Re: Ironman VS Doomsday
Originally posted by SevenShackles
Ironman vs Doomsday [DOS]Tony Stark is given a weeks prep and has all the resources of SHIELD and can call on any other superheroes currently registered except sentry. upon arrival Doomsday destroys Omega Flight and marches down into the US.
can he win? does he have to much prep time? not enough?
what happens here?
crylaugh
Originally posted by Innerhype
I think he meant the power of the Reality Gem, he is right though in saying DD will have no defense against it.I said before that placing Iron Man in a situation like this with this amount of prep and reasources is overkill for a lot of characters, including Doomsday. And to say DOS Superman packs more power physically than anything Tony Stark can come up with is utterly absurd, how can Superman demolecularize Manhattan with punches?.
Iron Man has the speed/reflexes nowadays to keep up with nearly anyone. Iron Man can react faster than Superman too because Doomsday isn't faster than prescience.
I don't know much about the Reality Gem and didn't know Tony had it (or could obtain it) so I will not argue here.
I'm not even going to ask you to prove that Tony can Demolecularize a city because it is moot. Demolecularizing something has nothing to do with physical hitting power. Remember DOS DD is immune to all energy projection. This means that he can withstand a blast that can demolecularize a planet.
DOS Superman is able to lift at least billions of tons and move at least 99% the speed of light. There is no way in hell Tony can come up with something in his suit to hit DD with that kind of power. If so, then he would have achieved it in the many many years he has been upgrading and improving his Ironman suit. And even if he is able to hypothetically do this then he must still hit DOS DD hundreds if not thousands of times for DD to drop just like Superman did.
And you lose all respect when you say that current Tony can react faster than DOS Superman. Please read some John Byrne Superman and rethink that. Current Tony couldn't even stop Sentry, Thor, and others from fu**king him.
Doomsday is not faster than prescience is a very silly statement since prescience doesn't equal speed. Also, prescience is useless when one doesn't have sufficient speed with it. For example, If I have prescience while keeping my human speed and Tony decides to hit me, then I will still get hit. For I may know he will swing before he swings. I will try to dodge before he swings. But guess what? When Tony starts to swing he will see me with my head already to the side (from dodging before the swing) as a frozen statue and unable to move. He will then easily strike me in my dodged pose as easily as one can touch a statue.
Originally posted by Magee
DoS DD cant move at light speedor any thing even close and he's not immune to energy projection.
His sudden burst speed is comparable to flash. You know who flash is right? While being many meters away from the JLA at one instant he moved so fast that in the next instant all five members (including Superman) were seemingly punched away at the same time. Superman complained of his speed and Superman has some of the fastest reflexes in all of comics. Guy gardner even said he was faster than flash himself.
Yes indeed he is immune to all energy projection. D.C. explained this on panel after his ressurection from the battle with the Radiant. That is why the entire JLA couldn't even put a scratch on him with their full effort. That is why he didn't even get a scratch to the OE. That is why the Radiant himself couldn't harm him anymore. That is why the Earth's most powerful laser (many times hotter than the core of the sun) couldn't put a scratch on him.
Iron Man has the speed/reflexes nowadays to keep up with nearly anyone. Iron Man can react faster than Superman too because Doomsday isn't faster than prescience.
Wrong.
The current armor worn by Stark bestows upon him significant upgrades, including speed and reflexes. But saying that it allows him to react faster than Superman is a pure and utter joke (this is the problem with some characters .....they get upgrades and certainly people think they are nigh invincible).
The sheer extentity of speed and reflex possessed by a Kryptonian is simply too much for Stark.
Case in Point: When a bullet was fired at Lois in S.America and Superman was miles away, he hears the bullet, streaks towards where Lois is, stops the bullet, and in the process manages to stuff both her ears so that the sonic boom doesn't affect her.
And you are telling me that Stark's speed and reaction is faster than that!
Anyways, Stark has received significant upgrades in his current armor, ranging from power to speed to other (e.g. nanites and technology control). This has enabled him to be capable of engaging characters that would have been out of his paygrade before.
However when people start comparing Stark with his clear superiors then we have a problem. The dude has been amped up ......but just because a Honda has been souped up by an extra 100HP doesn't mean that it can participate in races against Pagani Zondas and Bugatti Veyrons.
And statements such as Stark having speed and reflexes comparable (or even better) than Superman's is, honestly, laughable.
Even if Stark could know a second before hand what Superman was going to do (since the suit has something like Spiderman's spider-sense) he still wouldn't be able to move fast enough to evade the attack. All that ability would do is make him know a split second before that an attack was due. But he wouldn't be able to do a thing about it. It would be similar to what would happen between Spiderman and the Flash ....Parker may get a tingly feeling that Flash is about to blitz him, but the moment Flash starts it is over. Parker, and Stark, wouldn't be able to get out of the way.
Prescience is a helpful tool .... particularly when it comes to reflexes/speed. But against a certain level of speedster (e.g. Superman, Flash, etc) it is totally useless (unless the person with that ability also has a VERY HIGH level of superspeed .....and i am NOT talking Quick Silver level).
Iron Man would be road kill in the speed department against DOS Superman.
As for the thread: Against DOS DoomsDay my first thoughts were DD would win. However Stark does have a lot of resources at hand, thus he may be able to teleport DD to a gas nebula where the dude would be floating for all eternity. Thus it is VERY possible for Tony to win since he would have large resources to draw from.
However, if Stark goes for a direct fight he will lose. But Tony is too smart to engage DD directly, particularly when a simple teleportation device could get rid of DD by taking him elsewhere (or elsetime for that matter).
Thus based on devices Tony SHOULD win this, as long as he doesn't try to trade punches with the monster.
Thus my only problem wasn't on Tony winning ....he should win. My problem is when people start saying that upgraded armors (even significantly upgraded ones) can enable a level of feat that is simply several pay grades above.
At this rate we will be hearing that Stark can defeat Steel wearing the Aegis Entropy (to be honest i am surprised that noone has made such a thread yet, although I haven't done a search thus it might be very possible that some IronMan fan has created such a thread believing that Stark can defeat the AE).
I'd actually be willing to bet such a thread exists!
In case it doesn't, let me save you all some time. Stark (in whatever armor) cannot scratch the Aegis Entropy.
Also Stark, in whatever armor, cannot hope to better (or even match) Kryptonian speed (simply go to the Superman respect thread and look under speed feats).
Originally posted by Magee
DoS DD cant move at light speedor any thing even close and he's not immune to energy projection.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Co-signed. If DD was capable of hitting lightspeed then it wouldn't have taken as long as it did for him to cross the country. And if he were immune to energy projection, then Supes wouldn't have been able to blast him through a wall with Heat Vision when they were fighting in Metropolis.
Originally posted by Estacado
That doesn't make sense......
Juggernaut was immune to the Godblast still it moved him or to phisical attacks yet he can be hit so hard that he will fly away still the punch won't affect him.
Heat vision "blasting" away DD doesn't mean anything.
Originally posted by Estacado
kthankxbye
And I have no problem acknowledging DD shaking off the combined attack of the JLA, but it doesn't change the fact that later on Supes's HV was damn sure able to effect him so he CAN'T be immune.
Originally posted by darthgoober
A comment from someone with no actual superspeed to speak of means nothing. Franklin Richards said that he thought that Thing was stronger than Thor, but that doesn't make it true.And I have no problem acknowledging DD shaking off the combined attack of the JLA, but it doesn't change the fact that later on Supes's HV was damn sure able to effect him so he CAN'T be immune.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Co-signed. If DD was capable of hitting lightspeed then it wouldn't have taken as long as it did for him to cross the country. And if he were immune to energy projection, then Supes wouldn't have been able to blast him through a wall with Heat Vision when they were fighting in Metropolis.
Being knocked off balance with the concussive force of the blast doesn't mean he isn't resistant to the energy part of the blast itself.
Originally posted by Avlon
Being knocked off balance with the concussive force of the blast doesn't mean he isn't resistant to the energy part of the blast itself.
Originally posted by darthgoober
I'm not arguing that he's not RESISTANT, just that he's completely immune. It's been a while since I checked out the issue in detail, but I'm pretty sure that Radiant's blast had NO effect on Doomsday what so ever, and that's what immunity is.
