Scathan vs. Abraxas

Originally posted by wolvie316

apparently many people here made up stuff in their own mind on how things went down. haha reality warp. yea right. when did that happen. read the comic again and this time analyze it fully.

its up to you guys whether u want to agree with what makes sense
or continue to believe what somebody shoved into your head
and make you believe that Scathan is actually more powerful than the living tribunal...
ask urself how much sense does that make.

Protege instantly copies whatever he sees,
no matter what you throw at him, he'll just continue to cancel it out,
because he'll instantly become it's equal,
then, he surpasses that equal as he continues to absorb,
this is all done on the moment instantly, it's a re-action of Protege's really.

I remember when he battled the Beyonder,
before he copied an iota of Beyonder's power, he was weaker than Beyonder,
in fact, all of Protege's power at that point was nothing to Beyonder,
but as soon as Protege was able to tap into one piece of Beyonder's power,
it was done, Protege was able to battle Beyonder, and in fact stalemate him,
cause everything Beyonder did, Protege instantly was able to copy and re-direct.

Eternity even states that Protege is fast reaching "infinite Omnipotence"
(and this is before copying Hawkgod/Eternity/LT's power)

Anyway, Beyonder had to run, he simply couldn't win.

When one page prior he had Protege like his ***** in a crystal.

Meh, LT clearly states, Protege is a Multiversal threat!

(and this is before copying Hawkgod/Eternity/LT's power) so go figure. 😬

To begin with,

by the end, the LT was definitely weaker than Protege:

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After Protege copied LT's power, while standing in Scathan's hand:

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Beyonder stated "on the boy rests the fate of any and all realities"

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The writer gives us the reactions of the LT, Eternity, Scathan and Hawgod.

The LT's conclusion is ... "logical confirmation"

So the LT himself agrees!

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Here Eternity states that Scathan's "purpose
is to record and approve of what transpires"

Eternity also tells Hawkgod to save every iota of his power to help battle Protege:

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Here the LT seems to know Protege has now surpassed his power.

Protege notices the LT, Eternity, Hawkgod and GOTG are joining against him,
so Protege summoned Mephisto and his daughter to attack the GOTG,
'Talon' was wearing the 'Ancient One's Amulet' ...
the LT actually states he/they may need it later against Protege:

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Here Protege prepares to erase the LT, Eternity, Hawgod and GOTG,

The last scan shows Scathan's power interrupting Protege:

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Scathan stomping Protege with a gesture:

Protege is rendered in-affective with his mighty gesture:

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The LT (while Scathan restrains Protege physically)
absorbs Protege into the 'Eternal Hourglass' which lies within the LT:

Again,
it's Scathan that has the last say in the matter (sorta speak)

"And so it ends, and Scathan approves"

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This is proof that Protege had surpassed the LT in power.

Evidently what the LT said earlier was true,
they were indeed going to need the 'Ancient One's Amulet'
the LT specifically.

Here we learn that the LT was using the 'Ancient One's Amulet'
as a source of power to increase his own in order to deal with judging Protege:

==================================

As for the Handbook account:

(excerpt from the official Marvel Handbook - LT bio 2006)

===================================

LT's bio also corroborates what took place on panel in the GOTG arc,
it also clearly states that Scathan saved Realty:

"LT was nearly usurped by [/u]Protege,
whose ability to duplicate[/u] the powers of others
allowed him to manifest the LT's own power."

srugdoped

Originally posted by wolvie316
Scathan is actually more powerful than the living tribunal...ask urself how much sense does that make.

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This is no surprise actually,
Protege was meant to be that final evolution of life that supersedes the Abstracts.

He was created by a 100 generations of trials,
"through selective breeding, genetic manipulation,
and various chemicals, drugs, and sciences,
and arcane magicks."

"The most powerful being ever conceived of mortal woman"

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This is how Protege's powers work,
it begins at the visual level, I've never disputed that,
but later Protege himself stated that was only for the time being,
as he told Malevolence concerning copying "unseen thoughts" "not yet anyway" ...

Which is true, cause later he was copying power more effectively, like LT's.

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Still, Protege learns how to use everything he copies instantly,
and he adds everything he copies to his own power,

Because of this Martinex says:

"This Protege may be the most powerful person ever born!"

This is also
why Martinex fears the thought of Protege meeting powerhouses like Galactus,
as we know, he met the embodiment of all there is,
and the LT.

Martinex's fears were realized indeed.

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This is what the LT and Eternity said about Protege
when Protege became aware of what he could do:

Eternity: "The Child has become aware"

LT: "And with awareness comes great power, Eternity"

Eternity: "Perhaps the greatest yet born to mortals"

LT: Or Immortals"

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Wow ... nuff said ....

Evidently, it seems that the more power Protege collects,
the more effective his copying abilities become.
(based on how he copied LT's power)

Hopefully 2009 Official Marvel Handbooks Deluxe Edition
will have Protege's bio.
Until then, while the circumstances are a bit merky,
there's no denying that Protege copied LT's power,
and indeed became more powerful than the LT,
and finally, Scathan proved to be more powerful than Protege.

That's the indisputable bottom line.

Originally posted by Galan007
you see, LT is only omnipotent, whereas scathan is omnipotent +1 (maybe +2) - which is why scathan > LT.

in short, it makes perfect sense (comic-wise.) 👆

Heh.

Protege was copying LT's conceptual purpose while standing on Scathan's hand.

As for LT displaying power that was in Protege's sight:

Like I said, he copied LT's power, which is to judge any and all,
from Scathan's hand he did it,
but, how do you think Protege ended up in Scathan's hand?

When Protege and Beyonder were battling a second time,
they were interrupted by something incredible:

"Suddenly the two figures vanish into an intra-dimensional confluence
unlike anything ever seen in this OR ANY other Reality."

(right before Protege's eyes ... somebody ...
... just warped the shit out of reality
like it had never been done before ... wow!)

Guess who did that?

For those that don't click on scans ... that's the LT who did that. 🙂

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So they end up on Scathan's hand, like I said before:

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Mephisto clarifies that incredible power was used
to cause an intra-dimensional confluence of that magnitude:

"The Force necessary to initiate an intra-dimensional confluence of that magnitude,
could ONLY emanate from ..."

(next page, we're with the LT and company as the judgement continues.

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That's what was happening all that time in Scathan's hand,
Protege was being judged by the LT.

It seems Protege was able to copy this authoritative conjuncture,
when LT is judging you, LT is exercising his power.

This explains why Protege had copied and surpassed LT's power,
and we know for a fact Protege did surpass the LT,
cause the LT needed to draw the Amulet
to supplement his own power to deal with Protege. (I proved this with on panel evidence)

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Here's Protege, clearly copying the Cosmic powers, including the LT's,
just by observing the proceedings of his judgement:

No power is being used by anyone,
the only thing that is going on is LT's Judgement,
and Eternity & Hawkgod adding to the drama with dialogue,
LOOK at Protege, there, copying away.

👆

It seems Scathan had all the respect/status and power necessary to perform,
and it seems, this respect/status/power comes from above.

From issues back, the LT himself had to wait for Scathan before proceeding:

"We may proceed once --- HE (Scathan) arrives"

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"Silence! The Approver's arrival is imminent"

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"Judgement is upon you both! To that end, HE (Scathan) shall bear witness!"

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"The Celestials' (Scathan) purpose, is to record and Approve of what transpires"

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Scathan was obviously being verbally pampered as the ultimate authority,
(it's like, you better be good/careful, or Santa/God will punish you)
indeed, in the end,
it was Scathan who by disapproving stopped Protege from erasing LT and company:

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It was also Scathan that ultimately ended the drama by simply approving:

Originally posted by Mr Master
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It was also Scathan that ultimately ended the drama by simply approving:

I always lol at that panel.

Originally posted by Galan007

you see, LT is only omnipotent,
whereas scathan is omnipotent +1 (maybe +2). that's why scathan > LT. 👆

Originally posted by Philosophía

Let us not forget that Living Tribunal + that amulet or whatever he was using > normal Living Tribunal. Thus, Living Tribunal's power + that amulet = God's power, because Living Tribunal is second only to God.

Heh.

LT + Amulet = God's power?

no2

LT is though second to TOAA, in the present Marvel Universe,
the bio isn't contradicting itself,
because this story takes place 1000 years in the future,
so until then, LT is the top of the food chain below TOAA.

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Abraxas ... his purpose is to destroy the Omniverse:

"ALL That Ever Was, Ever IS, or Ever Will Be"

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Franklin says about the Omniversal Guardian:

"That's Roma, she's gonna help us fight the dark man" (Abraxas)

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Roma (Omniversal Guardian) makes it clear:

"And if we do not act soon ... All of Time will be lost to us"

Abraxas is a Multiversal power of Omniversal significance.

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Here are Nine Universes that would later be destroyed by Abraxas:

"Imagine each of those Worlds like sand in an hourglass ...
an hourglass which Abraxas will shatter"

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This is aside from all these UniverseS Abraxas collapsed:

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Meh,

And Abraxas only needs to approach UniverseS to collapse them:
(he doesn't even need to attack or enter said Realities) 🙂

(the Multiverse in fact)

"creatures of the Multiverse Mixing --- Reality folding onto itself

This ... is what brings Abraxas" (like I said, just by approaching)

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Here are some Bio excerpts to confirm my posts which only contain the On Panel evidence:

(reference-Official Marvel Handbook 2006 - Abraxas bio)

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How Abraxas folds/collapses Universes:

"While Abraxas drew near,
the walls of dimensional space began to blur" (fold/collapse)

It goes on to explain the ramifications of Abraxas approaching Realities.

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We shouldn't be surprised ... it's his Job:

Occupation: "Dimensional Destroyer"

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Evidently, only a power UN-like can defeat Abraxas:

"Realizing the danger Abraxas posed,
the FF went on a Dimension-hopping journey to recover the UN,
the One weapon that could destroy him"

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Indeed, Roma (Omniversal Guardian) stated the same thing On Panel:

Roma: "It will be a weapon of unimaginable power that will WIN This day"

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Here Galactus says it, and Reed realizes this truth:

Galactus: "But This Time, This Day can end ONLY one way"

Reed: "Yes .... God help me, I can see that now"

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More Handbook info on Abraxas: (with on panel corroboration)

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AB - FF Ultimate Guide bio:

Restructuring Reality is nothing to Abraxas!

"He can restructure matter and convert physical matter into pure energy ...
he has destroyed entire PLANES of Reality"

"We're dealing with a being of Godlike powers, BENDING Reality means nothing to him"

facepalm

(I'm starting to like this smilie)

Originally posted by Philosophía
facepalm

(I'm starting to like this smilie)

facepalm

(I like this smilie) ... forgetu

I have no idea what this has to do with the thread, but it seems fun.