Originally posted by Devil King
But it isn't going to just happen as a matter of course. It isn't the social version of trickle down economics. It has to be fought for and it has to be accepted, not just tolerated because there's a law. All those examples you mention didn't occur because there was a flash of understanding or an epiphany. It happened because it was fought for by the gay people in those countries. So that cultural acceptance BigRed mentioned happens when actions like Prop 8 are defeated and the rights of people are upheld. These groups spent 25 million dollars to revoke those rights, and nearly as much was spent to defend them. That's a lot of hate to fight, irrational hate and resentment. It may be one law in one state in one country across one ocean from you, but it's my home. It's the home of a lot of other gay people. I think the fact that you live in a place that, as a country, has made efforts to recognize the relationships of homosexuals may explain the perspective. However, I do disagree that equality will win simply because it's the most logical end result. We're talking about a country where it took hundreds of years to get rid of slavery. Logic doesn't always come quickly to us.
I'll be frank- I don't really agree. Yes, people always have to fight for their own corner. But homosexuals were always doing that- did yoy think change happened simply because they nagged enough? That people got bored of them complaining?
No, I think the change is down to social shift over time as the ideas of tolerance and equality get increasingly widespread. It is in that environment that rights are attained; the fight for rights didn't change at all, society's preparedness to listen did. Obviously people must still keep fighting for such rights, I am not saying their efforts are trivial. But the story of equality is a broad one.
Right now, many still think that a position of giving Civil Unions wothout the term marriage is indeed equal. In time, that position will look foolish to everyone as people realise how much people who thought that way misunderstood the construct, the social power of a word like 'marriage' and how if you don't give the word, you are still excluding and still effectively discriminating. The shift continues. However, it must be said, once you have all the same rights as a marriage but not the name- well, obviously that's still an issue, but in the end it's still a great advance and a much smaller issue than it could have been. As you mention my country, what we have here right now is a situation where gay couples can get unions that have the same legal force of marriage, all the same tax breaks and what-not, the benefits, the same kind of ceremony performed by the same registrars that do normal marriage... but not actually yet using the term marriage. And you know what? I don't think that's worth yelling about- because after a while of things being like that, no-one will see the distinction any more, and it being called marriage will just drop into place. It is already inevitable.
So I do think equality will inevitability win, yes- no matter how much hate, despite the issues you raise.