Originally posted by tulakhordpwns
Even with the star forge, Malak was unable to defeat Revan
It shows that Revan was very powerful.
Originally posted by Arcade Fire
Malak is assumed to be average, since he's never done anything special
According to DSSB, Malak weilded "devastating dark side power." And this means that his knowledge and understanding of the Force was indeed exceptional.
Then Malak was also among the elite swordsmen of his age.
He could perform impressive Force moves including: Force Lightning, Chain Lightning, Force Choke, Stasis Field, Force Drain, Force Whirlwind, TK based Saber Throw and also could use Force Rage to increase his effectiveness in combat.
He also was able to control the Star Forge like no other indivdual had ever done before and became "nearly unstoppable." I don't think that he was average by any means.
Caedus is more powerful than Revan? Even with the author inconsistencies, Caedus has shown pretty damn good ability with a saber, but even with his 5 year vacation, he was wtfpwned by Luke. When we talk about overall force knowledge, very few people are on Revan's level, which is undoubtedly superior to Caedus thus far.
Caedus may be able to hold his own against them with his saber for some time, but he has no where near the level of experince with the Force to defeat them in a true battle.
Hold his own? Any guy who can contend with Luke Skywalker in a duel would manhandle most Sith Lords and Jedi Masters. Malak and Githany don't have a snowball's chance in hell in a lightsaber duel. In a Force fight? You've got a point.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
The question is, is this yet another inconsistency, or is Jacen Solo that good all of a sudden? I don't recall him being particularly lightsaber savvy during the Vong War.
Darth Sexy, I wouldn't label Jacen's increase of power as an 'inconsistency'. What we define as an inconsistency is, for example, a post-DE Luke Skywalker struggling to destroy a single (slightly modified) droideka, with the assistance of Mara Jade Skywalker. Why is it an inconsistency? Because it makes a tremendous contradiction to someone's previously established powers. That Jacen is suddenly very good in the Legacy of the Force series is not a surprise, since it takes place several years after the Yuuzhan Vong war. Jacen's knowledge base is -- according to Lumiya -- broader than Emperor Palpatine's own, which is deeply impressive, and application of that knowledge base would likely reflect on his talents with the Force and with a lightsaber. Nevermind the increase of power he is likely exhibiting due to his Sith training and increasing combat experience.
He was regarded as a skilled duelist in the New Jedi Order series. That, and he essentially went into what LS calls "avatar-mode" [the thing he credits Luke doing in his contest with the reborn Sidious] during his showdown with Onimi.
Originally posted by Gideon
Darth Sexy, I wouldn't label Jacen's increase of power as an 'inconsistency'. What we define as an inconsistency is, for example, a post-DE Luke Skywalker struggling to destroy a single (slightly modified) droideka, with the assistance of Mara Jade Skywalker. Why is it an inconsistency? Because it makes a tremendous contradiction to someone's previously established powers. That Jacen is suddenly very good in the Legacy of the Force series is not a surprise, since it takes place several years after the Yuuzhan Vong war. Jacen's knowledge base is -- according to Lumiya -- broader than Emperor Palpatine's own, which is deeply impressive, and application of that knowledge base would likely reflect on his talents with the Force and with a lightsaber. Nevermind the increase of power he is likely exhibiting due to his Sith training and increasing combat experience.He was regarded as a skilled duelist in the New Jedi Order series. That, and he essentially went into what LS calls "avatar-mode" [the thing he credits Luke doing in his contest with the reborn Sidious] during his showdown with Onimi.
1. I wonder how it's possible to have a broader than Palpatine's? Does that even make sense? Was Lumiya just trying to boost his ego? It seems like a stretch. Then again he did go away for 5 years so he might have more of a variety..
2. What sith training exactly? Another ridiculous author inconsistency. As soon as Jacen accepts his sith name and all, he has these magical new powers, such as battle awareness/battle meditation. Since when do the sith automatically gain new powers?
1. I wonder how it's possible to have a broader than Palpatine's? Does that even make sense? Was Lumiya just trying to boost his ego? It seems like a stretch. Then again he did go away for 5 years so he might have more of a variety..
From what I've read of Publius, Emperor Palpatine pretty much studied anything and everything concerning the Force. And since Lumiya was but a pawn to him, it is unlikely she has any idea of the true depth of his knowledge and expertise. That said, to be compared to the Emperor at all in knowledge is an impressive feat, and the variety of his knowledge is fairly impressive.
2. What sith training exactly? Another ridiculous author inconsistency. As soon as Jacen accepts his sith name and all, he has these magical new powers, such as battle awareness/battle meditation. Since when do the sith automatically gain new powers?
A lot of his Sith training was the disguised, morally ambiguous lessons he received from Vergere. Other Sith training is referenced but not exactly detailed in the events of the series, essentially stuff he does in "his own time". Jacen's priorities seem to be, and have always been, knowledge first, power second (a hypocritic, Jedi-esque interpretation of Sith goals).
Ok so:
1. His broad knowledge compared to Palpatine is debatable. I would go as far as call it illogical considering Palpatine had 20 years to study every aspect of the force uninterrupted (plus the other 63), while Caedus had 5.
2. This still doesn't really explain his Revan-like Battle awareness that he magically obtains after he takes his sith name.
Originally posted by Darth SexyUninterrupted? And here I thought he had a galaxy-spanning empire to run.
Ok so:
1. His broad knowledge compared to Palpatine is debatable. I would go as far as call it illogical considering Palpatine had 20 years to study every aspect of the force uninterrupted (plus the other 63), while Caedus had 5.
Hold his own? Any guy who can contend with Luke Skywalker in a duel would manhandle most Sith Lords and Jedi Masters. Malak and Githany don't have a snowball's chance in hell in a lightsaber duel.To be fair, at the time of the duel Luke is still sporting the wounds inflicted on him by Lumiya - something that Jacen takes advantage of rather well. If Luke were at full strength, the fight might have been somewhat different.
That said, breaking several bones and briefly matching Luke's speed and ferocity is a true testament to his skill, and something that few in the saga could even dream of managing. The fact that he survived at all is a mark in his favor.
Uninterrupted? And here I thought he had a galaxy-spanning empire to run.
Actually, this is not necessarily true. Though the Galactic Empire was an absolute dictatorship, the Emperor was not necessarily managing the bureacracy and the government on a day-to-day basis. He simply possessed the highest level of unchecked authority. It's a canon fact that by A New Hope, Sate Pestage was directing the Imperial government on a daily basis on behalf of Emperor Palpatine. We already know that he used pawns such as Darth Vader and Grand Moff Tarkin to enforce the Empire's brutal rule (and, thereby, would relieve himself of much of the negative publicity that comes with oppression). The Dark Empire sourcebook ultimately reveals that his goal was to essentially consume the galaxy -- and other galaxies -- through the dark side of the Force, so it seems his priority was increasing his knowledge in the Force itself. Especially since he had competent lackies to handle the daily demands of the galaxy-spanning empire.