Kenshiro (With upgrade) vs Android 17 and 18

Originally posted by BradBalboa
they werent far yeh, he said im closing in meaning he was trackin their Ki to find them, DBZ volume 10, it says on the bak "on the other side of the planet goku awakens within his healing capsule and streaks to the battlefield to turn the tide"..Plus your forgettign even gouk feats as a child where on kens and Above kens level multiplying kens power by 20, isnt gonan make a difference when fighting 17 and 18...

Well they could have just been referring to that specific area when they said "on the other side of the planet", as we know that they weren't too far away.

As for kid Goku's feats, I wouldn't be so sure of that if I were you. Sure Goku did have a lot of impressive feats as a child but to say they were all on par with Kenshiro's, that's something you might wanna rethink, especially in terms of strenght feats.

You do realize that Goku himself said "it's not very far off", and in the manga I've read it never said anything about being on the other side of the planet. Not to mention that no timeframe was ever given anyway so it's kind of pointless.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
You do realize that Goku himself said "it's not very far off", and in the manga I've read it never said anything about being on the other side of the planet. Not to mention that no timeframe was ever given anyway so it's kind of pointless.

As for Gokus childhood feats, in the firts issue of the Manga before any real trainging Goku lifts bulmas car above his head and throws it, lifts boulders out of the ground bigger than himelf and crushed them with wide open arms. Yamcha even lifted a tower of emperoer pilafs castle of bulma, anywho i cnat see kenshiro lasting agaisnt the androids, they took out all the z fighters with little effort eahc of which is far more powerful than kenshiro even if his powers are multiplied 20X

Originally posted by BradBalboa
As for Gokus childhood feats, in the firts issue of the Manga before any real trainging Goku lifts bulmas car above his head and throws it, lifts boulders out of the ground bigger than himelf and crushed them with wide open arms. Yamcha even lifted a tower of emperoer pilafs castle of bulma, anywho i cnat see kenshiro lasting agaisnt the androids, they took out all the z fighters with little effort eahc of which is far more powerful than kenshiro even if his powers are multiplied 20X

Kenshiro stopped a train with his aura, stop a giant with his backhand, make a waterfall flow upward with his aura, strike 708 times in a second. and IIRC little Goku lifted Bulma's motorcycle. not her car. even he struggled. Kenshiro's power is still above little Goku. so many power feats for Kenshiro and I think they are all above little Goku's feats.

I still have no idea if he can survived against androids if he can use kaioken 20x since I never see Kenshiro used kaioken.

Kenshiro gets raped. Their mechnical androiads. the only real once krillen wishs it. Also. These are the same people who tank blows from people who were Class 100 strength back in the Namek saga. These androids are the same androids that when struck by a sword from soemone who is around class 100 it broke.

Androids dominate

Originally posted by Csdabest
Kenshiro gets raped. Their mechnical androiads. the only real once krillen wishs it. Also. These are the same people who tank blows from people who were Class 100 strength back in the Namek saga. These androids are the same androids that when struck by a sword from soemone who is around class 100 it broke.

Androids dominate

Kenshiro is way above class 100 and that same sword would break on his body as well. Kenshiro will learn their body movements and counter easily. Without this upgrade he was already lifting 1000 ton rocks and a whole gang of people with ease. You also have no proof that any Z fighter can lift over 100 tons. When have they ever been seen lifting anything?

Originally posted by BradBalboa
As for Gokus childhood feats, in the firts issue of the Manga before any real trainging Goku lifts bulmas car above his head and throws it, lifts boulders out of the ground bigger than himelf and crushed them with wide open arms. Yamcha even lifted a tower of emperoer pilafs castle of bulma, anywho i cnat see kenshiro lasting agaisnt the androids, they took out all the z fighters with little effort eahc of which is far more powerful than kenshiro even if his powers are multiplied 20X

I really wish you would debate the androids and only use the androids feats instead of using Goku to do your battle. We are only accepting feats from each combatant. Also Kenshiro has done things that Goku will never be able to do like fighting while in a coma so you can't say that Goku has completely surpassed him.

Originally posted by Csdabest
Kenshiro gets raped. Their mechnical androiads. the only real once krillen wishs it. Also. These are the same people who tank blows from people who were Class 100 strength back in the Namek saga. These androids are the same androids that when struck by a sword from soemone who is around class 100 it broke.

Androids dominate

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Kenshiro is way above class 100 and that same sword would break on his body as well. Kenshiro will learn their body movements and counter easily. Without this upgrade he was already lifting 1000 ton rocks and a whole gang of people with ease. You also have no proof that any Z fighter can lift over 100 tons. When have they ever been seen lifting anything?

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
I really wish you would debate the androids and only use the androids feats instead of using Goku to do your battle. We are only accepting feats from each combatant. Also Kenshiro has done things that Goku will never be able to do like fighting while in a coma so you can't say that Goku has completely surpassed him.

Gokou's feats are perfectly usable for the androids. Because everybody in the series have the same exact powerset. Anything Gokou has done from the android saga down to the start of DB is also within anybodies abilitiy who is stronger. Which include the androids. Anything from Cell Saga Gokou and up isn't usable for the Androids but that's besides the point because Gokou is stronger.

Kenshiro was able to see Han's movements and fists before that it was said that no one could see the shadows of Han's fists. He also saw Uighar's whips and tied them up together without anyone knowing or seeing it. Kenshiro has pinpointed a target from a mile away and hit him with a spear with extreme accuracy. Once again this is Ken with an upgrade so all of his skills and abilities are amped. Saying he can't keep up with them is like saying base goku can't see the androids. The androids haven't even exhibited great combat speed above the norm that Ken usually fights. He has blocked the whole image fists fighters with ease and he has fought and blocked while he appears to be standing still. Show me one scene where the androids fight faster than that. Even if you can show me that then it only means that Kenshiro can do what the androids can do without his upgrade.

Originally posted by Kento
Gokou's feats are perfectly usable for the androids. Because everybody in the series have the same exact powerset. Anything Gokou has done from the android saga down to the start of DB is also within anybodies abilitiy who is stronger. Which include the androids. Anything from Cell Saga Gokou and up isn't usable for the Androids but that's besides the point because Gokou is stronger.

Not really. If they actually display all the other feats, then maybe but we can't just apply everybody's feats to anybody stronger. Plus, you also forget that many characters also have their own unique abilities.

Originally posted by SmashBro
Not really. If they actually display all the other feats, then maybe but we can't just apply everybody's feats to anybody stronger. Plus, you also forget that many characters also have their own unique abilities.

Which is why I don't give Andriod 20 or 19 the title of a planet buster. I hear a bunch of talk of them being class 100 strength but they never shown anything at that level, never lifted it or anything where Kenshiro has been shown lifting over 1000 tons.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Kenshiro was able to see Han's movements and fists before that it was said that no one could see the shadows of Han's fists. He also saw Uighar's whips and tied them up together without anyone knowing or seeing it. Kenshiro has pinpointed a target from a mile away and hit him with a spear with extreme accuracy. Once again this is Ken with an upgrade so all of his skills and abilities are amped. Saying he can't keep up with them is like saying base goku can't see the androids. The androids haven't even exhibited great combat speed above the norm that Ken usually fights. He has blocked the whole image fists fighters with ease and he has fought and blocked while he appears to be standing still. Show me one scene where the androids fight faster than that. Even if you can show me that then it only means that Kenshiro can do what the androids can do without his upgrade.

At the start of Gokou's training with Korin, Korin was able to steal Gokou's DB without Gokou even knowing, and Gokou was already as fast as Roshi who can catch machine gun fire easily, and in just three days Gokou caught up to that speed of Korin. Tao Pai Pai was able to kill a guy with his tongue. Gokou easily surpassed his strength as a child. Gokou's body as a kid, before any of his training from Roshi or Korin, was already strong as steel and his durability has only increased. During the first tournament Tien is in Gokou is able to move so fast Roshi nor Krillen can see him during his fight with Krillen. And at the same tournament was able to steal Roshi's glasses before Tien could finish the Solar Flare, and get back to the spot he was in without Roshi even noticing.

Kenshiro is at the most in leagues with Saiyan Saga when it comes to speed and that's giving him the benifit of the doubt. Making him 20 times faster isn't going to put him even close to Androids speed. He isn't going to be able to see them, he isn't going to be able to dodge them, and he isn't going to be able to counter them. The androids may not have the speed feats themselves like the fighters from DB but they fact that they are faster than the Z fighters during the android saga means they can do everything to a much, much higher level than the DB fighters did.

Originally posted by SmashBro
Not really. If they actually display all the other feats, then maybe but we can't just apply everybody's feats to anybody stronger. Plus, you also forget that many characters also have their own unique abilities.

Originally posted by Kento
Kenshiro is at the most in leagues with Saiyan Saga when it comes to speed and that's giving him the benifit of the doubt. Making him 20 times faster isn't going to put him even close to Androids speed. He isn't going to be able to see them, he isn't going to be able to dodge them, and he isn't going to be able to counter them. The androids may not have the speed feats themselves like the fighters from DB but they fact that they are faster than the Z fighters during the android saga means they can do everything to a much, much higher level than the DB fighters did.

He's ABOVE the Saiyan Saga. Nobody in that saga has ever shown the speed Kenshiro showed during his fight with Han and even before that, Kenshiro was doing so many things in less than a second.

Originally posted by Kento
That anybody else can learn. They have the same exact powerset. Them using different attacks don't mean anything at all. It's all about power scaling in DB.

They can fly and shoot ki blasts but that's it. Just simply beating someone doesn't mean they can do everything the other characters did. All do know is that they're strong enough to beat certain characters and what they do during the fight. Saying that the androids can inherit every single feat prior to that is just an assumption.

Originally posted by SmashBro
He's leagues ABOVE the Saiyan Saga. Nobody in that saga has ever shown the speed Kenshiro showed during his fight with Han and even before that, Kenshiro was doing so many things in less than a second.

They can fly and shoot ki blasts but that's it. Just simply beating someone doesn't mean they can do everything the other characters did. All do know is that they're strong enough to beat certain characters and what they do during the fight. Saying that the androids can inherit every single feat prior to that is just an assumption.

The higher their ki is why they are able to blitz people, get faster than other people, and get more powerful. While strength may not be able to go to everybody speed feats, and blasting feats can go to anybody with a higher ki. Freeza would be able to blitz Reccome, Burta, and Jeice faster than Gokou did. But we don't see Freeza have any speed feats. Because Gokou was on his level when they fought, and every time Freeza powered up a new hero came that was on his level. That and Freeza liked toying with people and not use his full power. Majin Vegeta could blitz Cell Jr's just as easy as Gohan did but we never see Vegeta blitz anybody because he only fought stronger opponents.

I'm sorry Kento, but Kenshiro's reaction speed and combat reflexes are insane. The androids can be faster than him but he can still see them. As I have said Han and Uighar's whips appeared to move faster than them and he was able to see Han's fist so why couldn't he see them when they have no speed feats like that? Kenshiro will be durable enought to take blows from them and all it takes is one attack for him to learn their moves and counter accordingly.

Originally posted by Kento
Roshi and Krillen did plenty of things in less than a second also during the first tournament.

Which was probably just a joke moment.

Originally posted by Kento
The higher their ki is why they are able to blitz people, get faster than other people, and get more powerful. While strength may not be able to go to everybody speed feats, and blasting feats can go to anybody with a higher ki. Freeza would be able to blitz Reccome, Burta, and Jeice faster than Gokou did. But we don't see Freeza have any speed feats. Because Gokou was on his level when they fought, and every time Freeza powered up a new hero came that was on his level. That and Freeza liked toying with people and not use his full power. Majin Vegeta could blitz Cell Jr's just as easy as Gohan did but we never see Vegeta blitz anybody because he only fought stronger opponents.

Actually, Freeza did display some speed feats when fighting SS1 Goku. If I recall correctly, King Kai couldn't even keep up with them. As for Maijin Vegeta, yeah he could but then again, other than attacking a worn out Goku and the other weaker guys, Cell Jrs never really did anything all that impressive themselves.

oh my god.... seriously think ho far in the Dragonball mythos the androids are, each saga someone gets so powerful that no1 can see them, it happanes again and again ther always surpas their prior selves, the androids speeds and much much fatser than Kenshiro even 20X...

So in otherwords, you're saying every fight after the Krillen and Roshi fight was less than a second?

Originally posted by BradBalboa
oh my god.... seriously think ho far in the Dragonball mythos the androids are, each saga someone gets so powerful that no1 can see them, it happanes again and again ther always surpas their prior selves, the androids speeds and much much fatser than Kenshiro even 20X...

Where did you get that info from? What proof do you have that no one can see them? We can see them actually moving and fighting in every fight I saw. In Ken's fight with Han they were standing still and only moved like an inch but they appeared to be standing still. Look at the speed feats video I posted.