Janus77 say's "in a neutral universe there would be no such nonsense as "The Speedforce". Flash would simply be another Faster Than Light character.
Thanos would pawn him soooooo badly all DC would shudder. a simple pimp slap upside the head and Flash' head goes tumbling into outerspace.
Thanos' reaction times and perception >>>> Silver Surfer's FTL speeds >> Flash at his very best".
Originally posted by CaptainStoic
Janus77 say's "in a neutral universe there would be no such nonsense as "The Speedforce". Flash would simply be another Faster Than Light character.Thanos would pawn him soooooo badly all DC would shudder. a simple pimp slap upside the head and Flash' head goes tumbling into outerspace.
Thanos' reaction times and perception >>>> Silver Surfer's FTL speeds >> Flash at his very best".
Janus vs Long Established (and written down) Forum Rules
. . .
Yeah
The Speed Force is greter than Sentry, I concede to this, but Bart in his normal form is not the Speed Force... in neutral territory he, like Janus77 pointed out is just another character that can move at light speed or a little better. Which is in Sentry's range, or do you think that someone sent through a wormhole to parts unknown could get back to earth as fast as he did?
Originally posted by CaptainStoic
The Speed Force is greter than Sentry, I concede to this, but Bart in his normal form is not the Speed Force... in neutral territory he, like Janus77 pointed out is just another character that can move at light speed or a little better. Which is in Sentry's range, or do you think that someone sent through a wormhole to parts unknown could get back to earth as fast as he did?
1. Neither you or Janus know shit about the speed force. Bart and Wally are wayyyyyyyy beyond light speed. 🙄 Sentry won't even touch them.
2. If the speed force is outside help, then I guess the dimension where Hulk gets his power from is outside help. And the Vishanti for Strange. Or the power cosmic for Surfer. or the energy in a GL ring.
Yeah.....screw that. KMC rules (which work)>>>>>>>Your shitty interpretation. dur
Originally posted by CaptainStoicIn a neutral world he'd have all his abilities. The ability to go faster than light, the ability to steal speed, the ability to amp speed, and so on and so forth. If it took place in the MU then yes the Speed Force would be null and void and Flash would loose his speed and abilities as the fight progressed like Wally was in JLA/Avengers but not in a neutral world.
The Speed Force is greter than Sentry, I concede to this, but Bart in his normal form is not the Speed Force... in neutral territory he, like Janus77 pointed out is just another character that can move at light speed or a little better. Which is in Sentry's range, or do you think that someone sent through a wormhole to parts unknown could get back to earth as fast as he did?
Originally posted by TricksterPriest
If the speed force is outside help, then I guess the dimension where Hulk gets his power from is outside help.
Wait huh? Hulk gets his powers from another dimension??
Kento I'll listen to what you have to say because you bring very good points to the table without bashing me for my opinion. I'll go along with Bart winning because I know very little about the Flash because I have not read the comic for a while and had no idea that he'd become so powerful.
Trickster you should work on your debating skills because bullying someone into believing your story is getting old, fast.
Originally posted by CaptainStoic
Kento I'll listen to what you have to say because you bring very good points to the table without bashing me for my opinion. I'll go along with Bart winning because I know very little about the Flash because I have not read the comic for a while and had no idea that he'd become so powerful.Trickster you should work on your debating skills because bullying someone into believing your story is getting old, fast.
You're new here, so I'll be nice. We have a rather nasty troll infestation on here at the moment. So some of the forum regulars like myself have little patience for stupid comments. 😉
"in a neutral universe there would be no such nonsense as "The Speedforce". Flash would simply be another Faster Than Light character.
Thanos would pawn him soooooo badly all DC would shudder. a simple pimp slap upside the head and Flash' head goes tumbling into outerspace.
Thanos' reaction times and perception >>>> Silver Surfer's FTL speeds >> Flash at his very best".
Stuff like this? This will not get you respect, and indeed, this opinion will get you rediculed. For one thing: Flash is faster than Surfer. 2, Thanos would have a harder time hitting Flash than he would Surfer. And Wally stole the speed from an entire planet, so Sentry is no biggie. And even if you say he is, he's stopped Superman.
Superman>>>Sentry. 😄
Originally posted by TricksterPriest
You're new here, so I'll be nice. We have a rather nasty troll infestation on here at the moment. So some of the forum regulars like myself have little patience for stupid comments. 😉"in a neutral universe there would be no such nonsense as "The Speedforce". Flash would simply be another Faster Than Light character.
Thanos would pawn him soooooo badly all DC would shudder. a simple pimp slap upside the head and Flash' head goes tumbling into outerspace.
Thanos' reaction times and perception >>>> Silver Surfer's FTL speeds >> Flash at his very best".
Stuff like this? This will not get you respect, and indeed, this opinion will get you rediculed. For one thing: Flash is faster than Surfer. 2, Thanos would have a harder time hitting Flash than he would Surfer. And Wally stole the speed from an entire planet, so Sentry is no biggie. And even if you say he is, he's stopped Superman.
Superman>>>Sentry. 😄
Originally posted by CaptainStoic
The Speed Force is greter than Sentry, I concede to this, but Bart in his normal form is not the Speed Force...
😐 When he was the Flash he was the SpeedForce, it was actually part of him. Thats why he became the freaking Flash.
Originally posted by CaptainStoic
in neutral territory he, like Janus77 pointed out is just another character that can move at light speed or a little better.
The Flash can move much faster than light and most of his abilities just use that speed to incredible effect.
Originally posted by Kento
Wait huh? Hulk gets his powers from another dimension??
Yup. Hulk has some sort of access to another dimension that provides him with energy and mass for transformation.
isn't the "Speedforce" an essential dimension/FORCE within the DC universe?
whereas merely pulling in energies (however vague) from another universe do not fundamentally alter the realities within which the opponent works.
Hulk pulls in infinite energies from someother universe, but that doesn't in anyway shape or form inhibit his opponent, it doesn't place them in some new and biased territory where their previously autonomous powers are now subject to the whims of a FORCE that exists purely for the benefit of their opponent...
if that's acceptable, I don't see how Flash could possibly lose to say Galactus or even Eternity, as he could take all "the momentum out of them" - ie stop every electron from whizzing around every nucleus.
give me a plausible reason why, in a +neutral+ universe, the laws that govern that posited universe must be in accordance with that of only ONE party in a match?
the Speedforce is a special case, imo, it cannot exist but at the clear and severe detriment of any and all opponents. and as such any 'versus' match with Flash becomes simply spite.
either give Flash his autonomous abilities, sans speed/momentum sucking, or take him out of these setups.
Originally posted by janus77However in this forum both characters get full use of their abilities...regardless of the power source. No such thing as a neutral universe.
isn't the "Speedforce" an essential dimension/FORCE within the DC universe?whereas merely pulling in energies (however vague) from another universe do not fundamentally alter the realities within which the opponent works. In addition as the Speed Force was internalized within Bart it wouldn't leave him in another universe.
Hulk pulls in infinite energies from someother universe, but that doesn't in anyway shape or form inhibit his opponent, it doesn't place them in some new and biased territory where their previously autonomous powers are now subject to the whims of a FORCE that exists purely for the benefit of their opponent...
if that's acceptable, I don't see how Flash could possibly lose to say Galactus or even Eternity, as he could take all "the momentum out of them" - ie stop every electron from whizzing around every nucleus.
give me a plausible reason why, in a +neutral+ universe, the laws that govern that posited universe must be in accordance with that of only ONE party in a match?
the Speedforce is a special case, imo, it cannot exist but at the clear and severe detriment of any and all opponents. and as such any 'versus' match with Flash becomes simply spite.
either give Flash his autonomous abilities, sans speed/momentum sucking, or take him out of these setups.
Originally posted by CaptainStoic
That was never stipulated in this thread. I mean if the Speed Force exists in this fight who is to say that Sentry will be unable to tap it's potential, Janus has a very good point.
Oh for ****'s sake man.
Full Capacity
It is assumed that each contestant will fight to his/her best ability, but still within the character's personality, unless specified otherwise. That means they will use any powers at their disposal. For example, even though The Flash doesn't clock each of his own opponents in the first millisecond in his own comic, it is assumed that is a viable tactic on this board since it is a proven fact that he possesses that level of speed.
It is also assumed that the characters fight at their optimum levels of ability - not explicitly weakened or unusually powered up for those who have variable power levels
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Oh for ****'s sake man.Full Capacity
- not explicitly weakened or unusually powered up for those who have variable power levels [/B]
It is assumed that each contestant will fight to his/her best ability, but still within the character's personality, unless specified otherwise. That means they will use any powers at their disposal. For example, even though The Flash doesn't clock each of his own opponents in the first millisecond in his own comic, it is assumed that is a viable tactic on this board since it is a proven fact that he possesses that level of speed.
[b]It is also assumed that the characters fight at their optimum levels of ability
Originally posted by Superherovandal
However in this forum both characters get full use of their abilities...regardless of the power source. No such thing as a neutral universe.
the Speedforce doesn't begin and end at The Flash, it is also the actual universe within which he operates, that's why the momentum sucking etc etc works at all.
imagine if the Living Tribunal went up against Spectre and just blinked him out of existence? he can't his power is contingent upon his universe's makeup and the same for the Spectre.
instead we adjust their powers and the extent of their influence in the hypothetical 'versusverse' so that a 'realistic' conflict might take place.
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Oh for ****'s sake man.Full Capacity
- not explicitly weakened or unusually powered up for those who have variable power levels [/B]
It is assumed that each contestant will fight to his/her best ability, but still within the character's personality, unless specified otherwise. That means they will use any powers at their disposal. For example, even though The Flash doesn't clock each of his own opponents in the first millisecond in his own comic, it is assumed that is a viable tactic on this board since it is a proven fact that he possesses that level of speed.
[b]It is also assumed that the characters fight at their optimum levels of ability
Concerning the Battlefield
Unless otherwise stated by the thread originator, the standard distance between combatants will be .5 kilometers in line of sight at the onset of battle, and there will be an implied "buzz" to signify the onset of battle. It will be assumed combatants are primed to go at the gun.
Also, all characters, regardless of where the fight takes place, or what universe/medium they are native to, will have full access to their abilities at optimum efficiency as they are depicted in their native universes. It will be assumed that each character fights as they are normally presented regardless of battle locale. This means that, for example, Flash will in fact have SpeedForce abilities if the battle took place in Marvel Manhattan. Battles will always take place on an assumed equal playing field.