abhilegend
Prince of All Saiyans
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
It’s always been a case by case when it comes to Superman but that doesn’t in anyway contradict or put him at a disadvantage when in comparison to Thor. Yes, I think it’s retarded, but I’m not going to use that as an argument to dismiss evidence, then you’d have grounds for all this bitching.
Who's dismissing the evidence? I never said superman's not weak to magic, I was just pointing to the absurdity of his resistance to physical magical attacks and vulnerability to pointed objects. Even byrne wrote the scene where Superman resisted and reversed transmutation from Blaze. Jurgens wrote superman resisting and expelling Eclipso from his mind, so he was always fairly resistant to magic. But his vulnerability to magical pointed objects always contradict that stance. After all a vampire's teeth is no more magical than captain marvel's fist, both of them should have same effect on superman's skin. But even using magical lightning, sucker shot and luck, he didn't do anymore damage than a concussion
Using the same principle he should be a smear on the floor.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus Thor was specifically vulnerable to lower end artillery but it disappeared over time. Clark’s vulnerability to magic was a legitimate weakness that circumvented his durability but it lessened over the years to the point where a Morrison type portrayal is probably the fairest.
Agreed.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus I thought you were a Superman fan? Clark has various weak showings against magic.
Show me anywhere it reduced his strength. Clark always had a fairly resistance against blunt effects of magic. In war of gods he took a magical beam from Circe which was going to destroy Themyscira and was fine, He also took the magical blast from Adversary which ko'd entire JLA including Diana and Zauriel. It's the pointed objects he always had a problem with. The closest scene to mjolnir is this
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus Quote me where I said anything of the sort or stop putting words in my mouth. Never did I once treat Superman unjustly when it comes to magic, whenever it appears that someone is overestimating or underestimating his vulnerability, I correct them. There are extremes portrayals (Busiek and Bryne) or a middle ground (Morrison) but it all depends on the writer at this point. It’s the only fair stance. As a matter of fact, I’ve gone out of my way to clarify that I don’t take the mystical vulnerability into account during their battles and that it probably wouldn’t be in a comic. But that’s irrelevant, I don’t have to explain myself to you, clearly you have no idea what my stance is.
I know what your stance is and it's either stalemate or a slight edge to thor but your stance on superman's magic vulnerability is slightly wrong. Kal's always fairly durable to blunt force effects of magic.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus I'm sorry, but you need to clear that sentence up because I'm unsure as to what you mean.Magic has been shown to be a foil against plenty of characters, but that’s immaterial. I think Superman’s weakness to magic makes more sense than Thor’s weakness to lower caliber weapons. Maybe it’s because I grew up in a time period where the Odinson was already bulletproof while Clark was still vulnerable to magic, maybe it’s because I’m a Thor bag, I could come up with a logical enough argument but it really doesn’t matter in the end does it? You’re unhappy with my stance and that’s the root of the problem. Unfortunately, no matter how much you complain, it’s not going to change. It’s my opinion, one that so far hasn’t colored my view when it comes to Clark and magic. As long as that doesn't happen, you can bugger off.
That's the hypocrisy? Thor's not the only highly durable character in comics who is not bulletproof, Wonder woman is not bulletproof, aquaman is not bulletproof, black adam was pierced by arrows, Captain marvel was hurt by a bullet etc, etc. But only superman is "weak" to magic. I am not complaining about it or anything, even when thor was not bulletproof no one said that superman can ko him by using a finger at high speed. But despite of superman's consistent magic resistance people are saying he should have his fingers crushed (not you).
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus Bullets bounce off of Thor now, Superman just got raped by rotting teeth so I’m good. I’m sorry that this has upset you so. 🙂
Thor just surrendered to hulk saying "I could never beat you". Kal just six months in career steamrolled Hal and flash, who's looking better against their long time rivals, huh.🙂 Superman in JLD and his own title is for all intents and purposes superman before Flashpoint and you forget to mention It was the spell of Enchantress, one of the most powerful magicians in DCU who overpowered Zatanna's magic recently. I never denied Kal has a poor record against pointed objects.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus I understand your complaint but this was unnecessary and essentially just a waste of time.
So was your post about the"retarded" durability of Thor.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus There are two scenes earlier than 2002. In Action Comics Annual #1 from 1987, Superman was helpless against a Vampire who was moments away from biting him (Batman saved him), it took a large chunk out of him with it's claws. In Superman #70 from 1993, he was once again helpless against a Vampire, and was almost bitten. There was another scene in the JLA where Superman had to stay out of a battle with mystical bats (Not real vampires but worth mentioning I guess) because he was no more resistant to magic than humans, it happened in like 2001 I'd guess. Like I said earlier, there are various scenes indicating a specific vulnerability to magic (The further back you go, the more common they are than vise versa), but
Read above.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus Why do you keep trying to entrap be in a contradiction and a statement that lowballs Superman? Do you want me to underestimate him? Will that justify this stupid little fit you’re throwing?It’s not even a smart attempt at baiting. No, Superman won’t be able to knock out Thor with his finger at super speed, and Captain Marvel wouldn’t be able to splatter Clark.
Just like my underestimation of thor's durability won't change your view on it, your underestimation wouldn't change mine. Go ahead, throw a fit how Superman stopping mjolnir was PIS and Busiek was biased towards superman and it won't change a thing. Thor fans have thrown larger fits than anyone even Kyle rayner fans over JLA/Avengers and are still throwing, just see Darth power's posts.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus He isn’t enough? He represents an extreme as does Busiek. I know other writers would give Thor the win over Clark for the mystical vulnerability alone such as Simonson or Jurgens. I don’t know about his hand being crushed but he isn’t going to be successful in the venture.
Who simmonson, who working on thor said thor's stronger than superman and working on Orion said he was stronger than superman. I can bet if these two ever fought again magic or speed wouldn't be an issue in fights. Jurgens who made superman and doomsday' last punches breaking only window glasses?
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus I don’t understand why that statement has so profoundly affected you. I wasn’t giving Thor more privileges than Clark. Call it whatever the f*ck you want, I don’t give a shit unless you start using fallacious and/or double standard reasoning. Clearly that isn't sufficient based on all the bitching that you do about how unfair everything is to him, you complain more than a woman. They have respective advantages, neither is clearly superior in one category besides Clark with speed and Thor with raw power output.Sorry, but you are a **** and I’m done hearing you PMS.
Who me, it was you who started bitching about thor's backward durability when I mentioned it. I am not complaining about anything, just calling about the hypocrisy in both cases. Why are you taking it so personally, I didn't attack you or anything. I never said superman is superior to thor. If you read my posts, I always said that Thor and superman are peers with slight edge to superman. Now knock it off with all this name calling, I think you are mature enough to participate in a debate without resorting to name calling.