Originally posted by Phantom Zone
No its not actually in terms of handguns yes, but as I stated earlier hes been Koed by what looked like a bullet to the eye in Wolverine issue 8 (volume 2 I think), so it can be argued that if hes hit in the eye it will KO him.
I see, so your argument stands as that it did indeed go into his eye.
Well in terms of going down to a bullet in the eye I suppose it's not a minority feat, but him going down to bullets, or getting bullets in the eye is in HEFTY minority to the sheer number of times he's been shot.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Im afraid as it stands you don't have enough evidence. I think I know what example you are refering to. What that proves is that he can recover more quickly if he gets pissed off. He only got shot once after that and he didn't sustain anything like the damage that he did before. If they had got sprayed at point blank and it did nothing then that would have proven something.Wolverine was also in a besrker rage when Deadpool shot him in the head. The Director for Weapon X also dropped Wolverine when he was in a beserker rage. There also no girl whos going to get shot in this thread
Weapon X? Are you talking about immediately after his Adamantium injection? Do you have any grasp on how taxed his HF was due to that or the chemical treatments he was taking?
Sure, they dropped him with gas and tranqs soon after his injection, but weeks after he'd gotten accustomed to his new gifts and curse, he took down their entire security squadron with little to no trouble whatsoever.
Deadpool had to shoot Wolverine in the brain to drop him, which we already established should. I'm arguing the point vs. topical damage.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Sorry you have not proven that in your respect thread and im not going to take your word for it. The irony is that you've even provided more evidence to indicate that he can get gunned down.Heres evidence that he can take machine gunfire.
http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/3/machinegufirehc0.jpg
http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/1427/takesbulletslikenothingkc8.jpgbut you got this....
Its not a machine gun but Frank can get a shotgun
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/8375/wolviebuckshot2pf7.jpgWhy is Wolverine covering up his torso? Obvoulsy theres a good chance that if had got hit with machine gun bullets that close he would have been dropped.
http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/1482/vampgunswr8.jpgThat explains itself.
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/8659/hailzv9.jpgYou still have other examples.
1. Punisher dropping Wolverine with a bullet.
2. Wolverine getting dropped by bullets at the end of Volume 1
3. Wolverine ducking under a truck because he deosn't want to get shot again by Bushwacker.
4. Deadpool shooting him in the head in Origins.Also Stu Clark has created guns that shoot bullets faster do more damage and do heat based damage as well. Frank Castle has access to guns and tech that do alot more damage.
Yes I have proven that in my respect thread, it's been quite proven actually.
Now I don't have the patience to go over Wolverine's entire career for you AGAIN and point out every error you made in being wrong AGAIN...
All I'm going to say is that you need to re-read what I posted then look at your examples. Every damned one of them with the exception of the brain shot Deadpool, and the hundreds of bullets in MK are before Fatal Attractions thus irrelivent. I'm not even taking that last story at the end of vol. 1 into account as it's a clearly low showing that's in no way representative of Wolverine "at the best of his capabilities".
The Deadpool feat doesn't even pertain to Punisher as Wolverine hired Deadpool to do that in the first place and likely let DP shoot him in the head to set up Daken (as Wolverine said, maybe you could have done that, maybe not), DP has an HF, Wolverine took tons of damage already, and Wolverine had multiples of oppurtunities to take DP down.
The MK feat only proves that 5 gunmen with full automatic can only temporarily put Wolverine down when he's pretty passive and unaware and the bullets have virtually no effect on his performance if he gets pissed off.
Now I don't know if you're being ignorant again, or just bias but you need to recheck your evidence before you post it.
Originally posted by jinzin
I see, so your argument stands as that it did indeed go into his eye.
Yes and I gave my reasons, the amount of blood splatter. As you can see from some of your examples when he gets shot in the head there is little blood or none at all. Also the blood splatter was around the eye region.
Originally posted by jinzin
Well in terms of going down to a bullet in the eye I suppose it's not a minority feat, but him going down to bullets, or getting bullets in the eye is in HEFTY minority to the sheer number of times he's been shot.
Don't care as it stands the evidence indicates that he can go down to a shot in the eye.
Originally posted by jinzin
Weapon X? Are you talking about immediately after his Adamantium injection? Do you have any grasp on how taxed his HF was due to that or the chemical treatments he was taking?
We don't know all we know is that he was trying to escape he was in beserker rage and he got dropped.
Originally posted by jinzin
Sure, they dropped him with gas and tranqs soon after his injection, but weeks after he'd gotten accustomed to his new gifts and curse, he took down their entire security squadron with little to no trouble whatsoever.
I bet he didn't take as much damage as he did before.
Originally posted by jinzin
Deadpool had to shoot Wolverine in the brain to drop him, which we already established should. I'm arguing the point vs. topical damage.
Not sure what you're talking about here but all we know is that Wolverine got shot in the head, no mention of it going in the brain.....as far as I know.
Originally posted by jinzin
Yes I have proven that in my respect thread, it's been quite proven actually.
With handguns....yes.
Originally posted by jinzin
Now I don't have the patience to go over Wolverine's entire career for you AGAIN and point out every error you made in being wrong AGAIN...
Don't care not taking your word for it.
Originally posted by jinzin
All I'm going to say is that you need to re-read what I posted then look at your examples. Every damned one of them with the exception of the brain shot Deadpool, and the hundreds of bullets in MK are before Fatal Attractions thus irrelivent. I'm not even taking that last story at the end of vol. 1 into account as it's a clearly low showing that's in no way representative of Wolverine "at the best of his capabilities".
Er about half of them are after fatal attractions. What proof do you have that his HF is greater than it was prior to fatal attractions? I know what you're going to say and that does not prove anything.
Originally posted by jinzin
The Deadpool feat doesn't even pertain to Punisher as Wolverine hired Deadpool to do that in the first place and likely let DP shoot him in the head to set up Daken (as Wolverine said, maybe you could have done that, maybe not), DP has an HF, Wolverine took tons of damage already, and Wolverine had multiples of oppurtunities to take DP down.
Im just focusing on the fact that he can get dropped by bullets. That all, just because Wolverine hired him doesn't mean that Punisher can't win with prep. You think hes HF is greater hes been incinerated to a skeleton and banged about by Janus and still managed to drop Namor. I would assume that it would have reduced his HF but it obvously didn't make that much difference because if it had Namor would have kicked his ass. The damage that he took against DP was nothing in comparison so you are blowing things out of propotion.
Originally posted by jinzin
The MK feat only proves that 5 gunmen with full automatic can only temporarily put Wolverine down when he's pretty passive and unaware and the bullets have virtually no effect on his performance if he gets pissed off.
1. He was pissed off when DP shot him.
2. Already stated that it doesn't prove that he can't get gunned down when hes pissed off because he only got shot once afterwards.
3. Punisher has more powerful guns.
Originally posted by jinzin
Now I don't know if you're being ignorant again, or just bias but you need to recheck your evidence before you post it.
I haven't made it personal, theres no need to start.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Yes and I gave my reasons, the amount of blood splatter. As you can see from some of your examples when he gets shot in the head there is little blood or none at all. Also the blood splatter was around the eye region.
Originally posted by Phantom ZoneOf course you don't because the fact that it's in such a small minority brings into doubt the likelyhood of it happening.
Don't care as it stands the evidence indicates that he can go down to a shot in the eye.
Originally posted by Phantom ZoneHe wasn't really in a berserker rage. He was a it mindless but that was partially due to the conditioning he was subjected to.. And again, they used gas and tranqs.
We don't know all we know is that he was trying to escape he was in beserker rage and he got dropped.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I bet he didn't take as much damage as he did before.
20 guards with machine guns.
A meltdown that melted steel and burned his flesh off.. the hell he didn't.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Not sure what you're talking about here but all we know is that Wolverine got shot in the head, no mention of it going in the brain.....as far as I know.
It was stated that it went into his brain the very next issue after it happened. 馃槵
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
With handguns....yes.
AND machine guns. But you'd have to look through that thread without ignoring handfuls of evidence and context which you aren't yet prepared to do.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Don't care not taking your word for it.
Originally posted by Phantom ZoneNo they weren't. Lol, the fact that it was stated his mutation continued after his Adamantium removal.
Er about half of them are after fatal attractions. What proof do you have that his HF is greater than it was prior to fatal attractions? I know what you're going to say and that does not prove anything.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Im just focusing on the fact that he can get dropped by bullets. That all, just because Wolverine hired him doesn't mean that Punisher can't win with prep. You think hes HF is greater hes been incinerated to a skeleton and banged about by Janus and still managed to drop Namor. I would assume that it would have reduced his HF but it obvously didn't make that much difference because if it had Namor would have kicked his ass. The damage that he took against DP was nothing in comparison so you are blowing things out of propotion.
No it means that DP needing to draw himself into close quarters and even get into that position to deliver the brain shot in the first place is irrelivent to the Pun thread as it doesn't pertain to Punisher whatsoever lest Pun has a HF and and Logan hired him to do it.
Lol, the guy took tons of damage in both fights. I've blown nothing out of proportion.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
1. He was pissed off when DP shot him.
2. Already stated that it doesn't prove that he can't get gunned down when hes pissed off because he only got shot once afterwards.
3. Punisher has more powerful guns.
馃え
DP shot him IN THE BRAIN.. World of difference.
It helps to prove it when there's loads of fights where Logan starts the fights pissed and wades through machine gun fire like nothing.
3 has nothing to do with what that scan proves about bullets or this particular conversation but nice red herring nonetheless.
Originally posted by Phantom ZoneI'm not being personal with you I'm trying really hard not to, but it's obvious your being massively subjective and misinterpreting events to better suit you're idea of who should win between Wolverine and Punisher, it can only be due to one of two things.
I haven't made it personal, theres no need to start.
Originally posted by jinzinOf course you don't because the fact that it's in such a small minority brings into doubt the likelyhood of it happening.
Er no the point im making is that we use the information available. The information as it stands indicates that he can get dropped.
Originally posted by jinzin
He wasn't really in a berserker rage. He was a it mindless but that was partially due to the conditioning he was subjected to.. And again, they used gas and tranqs.
He was howling at the moon. Looks beserker to me.
Originally posted by jinzin
20 guards with machine guns.
A meltdown that melted steel and burned his flesh off.. the hell he didn't.
Well im not sure how much damage that he took in the other instance so i'll have to read the issue again.
Originally posted by jinzin
As I said, I'm arguing the point of topical bullet damage because I don't feel Wolverine getting shot in the brain is representative of what would happen in a majoirty of given fightsWhy not? He got shot and he got Koed.
[QUOTE=10697522]Originally posted by jinzin
[B]
It was stated that it went into his brain the very next issue after it happened. 馃槵
Wolverine said that?
Originally posted by jinzin
AND machine guns. But you'd have to look through that thread without ignoring handfuls of evidence and context which you aren't yet prepared to do.馃檮
Jesus Christ I looked through your thread and I even posted examples that proved that he can take machine gunfire. Hell theres even another one which I could have posted but there was no evidence of him getting hit. I even admitted that you had alot of proof for handguns. After reading your thread I evens stated that Wolverine could beat Namor. Serioulsy you call that biased?
Originally posted by jinzin
No they weren't. Lol,:
There was about 8 or 7 examples 4 of them were after fatal attractions. 馃槓
Originally posted by jinzin
the fact that it was stated his mutation continued after his Adamantium removal.
Yes and he also said that his HF had been greatly reduced so therefore you can't assume that its greater.
Originally posted by jinzinIt's not a fact, it's a fabrication made up by you using feats out of context or ignoring the consequences that the bone claw era had on his HF. This is nothing new for you though so it doesn't surprise me.
No it means that DP needing to draw himself into close quarters and even get into that position to deliver the brain shot in the first place is irrelivent to the Pun thread as it doesn't pertain to Punisher whatsoever lest Pun has a HF and and Logan hired him to do it.
Lol, the guy took tons of damage in both fights. I've blown nothing out of proportion.
Oh ok, so the damage that Wolverine took was worse than being incinerated to the skeleton. Getting into a brawl with Janus and taking class 100 shots from Namor. 馃槓
Im not arguing about prep skills. Im arguing about how bullets can drop Wolverine.
Originally posted by jinzin
馃えDP shot him IN THE BRAIN.. World of difference.
Pretty sure Pun could so the same.
Originally posted by jinzin
It helps to prove it when there's loads of fights where Logan starts the fights pissed and wades through machine gun fire like nothing.
Well thats not what happened in your example. What do you mean pissed off beserker? There is nothing to indicate that when he tried to escape the facility that his HF was taxed, we just know he tried to escape, he was pissed then.
Im still including examples priot to fatal attractions because you have not proven that is HF is stronger.
Originally posted by jinzin
3 has nothing to do with what that scan proves about bullets or this particular conversation but nice red herring nonetheless.
Ummm if they are more powerful they have a greater chance of dropping him.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Er no the point im making is that we use the information available. The information as it stands indicates that he can get dropped.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
He was howling at the moon. Looks beserker to me.
Which just goes to show A) How little you still know about Wolverine or B) How little you know about the circumstances revolving around the X project.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well im not sure how much damage that he took in the other instance so i'll have to read the issue again.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Why not? He got shot and he got Koed.
Ughhh... Because....
He was shot in the brain which AGAIN... "the fact that it's in such a small minority brings into doubt the likelyhood of it happening."
And... "DP needing to draw himself into close quarters and even get into that position to deliver the brain shot in the first place is irrelivent to the Pun thread as it doesn't pertain to Punisher whatsoever lest Pun has a HF and and Logan hired him to do it."
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Wolverine said that?
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Jesus Christ I looked through your thread and I even posted examples that proved that he can take machine gunfire. Hell theres even another one which I could have posted but there was no evidence of him getting hit. I even admitted that you had alot of proof for handguns. After reading your thread I evens stated that Wolverine could beat Namor. Serioulsy you call that biased?
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
There was about 8 or 7 examples 4 of them were after fatal attractions. 馃槓
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Yes and he also said that his HF had been greatly reduced so therefore you can't assume that its greater.
Originally posted by Phantom ZoneLol you missed the point completely. The point is that DP did all the damage he could on Logan and it wasn't enough to take him down. He HAD to resort to drawing him in for a brain shot to take him down. Punisher doesn't have an HF and Wolverine didn't hire Punisher to take him down in this fight so Origins is next to irrelivent here except for pointing out how horribly prep, and punishment faired against a Logan who was only putting on a show and not in a real fight.
Oh ok, so the damage that Wolverine took was worse than being incinerated to the skeleton. Getting into a brawl with Janus and taking class 100 shots from Namor. 馃槓
Originally posted by Phantom ZoneI know what you're arguing. And unless Wolverine is shot in the brain or there's other circumstances involved. You're wrong.
Im not arguing about prep skills. Im arguing about how bullets can drop Wolverine.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Pretty sure Pun could so the same.
You're wrong.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well thats not what happened in your example. What do you mean pissed off beserker? There is nothing to indicate that when he tried to escape the facility that his HF was taxed, we just know he tried to escape, he was pissed then.
You simply can't grasp what that examples for can you?
If five men with machine guns only suceeded in slowing Wolverine down. But he got immediately up when he got pissed.
And there's loads of examples of him starting fights pissed where more than 5 men with machine guns can't put Logan down.
And Logan says adrednaline boosts the HF.. it stands to reason that example doesn't do much to show what'd happen to a Logan that knew he was in a fight.
Wolverine's HF wasn't taxed after the injection.. right..
馃檮
because you know soooo much about Weapon X, or Wolverine for that matter.. 馃槓
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Im still including examples priot to fatal attractions because you have not proven that is HF is stronger.
Originally posted by Phantom ZoneAgain it's nothing more than a tangent to the current conversation about Logan vs. Bullets. 馃槵
Ummm if they are more powerful they have a greater chance of dropping him.
Originally posted by jinzin
Ur point is skewed because.... "the fact that it's in such a small minority brings into doubt the likelyhood of it happening."Which just goes to show A) How little you still know about Wolverine or B) How little you know about the circumstances revolving around the X project.
*read above*
Ughhh... Because....
He was shot in the brain which AGAIN... "the fact that it's in such a small minority brings into doubt the likelyhood of it happening."
And... "DP needing to draw himself into close quarters and even get into that position to deliver the brain shot in the first place is irrelivent to the Pun thread as it doesn't pertain to Punisher whatsoever lest Pun has a HF and and Logan hired him to do it."
For god's sake read the issue.. 馃槵
It's a Punisher thread isn't it? So yes, to have read through that thread and then continue to insist that machine gun fire is sufficient enough to take Logan down under optimum conditions is very likely the product of bias.
you only had 3 post fatal attractions 2 of which don't pertain to Punisher in a fight, the last nothing more than a low showing.
No feats against him show that his HF was reduced. He's doing better featwise than he was four years ago.. so yes I can assume that his HF is better. Quite better if he's getting up from a bullet to the brain immediately after being hit, a better feat that Sabretooth could pull off 3 years ago who at the time was stated to have a better HF than Logan. I really don't know how many times I have to pound that point into your brain, or how many times your BIAS is capible of simply ignoring it... like you alway do. 馃槓
Lol you missed the point completely. The point is that DP did all the damage he could on Logan and it wasn't enough to take him down. He HAD to resort to drawing him in for a brain shot to take him down. Punisher doesn't have an HF and Wolverine didn't hire Punisher to take him down in this fight so Origins is next to irrelivent here except for pointing out how horribly prep, and punishment faired against a Logan who was only putting on a show and not in a real fight.
I know what you're arguing. And unless Wolverine is shot in the brain or there's other circumstances involved. You're wrong.
Cause Punisher has a Healing Factor that can afford him to get that close. And Wolverine hired Punisher for this fight so he'll only be putting on a production right? 馃檮
You're wrong.
You simply can't grasp what that examples for can you?
If five men with machine guns only suceeded in slowing Wolverine down. But he got immediately up when he got pissed.
And there's loads of examples of him starting fights pissed where more than 5 men with machine guns can't put Logan down.
And Logan says adrednaline boosts the HF.. it stands to reason that example doesn't do much to show what'd happen to a Logan that knew he was in a fight.Wolverine's HF wasn't taxed after the injection.. right..
馃檮
because you know soooo much about Weapon X, or Wolverine for that matter.. 馃槓There's plenty enough evidence to prove that. Period. I'm not going over all of them again cause the only thing you're capible of doing is ignoring evidence lest it suites you.
You've not proven that it's weaker. 馃槵Again it's nothing more than a tangent to the current conversation about Logan vs. Bullets. 馃槵
Look forget it I cant be assed with this.
What I will say though is this. Wolverine stated that his HF has not been this bad in years. Since Peter has only aged 15 years in over 40 years, 1993 is only a few or several years ago. Therefore his HF is probably what it was prior to FA.
Anyway Punisher now has acces to stuff more powerful than conventional guns.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
What I will say though is this. Wolverine stated that his HF has not been this bad in years. Since Peter has only aged 15 years in over 40 years, 1993 is only a few or several years ago. Therefore his HF is probably what it was prior to FA.Anyway Punisher now has acces to stuff more powerful than conventional guns.
And you can keep saying that til you're blue in the face, you'll still be wrong. Wolverine's feats of healing are still surpassing what he was doing within the last decade. It's not slower than pre Fatal Attractions every feat he's got is better.
Originally posted by jinzin
And you can keep saying that til you're blue in the face, you'll still be wrong. Wolverine's feats of healing are still surpassing what he was doing within the last decade. It's not slower than pre Fatal Attractions every feat he's got is better.
That doesnt change the fact that what Wolverine said implies that hes talking about pre FA. You're going to ignore what Wolverine said to suit you.
Er so because some of his feats are better than some in 2004? Thats not proof your just taking a small amount of feats and then deciding its better. Im pretty sure some of his feats are equal to pre fatal attractions as well but you probably ignored that. Considering that hes only had this HF for about a year and bit I don't know how you came to that conclusion.
