how powerful was darth maul with the force.

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
Just to jump on the bandwagon:

And yet he still finds her ultimately useless. She is a non-issue in Palpatine's plans. (I think. I'm open to sources...)

It's irrelevant.

This could be taken to refer to many things. 'Strong with the dark side' has been used as a measure of 'evilness' in the past.
Palpatine: Anakin, go kill all of the Jedi [paraphrasing obviously]- Only then will you [b]be strong enough in the dark side to save your wife.
Yoda meant that she was very evil (committed to the D.S. and would be difficult to redeem) but was not necessarily strong in the Force itself. There is a distinction.[/b]

Dooku was also highly impressed with her "raw talent," which coupled with incomplete Jedi training and her inconsolable rage allowed her to become the dominant force on a warring planet at a relatively young age.

Originally posted by Faunus
Jump off now.

Way to jump back into bed with Gideon. I am allowed to disagree as a mental exercise, to just calm down.

Originally posted by Faunus

So was Maul. So were everyone but Dooku, the Separatist Council, Grievous, Yoda, Mace, Obi-Wan, and of course, Anakin.

It's irrelevant.

Maul was a tool to be used, Dooku was a tool to be used, so was teh Separatist Council, Grievous, Yoda, Mace, Obi-Wan and especially Anakin. They were all powerful enough or influential enough or skilled enough to factor into Sidious's plans. Maul was an enforcer, Dooku and Grievous were patsies, Yoda and Mace posed real threat to his plans, Kenobi warranted a Jedi Trap halfway across the galaxy, and then there's Anakin. The truth is that Ventress simply was not powerful enough to register as even a blip on Sidious's screen. Based on his judgment she was irrelevant.

Originally posted by Faunus

She has feats. Nearly Force-crushing Kenobi and almost destroying the heart of a centuries-old and rather powerful Jedi Master, to name two.

I didn't say that she was weak, I said she was not strong. She has some impressive feats, but there is nothing that even hints at her being a valuable gauge of power for the elite tier. So Dooku can manhandle her. So what? Ultimately, this is not a very impressive feat for Dooku.

Originally posted by Faunus

Dooku was also highly impressed with her "raw talent," which coupled with incomplete Jedi training and her inconsolable rage allowed her to become the dominant force on a warring planet at a relatively young age.

Her strength in the Force, or even her ranking on the tier system is not being debated. She is reasonably strong. What matters here is what Yoda meant when he said "Strong in the dark side you are. But, not that strong." I proposed one theory- that Yoda thought her very evil, but not particularly dangerous. This is supported by Sidious's disregard for her contributions and Dooku's manhandling- she is not a threat or measuring stick for any of the Saga's Elite.

I think Palpatine sums up Ventress best: A capable warrior. Nothing more or less.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
I think Palpatine sums up Ventress best: A capable warrior. Nothing more or less.

Wow. You made my post virtually redundant with just fourteen words. Bravo.

stuck up... arrogant... know it all...

U R UN GENUS!!

Also: I'm so sped, I meant, "[...]as a mental exercise, so just calm down."

I feel so stupid right now.

My intial post of Ventress was an oversimplification. A way of saying - she's not on Darth Maul's level.

Your oversimplification is wrong.

Originally posted by NonSensi-Klown
Your oversimplification is wrong.

No, its not. Maul >>>> Ventress.

No he's not.

Off the top of my head:
Maul:
Dark lord of the Sith
High end- Multiple forms
Took out Qui-Gon and Anoon (TEH SKILLZ)
Tanked lightning
"wizard of the force"
Mastery of Teras Ki (whatever- the Martial arts)
Sidious's enforcer

Ventress:
Jar Kai
Que'tek
Got manhandled by dooku
irrelevant to galactic plans (Sidious's)

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
Off the top of my head:
Maul:
Dark lord of the Sith
High end- Multiple forms
Took out Qui-Gon and Anoon (TEH SKILLZ)
Tanked lightning
"wizard of the force"
Mastery of Teras Ki (whatever- the Martial arts)
Sidious's enforcer

Don't forget being listed as the "deadlist Sith apprentice in history."

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
Off the top of my head:
Maul:
Dark lord of the Sith
High end- Multiple forms
Took out Qui-Gon and Anoon (TEH SKILLZ)
Tanked lightning
"wizard of the force"
Mastery of Teras Ki (whatever- the Martial arts)
Sidious's enforcer

Ventress:
Jar Kai
Que'tek
Got manhandled by dooku
irrelevant to galactic plans (Sidious's)

You miss a lot of shit off the top of your head.

I can't tell if you're purpsoely being biased or are just ignorant.

I'll grant you that I was biased, but Ventress is not in Maul's league. His speed was great enough to challenge Sidious. I feel safe from fanboyism when saying he's at least (and I'm being cautious here) one tier firmly above Ventress. Maybe two. She's just not that good.

Ventress > Maul. At least in sheer, mighty awesomeness. Maul's lame.

Though, he's most decidedly above her in fighting skill.

the only force power that i seen darth maul do was force choke he uesd it to kill one of black sun.

Originally posted by Master Crimzon
Ventress > Maul. At least in sheer, mighty awesomeness. Maul's lame.

Though, he's most decidedly above her in fighting skill.

I'd argue that Maul is pure Badassery incarnate.

Originally posted by beast1234
the only force power that i seen darth maul do was force choke he uesd it to kill one of black sun.

Grammar never hurt anyone. "The only force power that I have seen Darth Maul use was Force Choke. He used it to kill one of the Black Sun.

This way makes you sound less like a hillbilly, and more like someone worth responding to. Give it a try, you too might find yourself Hooked on Phonics! (TM)

Originally posted by Enyalus

In the Clone Wars movie Anakin casually catches Dooku's lightning on his blade using one hand.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
No Anakin uses two hands, and its sure as hell not casual, he kinda struggles
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmRaQIxqUh8
Oh and btw this isn't even Dooku using two hands lol, this is one hand dooku

Looks easy to me. But yeah, two handed. My bad.

Originally posted by NonSensi-Klown
No he's not.

yes. he is.

Originally posted by Autokrat
Maul is clearly overrated, the dude has all those Force strength and shit, but we never see him get laid. Yea, that's right.

Ki-Adi Mundi is a haus then. He had, what, like ten wives.

I'd say that Maul is capable with the Force but in the same way that Obi-wan is. Not flashy with it, but capable of holding his own against most.

So this is basically what Yoda was saying:

"Evil you are young one... But not that evil"

I don't think Yoda was using the "strong with the dark side" line as a way of measuring ventress's evilness.