Well lets pretend that Samson and Colossus are equal in strength, and I feel that'd be giving Samson credit, whos the better fighter? Colossus trains extensively in the danger room while Samson sits in a sofa listening to people complain about their childhood. Also Samson's hair is his weakness, and Colossus Im sure is aware of that and could exploit it if he had too.
Originally posted by King_MungiThat can be reversed though too. Because Sasquatch later stated that he's nowhere near as strong as Thing. Comics are more inconsistent than handbooks.
That still doesn't make sense as even Thing, Box (lift press 80 tons), etc. all said Sasquatch is stronger yet he is at a lower class then them in the handbooks. It's a proven fact the handbooks are not reliable anyway you look at the stats
Originally posted by redhotrash
Well lets pretend that Samson and Colossus are equal in strength, and I feel that'd be giving Samson credit, whos the better fighter? Colossus trains extensively in the danger room while Samson sits in a sofa listening to people complain about their childhood. Also Samson's hair is his weakness, and Colossus Im sure is aware of that and could exploit it if he had too.
He lost that weakness ages ago.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Sasquatch is listed at class 70, now does he look stressed here to achieve this feat? As stated in the comic he can have uncalcuable strength due to Tanaraq, but he is still listed as class 701. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Sasplane1.jpg
2. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/UncannyX-Men120b.jpg
Where did you find that Sasquatch was listed as class 70?
I once saw a listing sometime in the 90's for him as super human class 100. Wasn't he possessed by Tanaraq in that scan? Because he is several times stronger when that happens (which proves my point that strength also depends on the mental, like stress). Plus, you know that in the scan he lifted a 25 ton DC-10 jet and threw it 1000 ft right? So the feat wasn't quite class 100 (very close though). And you forget that I gave two reasons (and not one). The other reason is that writer's sometimes don't know how much strength a feat requires. Lastly, they had Thing being superior to Sasquatch in strength on panel. So to prevent comic inconsistency we use the stress factor and the PIS factor.
The latter being applied when the feat is way out of the range of the character and not happening frequent enough.
I literally can find dozens of errors in the stats from fighting skills, speed, strength, etc. with feats of people really not even trying doing said feats :/I would like to see these. Can you show me?
Another example from the recent Wild Child entry they gave him 3/7 (some training) in fighting skill yet as stated he was trained by the best and refered to be as one of the best martial artist on the planet. He was trained by Wolverine, Department H, Secret Empire, Sabretooth, Alpha Flight, X-Factor, Puck and even Nick Fury yet they say he has "some" training *snickers*
This is called hyperbole, which can be denied. But consistent action based feats cannot be denied, for action speaks louder than words.
Originally posted by snoopdogg
That can be reversed though too. Because Sasquatch later stated that he's nowhere near as strong as Thing. Comics are more inconsistent than handbooks.
Yet Super Skrull who had augmented Thing's strength admited he isn't as strong as Sas, even Ranark commented Sas was stronger then Thing. So there's more people who say Sas > Thing then not. Plus Sas has incalcuable strength so kind of hard to be stronger then him eh?
Originally posted by h1a8
Where did you find that Sasquatch was listed as class 70?
I once saw a listing sometime in the 90's for him as super human class 100.
Every handbook he has been in has been class 70 and don't mention Tanaraq can give him power-boost either.
No, the only handbook in the 1990's listed him as Class 90, which is the ability to press/lift 75-90 tons. Doesn't mean you can press 90 tons. Never has he been class 100.
Originally posted by h1a8
Wasn't he possessed by Tanaraq in that scan? Because he is several times stronger when that happens (which proves my point that strength also depends on the mental, like stress).
No, that was Walter as normal as day. He didn't even know anything about Tanaraq then. He wasn't stressed at all.
Originally posted by h1a8
Plus, you know that in the scan he lifted a 25 ton DC-10 jet and threw it 1000 ft right? So the feat wasn't quite class 100 (very close though).
Reread the scans it's 250 tons not 25, the engine alone on a DC-10 is 25 tons
Here Sasquatch pulls and lifts a destroyer nany ship (British destroyers (of recent times) have an average displacement of around 5,000 tonnes or higher) and then pushes it out again. Also no this isn't Tanaraq
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Hulk_Annual_1979_008_11.jpg
Originally posted by h1a8
And you forget that I gave two reasons (and not one). The other reason is that writer's sometimes don't know how much strength a feat requires. Lastly, they had Thing being superior to Sasquatch in strength on panel. So to prevent comic inconsistency we use the stress factor and the PIS factor.The latter being applied when the feat is way out of the range of the character and not happening frequent enough.
Sasquatch has superior strength feats then Thing, hell as stated he has the "second strongest legs on the face of the Earth”. He has even done strength feats that the Collector [Elder of the Universe] thought to be impossible.
1. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/Hulk_Annual_1979_008_30.jpg
Comment about Sasquatch possesses "almost limitless strength"
1. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/MM18-07.jpg
Not frequent enough? Check out the Sasquatch respect thread.
Originally posted by h1a8
I would like to see these. Can you show me?
Here's another example
Master of the World has 1/7 in energy projection [that means he basically has nothing], they even have him 4/7 in durability even though he has shields, but whatever
Bio:
1. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/allnewofficial7tm2.jpg
Absorbs energy blasts
1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/Avengersv348-WarPlanA100PageMons-4.jpg
Levels a city block with one energy attacks
1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight112-16.jpg
Discharges the electromagnetic spectrum in Guardian's suit
1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlightv202-05i.jpg
Takes out Shaman with a blast
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight130-25.jpg
I could go even more indepth, but you get the idea. I can even use other characters and prove the stats are wrong
Originally posted by h1a8
This is called hyperbole, which can be denied. But consistent [B]action based feats cannot be denied, for action speaks louder than words. [/B]
Then I suggest you go to the Wild Child respect thread then. As he has stalemated Wolverine a few times, assisted Nick Fury in battle who even backed up the comment trained by the best as they fought Ultamatium together.
Originally posted by King_MungiWell the Super-Skrull was only class 15 back then so it's not a big deal. Iike I said comics are way more inconsistent than handbooks. Once you have Sasquatch slugging it out with Hulk then the next he's almost killed by Wild Child. Or one time he gets handled by Wrecker and the next time he's throwing airplanes. Or one time Sasquatch gets knocked around with a shovel and the next he's getting blasted by a tank. Get what I'm saying eh?
Yet Super Skrull who had augmented Thing's strength admited he isn't as strong as Sas, even Ranark commented Sas was stronger then Thing. So there's more people who say Sas > Thing then not. Plus Sas has incalcuable strength so kind of hard to be stronger then him eh?
Originally posted by snoopdogg
Well the Super-Skrull was only class 15 back then so it's not a big deal. Iike I said comics are way more inconsistent than handbooks. Once you have Sasquatch slugging it out with Hulk then the next he's almost killed by Wild Child. Or one time he gets handled by Wrecker and the next time he's throwing airplanes. Or one time Sasquatch gets knocked around with a shovel and the next he's getting blasted by a tank. Get what I'm saying eh?
Errrr? John Bryne at his board mentioned he was class 100.
Well all characters have bad showings, there's no exception. That's why we have rules on this board for this kinda thing. Hulk has been taken out from a snake, one-shooted by Wrecker, and knocked out from an electric net. If some of these events are so drastically out of their norm they generally are not taken to serious.
Wrecker owned him? If your talking about Omega Flight the Crew apparently had a boost from Tanaraq then so they could travel to the Realm of the Beasts.
Originally posted by snoopdogg
Another good example is Colossus' fight with Pete Wisdom. Colossus was enraged out of his mind and all Wisdom got was a couple broken ribs and a concussion. And Pete Wisdom has normal human durability!!
Wonders of comics physics as any class 100 punch against anyone or anything would send it flying. Yet how many times have we seen the likes of Hulk fully enraged not even send Wolverine flying? The sheer force and power should send anyone sky rocketing
Originally posted by King_MungiI didn't say owned him I said handled him. And the fight I was talking about was in AF #119. That's a good example of Sasquatches limitless strength failing in the clutch.Wrecker owned him? If your talking about Omega Flight the Crew apparently had a boost from Tanaraq then so they could travel to the Realm of the Beasts.
Here's another favorite inconsistency of mine. Colossus gets kayoed from a huge boulder falling on his head but manages to stay concious going through re-entry into the Breakwords atmosphere and is still concious after the impact from the landing!
Originally posted by snoopdogg
I didn't say owned him I said handled him. And the fight I was talking about was in AF #119. That's a good example of Sasquatches limitless strength failing in the clutch.Here's another favorite inconsistency of mine. Colossus gets kayoed from a huge boulder falling on his head but manages to stay concious going through re-entry into the Earths atmosphere!
Errr? Wrecker basically hit him once and that was it, and in the same issue mentioned Walter was losing control and not seen for the rest of the issue.
Just a bad showing, Sasquatch has taken armor peircing machine gun fire yet in the Sabretooth mini he was seriously wounded by rifle bullets and wooden spikes. Their just bad showings, which several other feats completly contradict the one feat.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Yet Super Skrull who had augmented Thing's strength admited he isn't as strong as Sas, even Ranark commented Sas was stronger then Thing. So there's more people who say Sas > Thing then not. Plus Sas has incalcuable strength so kind of hard to be stronger then him eh?Every handbook he has been in has been class 70 and don't mention Tanaraq can give him power-boost either.
No, the only handbook in the 1990's listed him as Class 90, which is the ability to press/lift 75-90 tons. Doesn't mean you can press 90 tons. Never has he been class 100.
No, that was Walter as normal as day. He didn't even know anything about Tanaraq then. He wasn't stressed at all.
Reread the scans it's [b]250
tons not 25, the engine alone on a DC-10 is 25 tons[/B]
Yes DC-10 jets weigh about 250 tons. But the scan is actually a typo. So that plane can't be a DC-10 plane. Otherwise, they fu*ked up the artwork bad. The size of the plane in the scan relative to Sasquatch's size shows that the plane is about 25 tons. A Boeing 747 can weigh 2 hundred and something tons, yet the 747 dwarfs the plane that Sasquatch lifted.
Look at the sizes of these planes and then scroll down to get their weighs:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Havilland_Canada_Dash_8
With that said, yes Sasquatch can lift over a 100 tons. I was never arguing that he can't. I was just showing you that the first scan you showed isn't a class 100 feat if the plane is 25tons.
And sorry, I know nothing of the characters you are mentioning (master of the world?, wild child?).
And yes handbooks do make mistakes. Comics make more though. But not everything is a mistake. So I trust comics and handbooks about equally well (maybe handbooks just slightly more though).
Originally posted by h1a8
Yes DC-10 jets weigh about 250 tons. But the scan is actually a typo. So that plane can't be a DC-10 plane. Otherwise, they fu*ked up the artwork bad. The size of the plane in the scan relative to Sasquatch's size shows that the plane is about 25 tons. A Boeing 747 can weigh 2 hundred and something tons, yet the 747 dwarfs the plane that Sasquatch lifted.Look at the sizes of these planes and then scroll down to get their weighs:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Havilland_Canada_Dash_8
It's a DC-10 even John Bryne made mention it was one on his board during a Q & A. He saw one at the airport waiting for his plane to take off. If you want to see bad size difference look at the aircraft carrier Kilowog dropped on a Sinestro Corps member recently. It's suppose to be an air-craft carrier, but it isn't drawn to correct dimensions.
Originally posted by h1a8
With that said, yes Sasquatch can lift over a 100 tons. I was never arguing that he can't. I was just showing you that the first scan you showed isn't a class 100 feat if the plane is 25tons.
It's a DC-10, but goes with my point he is a class 100 brute and does class 100 feats without pushing himself yet he is classified as just class 70. Nuh uh.
Originally posted by h1a8
And sorry, I know nothing of the characters you are mentioning (master of the world?, wild child?).
And yes handbooks do make mistakes. Comics make more though. But not everything is a mistake. So I trust comics and handbooks about equally well (maybe handbooks just slightly more though).
Check the respect threads then.
They make a LOT of mistakes. 😬 Errr? even the bios [not the stats] in the handbooks have errors. Without the comics there would be no handbooks, so why would you take the handbooks over the actual comic?
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Yet Super Skrull who had augmented Thing's strength admited he isn't as strong as Sas, even Ranark commented Sas was stronger then Thing. So there's more people who say Sas > Thing then not. Plus Sas has incalcuable strength so kind of hard to be stronger then him eh?Every handbook he has been in has been class 70 and don't mention Tanaraq can give him power-boost either.
No, the only handbook in the 1990's listed him as Class 90, which is the ability to press/lift 75-90 tons. Doesn't mean you can press 90 tons. Never has he been class 100.
No, that was Walter as normal as day. He didn't even know anything about Tanaraq then. He wasn't stressed at all.
Reread the scans it's [b]250
tons not 25, the engine alone on a DC-10 is 25 tonsHere Sasquatch pulls and lifts a destroyer nany ship (British destroyers (of recent times) have an average displacement of around 5,000 tonnes or higher) and then pushes it out again. Also no this isn't Tanaraq
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Hulk_Annual_1979_008_11.jpg
Sasquatch has superior strength feats then Thing, hell as stated he has the "second strongest legs on the face of the Earth”. He has even done strength feats that the Collector [Elder of the Universe] thought to be impossible.
1. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/Hulk_Annual_1979_008_30.jpg
Comment about Sasquatch possesses "almost limitless strength"
1. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/MM18-07.jpg
Not frequent enough? Check out the Sasquatch respect thread.
Here's another example
Master of the World has 1/7 in energy projection [that means he basically has nothing], they even have him 4/7 in durability even though he has shields, but whatever
Bio:
1. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/allnewofficial7tm2.jpgAbsorbs energy blasts
1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/Avengersv348-WarPlanA100PageMons-4.jpgLevels a city block with one energy attacks
1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight112-16.jpgDischarges the electromagnetic spectrum in Guardian's suit
1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlightv202-05i.jpgTakes out Shaman with a blast
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight130-25.jpgI could go even more indepth, but you get the idea. I can even use other characters and prove the stats are wrong
Then I suggest you go to the Wild Child respect thread then. As he has stalemated Wolverine a few times, assisted Nick Fury in battle who even backed up the comment trained by the best as they fought Ultamatium together. [/B]
Here Sasquatch pulls and lifts a destroyer nany ship (British destroyers (of recent times) have an average displacement of around 5,000 tonnes or higher) and then pushes it out again. Also no this isn't Tanaraq
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Hulk_Annual_1979_008_11.jpg
Sassy is most definitely mid CL100 at the very least. But the picture of the destroyer clearly shows that he was deadlifting just the front tip of the ship up out of the water so that Vindicator can repair it, so it's only a fraction of the ships total weight, never mind that most of the ships weight that is being displaced by the water.
Like when Ben held up the corner of that oil rig and stopped it from collapsing, he too was only holding and pressing a fraction of the rig and not the full 6,000-7,000 tons of it's total weight.
Although water wasn't displacing any of the weight of the oil rig for Ben, since none of the stanchions are floating and are free standing. Ben's feat was with dead weight.
😉
Originally posted by Tony Stark
Here Sasquatch pulls and lifts a destroyer nany ship (British destroyers (of recent times) have an average displacement of around 5,000 tonnes or higher) and then pushes it out again. Also no this isn't Tanaraq1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/Hulk_Annual_1979_008_11.jpg
Sassy is most definitely mid CL100 at the very least. But the picture of the destroyer clearly shows that he was deadlifting just the front tip of the ship up out of the water so that Vindicator can repair it, so it's only a fraction of the ships total weight, never mind that most of the ships weight that is being displaced by the water.
Like when Ben held up the corner of that oil rig and stopped it from collapsing, he too was only holding and pressing a fraction of the rig and not the full 6,000-7,000 tons of it's total weight.
Although water wasn't displacing any of the weight of the oil rig for Ben, since none of the stanchions are floating and are free standing. Ben's feat was with dead weight.
😉
Only problem I have with your interpretation is that the narration says, on-panel, that he "lifted her up out of the water unaided". It doesn't say that he lifted only the bow of the ship. Rather, it says that he lifted the ship "up out of the water". That leads me to believe that he lifted the entire ship out of the water.
But hey, that's just me.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Only problem I have with your interpretation is that the narration says, on-panel, that he "lifted her up out of the water unaided". It doesn't say that he lifted only the bow of the ship. Rather, it says that he lifted the ship "up out of the water". That leads me to believe that he lifted the entire ship out of the water.But hey, that's just me.
Well if you look closely at the pictures of him lift the bow at the bottom of the page.
You'll see picture #1 shows the water running off of the bottom of the ship and back into the ocean.
Picture #2 is more from a birds-eye view and shows Vindi repairing the ship and you can still see the water running off the bottom of the ship and into the ocean, and you can also see it stop running off the bottom of the ship and into the ocean, and you can see that the water from then on through the rest of the ship isn't like that and is shown to be normal, and is not shown to be running off the ship.
Originally posted by Tony Stark
Well if you look closely at the pictures of him lift the bow at the bottom of the page.You'll see picture #1 shows the water running off of the bottom of the ship and back into the ocean.
Picture #2 is more from a birds-eye view and shows Vindi repairing the ship and you can still see the water running off the bottom of the ship and into the ocean, and you can also see it stop running off the bottom of the ship and into the ocean, and you can see that the water from then on through the rest of the ship isn't like that and is shown to be normal, and is not shown to be running off the ship.
...What? 😑
