Exactly. He judges speed by how many blurry lines and afterimages there are, not by, you know, how much distance someone can cross in a certain amount of time.
Funny note: Among a large cadre of DBZ fans, SSJ4 form is actually considered weaker than SSJ3, since GT (being a non-canon piece of trash) has a ton of low-end showings and very few impressive feats compared to the original DB/Z series.
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Exactly. He judges speed by how many blurry lines and afterimages there are, not by, you know, how much distance someone can cross in a certain amount of time.Funny note: Among a large cadre of DBZ fans, SSJ4 form is actually considered weaker than SSJ3, since GT (being a non-canon piece of trash) has a ton of low-end showings and very few impressive feats compared to the original DB/Z series.
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I also think that Manga/Anime chars appear stronger because they have only limited appearances. Sure Goku might be the most or second most powerful being in his Universe but his Universe is far smaller and has far fewer chars then say DC or Marvel. Supreme beings from Manga/Anime might be considered allpowerful in their respectiv although limited and quite "new" (compared to old Companies like DC and Marvel) Universe but they would be just small flies or in the best case the peers of other beings similar to them. It's like with Dr. Manhattan from Watchmen, he is like a God in his respective Universe but in Marvel or DC it's most likely that Superman or Thor would kick his ass. The same can be said of the supreme beings from Animes and Mangas or the most powerful heroes. They are tough but they lack the history, feats and scale of beings "living" in a huge Omniverse like Marvel/DC, with thousands of other named and known superpowered beings.
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Funny note: Among a large cadre of DBZ fans, SSJ4 form is actually considered weaker than SSJ3, since GT (being a non-canon piece of trash) has a ton of low-end showings and very few impressive feats compared to the original DB/Z series.
But then again, who am I kidding. This is DBZ/GT we're talking about .
Originally posted by TheGodKillerSSJ3 was too much for Kid Goku's small body to handle, thus he was not able to tap into its full potential during GT, iirc. However, as lame as GT was, I do believe some of the main good guys (Goku in particular) were intended to be stronger than they were in the DBZ days. For instance, Goku said that base form Rildo was more powerful than Buu was when they fought-- and Goku had the clear upper hand on that version of Rildo, as a base-level Saiyan. Aside from that, Goku had the clear upper hand on final form Rildo as a standard SSJ (sans Rildo's metal transmutation attack, that is.) Anyway, if base form Rildo=/>Buu, final form Rildo>>>>Buu.
In the Baby saga, the SS3 form's limits were glaringly obvious,
That said, it took Goku's SSJ3-level power to contend with Buu-level power in DBZ. In GT, it took Goku's base-level Saiyan power to contend with Buu-level power, and took his standard SSJ power to contend with Buu[+++]-level power. Essentially, his base-level Saiyan GT form is no less than equal to his SSJ3 DBZ form, and his SSJ1 GT form is definitely > his SSJ3 DBZ form (IF what he said about base form Rildo's power is accurate, of course.) So yeah, by that same line of thinking, SSJ4 Goku would be VASTLY superior to SSJ3 DBZ Goku.
My opinion.
Originally posted by -Pr-
When I remove threads from the top to keep it neat.or
When I bloody well please.
Pick one. uhuh
You forget your place, Pig:
Originally posted by -Pr-
"I, Paul the Pig, bastard son of Jor-El, kneel before Delph-Zod, the once and true Mod of this Forum".
Your soul are belong to Illadelph!!
Originally posted by Galan007
SSJ3 was too much for Kid Goku's small body to handle, thus he was not able to tap into its full potential during GT, iirc. However, as lame as GT was, I do believe some of the main good guys (Goku in particular) were intended to be stronger than they were in the DBZ days. For instance, Goku said that base form Rildo was more powerful than Buu was when they fought-- and Goku had the clear upper hand on that version of Rildo, as a base-level Saiyan. Aside from that, Goku had the clear upper hand on final form Rildo as a standard SSJ (sans Rildo's metal transmutation attack, that is.) Anyway, if base form Rildo=/>Buu, final form Rildo>>>>Buu.That said, it took Goku's SSJ3-level power to contend with Buu-level power in DBZ. In GT, it took Goku's base-level Saiyan power to contend with Buu-level power, and took his standard SSJ power to contend with Buu[+++]-level power. Essentially, his base-level Saiyan GT form is no less than equal to his SSJ3 DBZ form, and his SSJ1 GT form is definitely > his SSJ3 DBZ form (IF what he said about base form Rildo's power is accurate, of course.) So yeah, by that same line of thinking, SSJ4 Goku would be VASTLY superior to SSJ3 DBZ Goku.
My opinion.
Yeah, they might have been intended to be stronger, but when you look at the actual feats... they're really not. As GT is not canon to Z, most people consider the GT version of SSJ3 to be completely unconnected to the canon version... and they take the comment about Rildo being stronger than Buu about as seriously as when Batman said 10-eyed man was the most dangerous guy in the world.
Originally posted by Endless MikeDon't get me wrong, I hated GT with a passion. I'm just saying that despite it being non-canon to DB/Z, I still believe the intention of GT was to have a few characters that were more powerful than their DBZ incarnations-- and based on statements, Goku seemed to be one of those.
Yeah, they might have been intended to be stronger, but when you look at the actual feats... they're really not. As GT is not canon to Z, most people consider the GT version of SSJ3 to be completely unconnected to the canon version... and they take the comment about Rildo being stronger than Buu about as seriously as when Batman said 10-eyed man was the most dangerous guy in the world.
But you're definitely right about the feats he displayed in GT not stacking up to those in DBZ.
Prime Abstract/Gods:
Arceus(pokemon)
Spirit King (Bleach)
God/the Gate (FMA)
Hikari (this ugly, yet beautiful world)
Big Venus (Big O)
Cosmic Owl (Adventure Time)
High heralds
Akuto (demon king Daimao)
Kazuma (Kaze no Stigma)
Yuki (Haruhi)
The Ice King (Adventure Time)
Mid herald
Van (GunxSword)
Ichigo (Bleach)
Naruto (Naruto Shippuden)
Ranma & Ryoga (Ranma 1/2)
Devil Jin & Devil Kazuya (Tekken)
The Megazord (MMPR)
Atem (Yu-gi-oh)
Low Herald
Vash the Stampede (Trigun)
Captain Hero (Drawn Together)
Luffy (One Piece)
Berzerk Fury/Fuerer (Zoids)
High Meta
Edward Elric (FMA)
Kululu (Keroro Gunso)
Moka (RosarioxVampire)
Ben (Ben 10)
Low Meta
Jason (Mighty Morphing Power Rangers)
Mugen & Jin (Samurai Champloo)
Originally posted by pym-ftw
Prime Abstract/Gods:
Arceus(pokemon)
Spirit King (Bleach)
God/the Gate (FMA)
Hikari (this ugly, yet beautiful world)
Big Venus (Big O)
Cosmic Owl (Adventure Time)High heralds
Akuto (demon king Daimao)
Kazuma (Kaze no Stigma)
Yuki (Haruhi)
The Ice King (Adventure Time)Mid herald
Van (GunxSword)
Ichigo (Bleach)
Naruto (Naruto Shippuden)
Ranma & Ryoga (Ranma 1/2)
Devil Jin & Devil Kazuya (Tekken)
The Megazord (MMPR)
Atem (Yu-gi-oh)Low Herald
Vash the Stampede (Trigun)
Captain Hero (Drawn Together)
Luffy (One Piece)
Berzerk Fury/Fuerer (Zoids)High Meta
Edward Elric (FMA)
Kululu (Keroro Gunso)
Moka (RosarioxVampire)
Ben (Ben 10)Low Meta
Jason (Mighty Morphing Power Rangers)
Mugen & Jin (Samurai Champloo)
Mid herald is the tier of people like Wonder Woman, Beta Ray Bill, Gladiator and Flash. People like Devil Jin/Kazuya/Naruto don't really stack up at all. I don't know much about Bleach, but judging from threads I don't see how Ichigo does either.
Mugen and Jin are like....mid street. I don't recall anything low meta from Jason either.
The rest I either agree with or don't know enough about to comment.
The Tekken devils are at least mach one
Hit hard enough to cause shockwaves that crack stone
Cleaved a mountain in half
Ichigo has city buster level power
He is super sonic, with hyper sonic reflex speed
He is invisible, and able to attack the soul directly
Near instantaneous regen, and probably class 25
With a magically Sharp sword
Naruto is super sonic aswell with city buster+ attacks
Near instant regen, he has the ability summon high meta giant frogs
He can create up to 10k clones of himself
The megazord may be bumped down to low herald I will come up for some feats for it later
Mugen has legitimate super strength, and Jin fought mugen to a stalemate
I put captain America at low meta BTW
Jason on two Seperate occasions has tanked city block buster level attacks, one from the megazord, and the ultrasaurus...
He has also fallen multiple times approx. 50 stories from the top of the megazord
He has soloed lord Zed on multiple occasions
Originally posted by pym-ftw
The ice king's feats;Lived for multiple Days with his heart removed
Created/survived a planet wide freeze
He is an expert alchemist capable of creating poisons that even affect magical beings
His lightning can bring robots to life
He functions as a Coaw/Loki
His magical nature kept him alive with his heart gone from his body.
Not much of a "feat" since his power, is well, ice.
Decent prep but isn't really much to talk about.
Again, magical nature, and the robot was crappy.
Don't know how you got "Loki", even Finn calls him a "minor villain".
Ice King regularly gets his butt handed to him by a kid. 😛 Magical in nature yeah, but still nowhere near herald. I'd say low meta at best.
Originally posted by pym-ftw
The Tekken devils are at least mach one
Hit hard enough to cause shockwaves that crack stone
Cleaved a mountain in halfIchigo has city buster level power
He is super sonic, with hyper sonic reflex speed
He is invisible, and able to attack the soul directly
Near instantaneous regen, and probably class 25
With a magically Sharp swordNaruto is super sonic aswell with city buster+ attacks
Near instant regen, he has the ability summon high meta giant frogs
He can create up to 10k clones of himselfThe megazord may be bumped down to low herald I will come up for some feats for it later
Mugen has legitimate super strength, and Jin fought mugen to a stalemate
I put captain America at low meta BTWJason on two Seperate occasions has tanked city block buster level attacks, one from the megazord, and the ultrasaurus...
He has also fallen multiple times approx. 50 stories from the top of the megazord
He has soloed lord Zed on multiple occasions
City level & "super sonic" (based on drawn lines and flashes?) =/= mid herald.
That shit's meta
Originally posted by pym-ftw
The ice king's feats;Lived for multiple Days with his heart removed
Created/survived a planet wide freeze
He is an expert alchemist capable of creating poisons that even affect magical beings
His lightning can bring robots to life
He functions as a Coaw/Loki
Originally posted by pym-ftw
The Tekken devils are at least mach one
Hit hard enough to cause shockwaves that crack stone
Cleaved a mountain in halfIchigo has city buster level power
He is super sonic, with hyper sonic reflex speed
He is invisible, and able to attack the soul directly
Near instantaneous regen, and probably class 25
With a magically Sharp swordNaruto is super sonic aswell with city buster+ attacks
Near instant regen, he has the ability summon high meta giant frogs
He can create up to 10k clones of himselfMugen has legitimate super strength, and Jin fought mugen to a stalemate
I put captain America at low meta BTWJason on two Seperate occasions has tanked city block buster level attacks, one from the megazord, and the ultrasaurus...
He has also fallen multiple times approx. 50 stories from the top of the megazord
He has soloed lord Zed on multiple occasions
Mugen had a one episode showing that was wildly outside his normal depiction. It belongs in the same PIS box as Batman hurting Wonder Woman. Jin and Mugen would get smashed by the high street tier, and would get utterly humiliated by the low-meta tier.
I watched Power Rangers as a child in the 90s, so I'll admit my memory is hazy on Jason. I'd have to see those again.