Originally posted by Terryc250
Well it depends because we've never actually seen Sephiroth go 100%, and i'm sure if Sephiroth gets Genesis pissed off enough, Genesis might end up hurting Angeal at an attempt to take out Sephiroth (which would probably fail)
I still say that Sephiroth owns Angeal and Genesis if he were really trying.
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Well Angeal was trying to stop him when he blasted him before.And if you remember when Sephiroth and Genesis went for eachother, Angeal rather easily blocked both their blows.
Sephiroth was not seeking to kill, Genesis was, which is why he instantly (from the slow motion of the vid) sliced through Angeal's sword just to get at Sephiroth.
I'd even go so far to say that Sephiroth looks almost leisurely during that fight, even while forcing Genesis backwards with blade beam (during that part when One-Winged Angel was playing) he was swinging his Masamune almost casually.
Team 1 will take it. I think the DOC Genesis is alot stronger than he was in CC. I think Genesis is better than Seph by now.
I mean Seph lost to an inexperienced Cloud (due to a surprise attack) while it to a skilled SOLDIER to take down Genesis (Zack). Aint sayin that Genesis was better than Seph but he wasn't that far behind'im at that point (which was along time ago).
1. BOTH were conversing with each other in the fight
2. sephiroth, like the atypical jap villian is always evilly/casually smirking in a fight, it doesnt necessarily mean that he isnt going all out
3. going by expressions, the expression on sephiroth's face when cloud omnislashed him is pretty evidently that of shock and slightly of fear, so going by that, he wasnt LETTING cloud omnislash him, he cudnt STOP cloud and cloud won fair and square
4. still not cannonc evidence on this thread or from what i remember that cloud has less cells initially
5. conflicting evidence to who is controlling who. sephiroth's aims seem to reflect more and more of jenovah's aims as the stroy progresses. for instance, he says he will do the same thing as "mother" and use the planet to traverse space and absorb the lifestream of other planet. remember, that his initial aim was just to become a god THROUGH the lifestream. and it is JENOVAH that gives him power, NOT the other way around.
6. still factual that cloud beat him twice, both in his most powerful incarnation
5. how was his first defeat a "surprise" attack? i mean he was normal sephiroth, that was defeated, then he turned to bizaaro sephirtoh, who was ALSO defeated, then he turned to safer sephiroth, and was ALSO defeated.
This tired argument will end the moment we witness Sephiroth going all out. But alas Square will be lame and never let us see it. FKN hype they have created.
If Sephiroth is being serious I don't see why he can't solo team 1, and it is not like he has to since Zack is there to lend him an extra sword.
Originally posted by leonheartmm
1. BOTH were conversing with each other in the fight
2. sephiroth, like the atypical jap villian is always evilly/casually smirking in a fight, it doesnt necessarily mean that he isnt going all out
3. going by expressions, the expression on sephiroth's face when cloud omnislashed him is pretty evidently that of shock and slightly of fear, so going by that, he wasnt LETTING cloud omnislash him, he cudnt STOP cloud and cloud won fair and square
4. still not cannonc evidence on this thread or from what i remember that cloud has less cells initially
CC Sephiroth was infused with Jenova cells before he was even born, unlike the other SOLDIERs who were infused after they already human and developed, Sephiroth was infused with the cells while he was still in the womb, thats why he literally is basically Jenovas biological son, not just his body, but his mind as well are not human.
5. conflicting evidence to who is controlling who. sephiroth's aims seem to reflect more and more of jenovah's aims as the stroy progresses. for instance, he says he will do the same thing as "mother" and use the planet to traverse space and absorb the lifestream of other planet. remember, that his initial aim was just to become a god THROUGH the lifestream. and it is JENOVAH that gives him power, NOT the other way around.
6. still factual that cloud beat him twice, both in his most powerful incarnation
5. how was his first defeat a "surprise" attack? i mean he was normal sephiroth, that was defeated, then he turned to bizaaro sephirtoh, who was ALSO defeated, then he turned to safer sephiroth, and was ALSO defeated. [/B]
1. point STILL remains that both were conversing, so you can not bring that up as evidence for holding back
2. OR any1 whos a seph fanboy. he cudnt have tkd cloud, since that doesnt work directly on strong characters, or cloud sud have done it. the negetive lifestream WAS affecting every1 on the planet, giving them geostigmas, cloud already had it, so , how was he going to use it again??????? the wrest os baseless conjecture not backed by any evidence.
3. so , that shows again that cloud's attack speed was so fast that seph CUDNT counter it, not only beating your {seph cud have moved faster and beat cloud} theory, but also telling us that he did, even wiht all his power, have the durability to RESIST cloud's attack. remember, the team commented, that the fealing cloud had of himself, during the fight with sephiroth disappeared after they beat him. and that was why cloud was getting his ass handed in the beginning by sephiroth, and that was also why, he started giving seph trouble later on. {or r u suggesting that seph was taking it hard on cloud on the first half, and then took it easy on him in the later half???? not going for the obvious answer that he was never taking it easy, only cloud got stronger in the later part of the battle}
4. AC seph isnt 100% jenovah! what a thing to say. he is simply a memory, brought back to life by the power of jenovah. hence, he has all the same characteristics as before. after all, its not like jenovah's cells suddenly turned into sephiroth, they turned KADAJ into sephiroth, and he trun back after seph is defeated by cloud
5. again, one of the basic underlying themes of ff7 was nature vs nurture. both cloud and seph had the jenovah cells in them, and one turned out completely opposite to the other. and again, the affect of jenovah on seph and then sephiroth's own ambitions and hatred. all he wanted to do was become a god. but isnt it convenient that he chooses jenovah's course when he is reborn. and again, the basic story behind kadaj was that he wanted to KNOW who jenovah CHOSE to be her true son/successor{it was sephiroth} , and that implies control.
6. he held back holy and was done with it. you are also forgetting the role of aerith's death in holding back holy {if memory serves} . again, the advent children thing has been explained, he wasnt LEAGUES above cloud at all. thats just ur bias. he WAS going all out and he DID yet again lose to cloud and NOT willingly.
7. again, how was it a surpise attack? it was an attack which was too fast to be evaded/countered and too strong to b resisted by seph{again alluding to his power} . but it was done right infront of his face. it wasnt a stealth attack or anything.
Later on Sephiroth was overwhelming Cloud casually. Even forcing him on his feet to continue the abuse. Cloud couldn't take it anymore. Cloud was even disarmed by Sephiroth. The Character Induced Stupidity happens when Sephiroth doesn't decapitate Cloud and instead stabs his shoulder. But that is just part of Seph's character--which sucks because it makes him an idiot.
Even the creator states Sephiroth wasn't trying at all.
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Seph was holding back Genesis fairly easily, although he did use some effort of course and started to take the fight a little more seriously, but there is no basis for Genesis being stronger than Seph.
Plus there's the awesome part where Sephiroth impales Cloud but Cloud overpowers him and chucks him into the Mako.
That was Cloud's only awesome scene ever.
This is so old. I still like CC so I'll comment.
I read somewhere that Genesis is stronger in DoC when he returns.
Most of the fan boys seem to think that Sephiroth never went 'all out' but if you've actually played the main FFVII you'd know that Sephiroth ONLY toys around with Cloud. Not anyone else. So it's safe to assume he wasn't holding back. Throughout the scene he was mainly deflected Genesis's blows. But clearly caught him off guard when Sephiroth did some weird thing by going down and then slicing the ground. Of course Sephiroth didn't want to kill Genesis though but he wasn't holding back.
I've also read that apparently Genesis and Sephiroth are equal in power but he was degrading so was weaker now. Hence why he lost the fights with Zack.