I need debating help

Started by Lord Lucien3 pages

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
I think you are overlooking how all force users fight.....precognition they all of it and it is used in lightsaber combat all the time in fact everytime aside from when Ulic fought vima when he was stripped of the force.

so if voldemort were to teleport wouldn't vader know where he is going to be?

Ah that's a Deus ex. It gives Vader and every Force user the presumed ability to instantly know everything that's coming their way. But as we've seen, they don't always.

I don't think Vader would be able to instantaneously react to instantaneous teleportation, especially if it's right behind him. A scenario I imagine is Vader not using his full power of TK right away. Many instances have shown him engaging in light TK (choke) or engaging in saber combat. I think for him to outright squash Voldemort's body in one quick movement he'd have to have witnessed Voldemort's destructive powers, and by then it may be too late for Vader. Lol, imagine him trying to use his saber or his glove to block a spell.

well voldemort wouldn't go in with aveda kadevra right off that bat either he says himself that he likes to torutre people until they beg him to kil them

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
K plz don't close this thread. I need help with my argument of why vader would beat voldemort in fight.

this debate is going on at my work and I need some help mainly because I don't own all the harry potter books and getting citations for why voldemort wouldn't use the aveda kedavera right off the bat because he would try and torture vader first .

any way i need your guys's help so if you would help me i would appreciate it.

Because....no, he wouldn't.

Though, maybe you'd like to check out these 'ere threads for arguments on both sides.

Palpatine vs Voldemort

Yoda versus Dumbledore (the Force versus Hogwarts magic)

Though those do not include the EU.

I still haven't seen any evidence that puts voldemort over vader.

so he has a one hit kill move so does vader BUT the point is that Voldemort misses with his killing spell ALOT without any interference from anyone in book 5 against dunbledore and harry. for someone who can move faster than Humans i'd give vader the edge in being able to dodge the attack.

also Voldemort and Snape both say that Voldemorte likes to torture his victims making them beg him to kill them.( the exceptions to this are Dumbledore because he is afraid of him and after book 4 he just wants to kill harry as soon as he can)

so i guess my main point is that both will go in underestimating their opponent but Vader is far more likely to go for the kill before Voldemorte

I belive if voldemort was smart about this hewould apperate around and sling spells at vader but he wont he doesn't apperate around during duels atleast he has never been said or shown or described as doing so.

lastly I believe that the force>magic becaus ethe force is in everything and you can do just about anything with the force the ability to destroy a planet is insignificant in comparison to the force and I don't believe that Kriea was lying when she said something along the lines of the force can do anything where as magic in the HP world has more restrictions than the force for example in book 5 snape says, ”time and space matter in magic, Potter. ” I know this is a weak argument but Time and Space do not matte with the force, The force controls time and space and bothe can be manipulated by the force.

If I am just being ignorant i'm sorry I don't mean to but I just don't see how Voldemort can win.

A better comparison would be Sidious vs Voldemort.

Pure evil vs pure evil.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
A better comparison would be Sidious vs Voldemort.

Pure evil vs pure evil.

Alas, Voldemort is turned into a retard in Book 7.

Originally posted by Gideon
Alas, Voldemort is turned into a retard in Book 7.

What do you mean?

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Ah that's a Deus ex. It gives Vader and every Force user the presumed ability to instantly know everything that's coming their way. But as we've seen, they don't always.

I don't think Vader would be able to instantaneously react to instantaneous teleportation, especially if it's right behind him. A scenario I imagine is Vader not using his full power of TK right away. Many instances have shown him engaging in light TK (choke) or engaging in saber combat. I think for him to outright squash Voldemort's body in one quick movement he'd have to have witnessed Voldemort's destructive powers, and by then it may be too late for Vader. Lol, imagine him trying to use his saber or his glove to block a spell.

well.. the same goes for Voldemort also. He might not just kill Vader, because he doesn't know the extent of his capabilities.

And this really does depend on who attacks first. If voldemort hits with the killing curse, Vader is screwed, and if Vader implodes Voldemort, Volde's screwed.

I would tend to say that Vader would win 7/10 because he is faster than Voldemort, has precog to sense that Voldemort would try to teleport or something.

If Voldemort teleports, Vader could sense where he was before he was there. (this all depends really..) If he didn't sense fast enough, he would die, obviously. but then there is the case where Voldemort always misses for some retarded reason. Vader, being faster than Voldemort would likely be able to dodge the spells.

Also can the Force be used to block spells? and can Voldemort's shield be used to block lightsaber energy?
Clarification needed to continue talking about this stuff.

maybe i'll change it to 5/10 times.. lol

EDIT: well I recently read a really little bit of one of the other threads posted here, and some people said that magic can be used to turn people into animals, freeze time teleport etc. If you think about it, the Force can do that also. well not the freeze time part, although they could seemingly slow down falls, and time but not freeze it. maybe some powerful sith could but idk. There was someone who was immortal, not yoda, and sith magic can be used to turn people into rakaguols or whatever those things were in the Original KotOR, which would qualify as transforming people into animals. There was also another instance where some sith lady used sith magic to make these abominations out of metal and humans or something like that. I don't quite remember very well. I'll go look it up. Oh ya and Cade skywalker was able to Revive the dead, and Medical Jedi such as Barriss Offee was able to heal large wounds etc.

and another question: Would Force Lightning be considered a type of magic?

Originally posted by kotorfan

Also can the Force be used to block spells? and can Voldemort's shield be used to block lightsaber energy?

and another question: Would Force Lightning be considered a type of magic?

We don't know. Nobody knows. It's comparing two unique and defining aspects of two different universes. They're not comparable.

And no.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
We don't know. Nobody knows. It's comparing two unique and defining aspects of two different universes. They're not comparable.

And no.

Then, putting Voldemort against Vader is pointless.

because they're not comparable...

Originally posted by Jaeh.is.Awesome
Then, putting Voldemort against Vader is pointless.

because they're not comparable...

Ergo the rules of the Versus forum.

QED.

I thought I answered this thread on the first page.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Ergo the rules of the Versus forum.
Originally posted by Publius II
QED.

right.

We realize.

they'd both sit down and get to know each other first. old volde would say how he can't smell without a nose, and Vader would say he can only smell burning.

on that note Vader can smell...1-0

Two different worlds,but technically all magic is,is the force,and all,the force is,is energy,which is the force. Long winded yeah.

I would lean more to vader,simply because vader can choke him befor voldo whips out is magic wand. Vader can even tk **** up voldo at a distance,even on anotehr planet. Remember there is nmo limitation for how far someone is to use the force on them.

Where as voldo needs to project his power from close range,itll be a matter of time,and vader would just force rush on over and sere him in half.

Its very likely that if both where in each others world,that the main character of that universe would have the advantage. EG;like voldo in harrys world vs vader,voldo would win,and vise versa.

In the same world,yeah vader. Some would say voldo but i dont agree. Trinket spells are o mach for the power of the force.