Sasuke- Itachi (Spoiler)

Originally posted by Kento
But why wouldn't the thought have even come up for Sasuke that maybe giving the scroll up would still not save them? If Naruto was able to actually think it I'm actually wondering why Sasuke wasn't able to. Unless Sasuke was just trying to think of someway to get Oro to go away.

and another thing, why have people in naruto completely stopped using scrolls to perform jutsus, i mean, it does look like a nice idea for kishi.

Have they? Tenten still uses them, and Sasori did too if i'm not mistaken. Didn't Jaraiya too?

Originally posted by King Kandy
Like I said GIVEN WHAT THEY UNDERSTOOD OF HIS MOTIVES (that he was a super-powerful Genin) Sasuke did what was best. He made the right decision given the faulty information.

Given their understanding Orochimaru was obsessed with killing, and the whole prey and predator.

Only a fool would assume he'd have gone home if you gave him the scroll.

In which case Sasuke was being naive

Well a bunch of jutsu doesn't really make a person the most powerful. And Sasuke's not really beaten anybody worth mentioning without some kind of circumstance. Though he'll probably never technically loose a fight in the manga though if it keeps up like it is.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Well Orochimaru would have zero reason to kill them after he gave them the scroll, unless he was a psycho who just liked killing. He was seeming pretty crazy but not enough that i'd say it was a bad idea.

not worth mentioning????

diedara had to kill himself just to have a chance of killing sasuke, he failed, and sasuke hadnt even used his most powerful jutsus. the thousands of shinobis that uro put him up against. uro himself and his body stealing jutsu, taking over his body. all the level two cursed sealed huys surrounding the huge guy wiht the cursed seal. scaring suigetsu and the curse seal dude. beating itachi's tsukiymo and surviving against the amateras, beating sai's jutsus. even yamamoto cudnt handle him sasuke is very uber currently. not to mention the pre chuunin feats against, naruto and 1 tails.

yes its true, urochimaru would have killed sasuke. he was TESTING him to see if he was fit as a vessel for him to begin with and this is proven later whne he lets him live and comments on how sasuke's potential surpasses even itachi and how they are definately brothers. do remember that the chances of sasuke actually surviving the cursed seal were only 10% yet uro still gave it to him, knowing that he might die.

Originally posted by EvilAngel
Have they? Tenten still uses them, and Sasori did too if i'm not mistaken. Didn't Jaraiya too?

Yep. They all did.

Given their understanding Orochimaru was obsessed with killing, and the whole prey and predator.

Only a fool would assume he'd have gone home if you gave him the scroll.

In which case Sasuke was being naive

Not necessarily. At that point Orichimaru had proven to be much stronger then both of them. So their options were:

A) Fight and definetly die.

or

B) Give up the scrolls and possibly die. Or stall for time.

B is obviously the more logical decision. 😬 Anything is more logical then "Rush in headfirst and head on and feel the furze of my fist!!11111!!!!!" tactic that Naruto ALWAYS uses.

I don't even see why this is still going on. As far as tactics and overall good sense is concerned Sasuke had is it in the bag. Naruto is quite frankly an idiot. Post TS not as much but pre-TS definitely. The only thing Naruto has going for him is good instincts and a crap load of chakra at his disposal.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
not worth mentioning????

diedara had to kill himself just to have a chance of killing sasuke, he failed, and sasuke hadnt even used his most powerful jutsus. the thousands of shinobis that uro put him up against. uro himself and his body stealing jutsu, taking over his body. all the level two cursed sealed huys surrounding the huge guy wiht the cursed seal. scaring suigetsu and the curse seal dude. beating itachi's tsukiymo and surviving against the amateras, beating sai's jutsus. even yamamoto cudnt handle him sasuke is very uber currently. not to mention the pre chuunin feats against, naruto and 1 tails.

Orochimaru was half dead, and Itachi was already weakened. Circumstances. And the Sound 4 were the strongest of the Cursed Seal Ninja and they were beat by some of the weakest or at least stalled by some of the weakest in Konoha. Beating a bunch of the cursed seal people and some no name ninja isn't really a big feat at all. And he dodged the Amaterasu...not such a big deal when you dodge it. As for Naruto loosing before Time Skip...Sasuke trying to kill Naruto, Naruto trying to bring Sasuke back alive. Yea it's a lot easier to go for a kill than a knock out without killing somebody.

Originally posted by WO Polaski
Yep. They all did.

Not necessarily. At that point Orichimaru had proven to be much stronger then both of them. So their options were:

A) Fight and definetly die.

or

B) Give up the scrolls and possibly die. Or stall for time.

B is obviously the more logical decision. 😬 Anything is more logical then "Rush in headfirst and head on and feel the furze of my fist!!11111!!!!!" tactic that Naruto ALWAYS uses.

I don't even see why this is still going on. As far as tactics and overall good sense is concerned Sasuke had is it in the bag. Naruto is quite frankly an idiot. Post TS not as much but pre-TS definitely. The only thing Naruto has going for him is good instincts and a crap load of chakra at his disposal.

And naruto's decision to rush forward and attack was so much smarter? It nearly got him killed.

When did I ever say Naruto did anything smart? I've said plenty of time Sasuke is smarter than Naruto. Sasuke never even thought of other possibilites though and it was because he was freaked out. If he had kept a level head, which I understand why he didn't after being nearly killed by Orochimaru and paralyzed by fear he had to stab himself to move, but he may have been able to come up with some better plan then give him the scroll and get him away. Like maybe think there may be more than just the scroll he wants.

So... at this point you're just nitpicking?

Sasuke should have made a better plan then to just hand over the scrolls and hope for the best. It was foolish of him to think it'd be that easy when dealing with a killer like Orichimaru.

Are we all happy now?

sometimes the heart serves you better than the brain. its mystical luck. but naruto has it. he may not be smart, but he can see things in people that others cant, anf find hope and light and the will to persevere in situatios that others can not. i prefer him to sasuke.

Originally posted by WO Polaski
So... at this point you're just nitpicking?

Sasuke should have made a better plan then to just hand over the scrolls and hope for the best. It was foolish of him to think it'd be that easy when dealing with a killer like Orichimaru.

Are we all happy now?

Originally posted by leonheartmm
sometimes the heart serves you better than the brain. its mystical luck. but naruto has it. he may not be smart, but he can see things in people that others cant, anf find hope and light and the will to persevere in situatios that others can not. i prefer him to sasuke.

And that is why he would make a bad polition. Being a fool and making dumb decisions 80% of the time and doing the right thing due to dumbluck 20% of the time is not an acceptable ratio for a leader of a country. Yes Bush does it. But he's not a good example of a good leader..

Originally posted by Kento
When did I ever say Naruto did anything smart? I've said plenty of time Sasuke is smarter than Naruto. Sasuke never even thought of other possibilites though and it was because he was freaked out. If he had kept a level head, which I understand why he didn't after being nearly killed by Orochimaru and paralyzed by fear he had to stab himself to move, but he may have been able to come up with some better plan then give him the scroll and get him away. Like maybe think there may be more than just the scroll he wants.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Oh yeah? Just what SHOULD he have done? Fighting would have got him killed, giving up the scroll could have but at least he had the smarts to know when he was beaten. Naruto chose a plan that had absolutely NO chance of working, at least Sasuke's had a possibility.

Okay, so Sasuke fights. And he dies. He had no chance of winning. He knew that there was no way fighting would help. Giving the scroll was fifty-fifty like you said. 50%>0%. I'm not sure how you could possibly call fighting a "much better choice" given that you admit that Sasuke's plan had a chance of working. Naruto's plan? No chance at all.

Sasuke's plan had a 50-50 chance or working on somebody not Orochimaru. All I'm really saying now is that Sasuke didn't consider all the possibilities in that instance and I think that instance against Orochimaru isn't the best to judge his talent.