimrod and Classic Juggernaut are essentially invulnerable.
The authority might have a shot if this team consisted of just Omega Red, as he kind of sucks.
horrible, horrible thread. Why not just put the authority vs. the Sinestro Corps? they MIGHT have a shot there
Re: Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by Space M ummy
This matchup is so bad it should scream "spite thread"Dark Phoenix and Onslaught are both essentially unstoppable. They'd wipe out the authority in seconds.
They're really the only threats though.
Originally posted by Space M ummy
even without them, Apocalypse has an unlimited supply of powers to choose from, and celestial level technology. Sinister, Nimrod and Classic Juggernaut are essentially invulnerable.
Apoc hardly uses his powers anymore and even the ones that he does have are nothing next to the Doc and Jennys. The tech comes from the celestials but it hardly put the user on their level.
Sinister is far from invulnerable and the others can be sent to another dimension.
Re: Re: Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
They're really the only threats though.
I wouldn't go that far- but their powers are so far above the levels that the authority is at, it's ridiculous to have them there. you may as well put "pre retcon beyonder" in there with them, because they have just as much of a chance against that thing. (read: none at all, dead in nanoseconds.)
Apoc hardly uses his powers anymore and even the ones that he does have are nothing next to the Doc and Jennys. The tech comes from the celestials but it hardly put the user on their level.
Poor writing may mean we rarely see apocalypse use his abilities to his fullest, but he does most certainly still have them-
Apocalypse's full extent of powers remain to be revealed, especially to the extent of which powers have since been augmented by alien technology. Apocalypse claims to have control of his body on the molecular level-- allowing him to shape change and elongate with virtually unlimited range, to increase density and allow his body to mimic metals and armors, to teleport, and to be virtually immune to the effects of age. Apocalypse can also increase his strength to levels surpassing that of the Hulk, grow to giant sizes, and gain the power of flight, sometimes through turning his arms into wings or jets. Apocalypse can also transform himself into a variety of human disguises.He has exhibited energy absorbing and projecting abilities in the past. Apocalypse has been termed an "External," due to his mutant ability of immortality. Briefly, Apocalypse has shown potential to be a powerful psionic.
Control of the body down the molecular level? psionic powers? energy absorption and projection? Size manipulation? Strength EXCEEDING hulk levels? Serious business. The doctor MIGHT be able to matter manipulate apocalypse, but that's debatable.
Sinister is far from invulnerable and the others can be sent to another dimension. [/B]
Sinister's powers also include total control over his body- Classic Sinister was completely invulnerable to everything short of cyclops' optic blasts, and even that was retconned into a "ruse" by sinister- Cyclops' powers are totally ineffective on him now. Nothing has been shown to ever really do serious damage to sinister.
In his last appearance his powers appeared to be breaking down and not allowing him to shapeshift/teleport, but I have no idea what was going on there. I'm assuming for this fight he's at his usual levels.
The Authority has no less than 3 people with telepathy skills, and are mind-linked during battles, so no one's really going down telepathically.
I have no problem with the Authority losing this match, but it always pains me to see people who obviously don't know what they're talking about but like to appear confident. If you haven't read much Authority, and are authoritatively asserting an opinion, I'm likely talking to you.
Anyway, Angie's f*cked against Magneto, and Jenny and The Doctor would be working overtime against people who are likely their equal. It would have to be in a city for Jack to be useful...otherwise he's worthless. If it is in a city though, it would be a good fight. Toronto, perhaps, punching, exploding, and generally harassing them would kill a few outright and detain others indefinitely (Juggs)....and Apoc isn't any better than Apollo.
DP/Onslaught vs. Jenny/Doctor would determine the thing though. So whoever you think wins there. Swift, Midnighter, Omega Red, and probably Sinister are all non-factors. The rest can stalemate for a while. I only lean toward the villians because Angie's screwed, and Mags can definitely help his team against the big guns.
Originally posted by DigiMark007
The Authority has no less than 3 people with telepathy skills, and are mind-linked during battles, so no one's really going down telepathically.
3 people with telepathy versus Onslaught and Dark Phoenix??? you're insane if you don't think they'll be mind wiped in seconds here. I've read the authority, contrary to what you might think. there's no telepathic feats anywhere that put them anywhere close to the level of those two.
Don't forget: Onslaught is Franklin Richards + Nate Gray + Professor X + Magneto.
Dark Phoenix is a TP/TK so powerful, it EATS STARS. Dark Phoenix most certainly could simply nova the sun and wipe out everyone here. The authority would not survive that.
Apocalypse and Sinister are also telepaths by the way- but I don't think it even matters at this point.
I have no problem with the Authority losing this match, but it always pains me to see people who obviously don't know what they're talking about but like to appear confident. If you haven't read much Authority, and are authoritatively asserting an opinion, I'm likely talking to you.Anyway, Angie's f*cked against Magneto, and Jenny and The Doctor would be working overtime against people who are likely their equal. It would have to be in a city for Jack to be useful...otherwise he's worthless. If it is in a city though, it would be a good fight. Toronto, perhaps, punching, exploding, and generally harassing them would kill a few outright and detain others indefinitely (Juggs)....and Apoc isn't any better than Apollo.
DP/Onslaught vs. Jenny/Doctor would determine the thing though. So whoever you think wins there. Swift, Midnighter, Omega Red, and probably Sinister are all non-factors. The rest can stalemate for a while. I only lean toward the villians because Angie's screwed, and Mags can definitely help his team against the big guns. [/B]
er..your problem here is that you're assuming that anyone on the authority's level can "stalemate" dark phoenix or onslaught. either one of those two would eliminate everyone short of the doctor inside of a few seconds. Dark phoenix in particular is certainly capable of reducing even a city the size of new york to ashes in moments. Jack isn't a factor at all.
Then it's The Doctor (or Jenny) versus the entire villain team. it's not even a contest.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Poor writing may mean we rarely see apocalypse use his abilities to his fullest, but he does most certainly still have them-Control of the body down the molecular level? psionic powers? energy absorption and projection? Size manipulation? Strength EXCEEDING hulk levels? Serious business. The doctor MIGHT be able to matter manipulate apocalypse, but that's debatable.
The Doctor can convert matter into music. Thats better than molecular level control of matter.
He has made himself huge in the past so being giant would hardly help.
Apoc's strength doesn't exceed Hulk's by any margin nor would it become a factor in this fight.
Apocalypse has absolutely no chance of taking him down 😬
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Sinister's powers also include total control over his body- Classic Sinister was completely invulnerable to everything short of cyclops' optic blasts, and even that was retconned into a "ruse" by sinister- Cyclops' powers are totally ineffective on him now. Nothing has been shown to ever really do serious damage to sinister.In his last appearance his powers appeared to be breaking down and not allowing him to shapeshift/teleport, but I have no idea what was going on there. I'm assuming for this fight he's at his usual levels.
My mistake. But he still lacks protection from BFR or the ungodly sort of mindrape the Doctor has been shown to be capable of.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
The Doctor can convert matter into music. Thats better than molecular level control of matter.
Matter into music? not to bring real world physics into a comic debate, but all that is would be converting matter into energy, specifically sound vibrations. The surfer could probably pull that off.
Onslaught has all of Franklin Richard's reality warping powers. Onslaught made a second sun from NOTHING. Franklin Made an entire universe. IIRC, The Doctor can only extend his abilities so far before doing massive damage to either himself or the environment.
Onslaught's reality warping >>>>>>> the Doctor's. Dark Phoenix Also has essentially unlimited matter manipulation as well.
He has made himself huge in the past so being giant would hardly help.
Apoc's strength doesn't exceed Hulk's by any margin nor would it become a factor in this fight.
The quote I posted was from Marvel.com. If they say Apocalypse's strength can exceed hulk levels, that's certainly the case. It isn't wikipedia. Also remember that Apocalypse was able to put Hulk in a choke hold, and Hulk had to ASK to be let go. Apocalypse is strong as hell.
My mistake. But he still lacks protection from BFR or the ungodly sort of mindrape the Doctor has been shown to be capable of.
The Doctor isn't going to be mindraping anyone. Onslaught and DP's psionic abilities outclass his by an order of magnitude. If anything the doctor is going to be very, very busy not having his mind fried.
BFR isn't an issue, as either onslaught or DP can cross dimensions and bring them back if they have to.
any way you slice it, the authority is F*cked here.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Onslaught has all of Franklin Richard's reality warping powers. Onslaught made a second sun from NOTHING. Franklin Made an entire universe. IIRC, The Doctor can only extend his abilities so far before doing massive damage to either himself or the environment.Onslaught's reality warping >>>>>>> the Doctor's. Dark Phoenix Also has essentially unlimited matter manipulation as well.
The Doctor did create a universe once 😖hifty:
Yeah Onslaught and DP tip the scales completely to the
Originally posted by Space M ummy
The quote I posted was from Marvel.com. If they say Apocalypse's strength can exceed hulk levels, that's certainly the case. It isn't wikipedia. Also remember that Apocalypse was able to put Hulk in a choke hold, and Hulk had to ASK to be let go. Apocalypse is strong as hell.
Last I checked Marvel.com had IronMan with 7 for all his stats. Bios mean jack.
Not to mention Hulk wasn't out muscled Apoc just had much better leverage.
Originally posted by Space M ummy
The Doctor isn't going to be mindraping anyone. Onslaught and DP's psionic abilities outclass his by an order of magnitude. If anything the doctor is going to be very, very busy not having his mind fried.BFR isn't an issue, as either onslaught or DP can cross dimensions and bring them back if they have to.
any way you slice it, the authority is F*cked here.
Again Onslaught and DP are really the only things that let the villians win IMO. Without them the team is screwed.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by Symmetric ChaosThe Doctor did create a universe once 😖hifty:Yeah Onslaught and DP tip the scales completely to the
that was kind of my point. Onslaught and DP are so far above everyone else on the list it's a mystery why they're there in the first place.
[quote]Last I checked Marvel.com had IronMan with 7 for all his stats. Bios mean jack.
I ignore the "stats" in the corner, as they really aren't well defined- kind of like the old marvel trading cards back in the day, a "7" could simply mean something like "class 100 or over" "genius or over" "black belt or over" etc. In that case, Iron man WOULD have a 7 in all stats, depending on what armor he was wearing at the time.
The character histories are a little more reliable, I think. But that's a debate for a different time. 🙂
Not to mention Hulk wasn't out muscled Apoc just had much better leverage.
It's the freaking hulk. Leverage shouldn't even be an issue. In any case, Apoc had the technology to increase the hulk's strength when he turned him into "war hulk." If he could do it to hulk, it stands to reason he could amp his own strength to incredible levels if he felt like doing so.
Again though, different debate for a different time.
Again Onslaught and DP are really the only things that let the villians win IMO. Without them the team is screwed. [/B]
without the doctor, the authority is screwed. what's your point? they're in there, he's in there, this fight is lopsidedly bad.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by Space M ummy
that was kind of my point. Onslaught and DP are so far above everyone else on the list it's a mystery why they're there in the first place.I ignore the "stats" in the corner, as they really aren't well defined- kind of like the old marvel trading cards back in the day, a "7" could simply mean something like "class 100 or over" "genius or over" "black belt or over" etc. In that case, Iron man WOULD have a 7 in all stats, depending on what armor he was wearing at the time.
The character histories are a little more reliable, I think. But that's a debate for a different time. 🙂
It's the freaking hulk. Leverage shouldn't even be an issue. In any case, Apoc had the technology to increase the hulk's strength when he turned him into "war hulk." If he could do it to hulk, it stands to reason he could amp his own strength to incredible levels if he felt like doing so.
Again though, different debate for a different time.
without the doctor, the authority is screwed. what's your point? they're in there, he's in there, this fight is lopsidedly bad.
It had seemed to be your contention that Onslaught and DP weren't the only thing that made this a win for the villains.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Xmen villains vs Authority
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
It had seemed to be your contention that Onslaught and DP weren't the only thing that made this a win for the villains.
they're the only thing that make this a horrible curbstomp.
The rest of the team is nothing to sneeze at- classic apocalypse and sinister are really, really powerful, as are magneto and nimrod but it would at least be a fight.
If it was the authority (minus the doctor) versus the team (minus DP and Onslaught) I'd give the team the majority.