Originally posted by Enyalus
Infinite pages in a finite space = impossible. I'm supposed to jump to the conclusion of something that's logical when the very concept of it is illogical?
Originally posted by Naija boy
Hmm wasnt the spectre's supposed infinite weight being supported by a moon ( i seem to remeber him landing on a moon or something similar). that in itself tells us the real concept of mass wasnt being used.
Originally posted by Enyalus
Infinite pages in a finite space = impossible. I'm supposed to jump to the conclusion of something that's logical when the very concept of it is illogical?
Who says the space was finite? It could be explained via dimensional portals with the book being a sought of gateway to an infinite dimension. Just the same way magical items of that nature work.
Originally posted by fangirl101
I seem to remember that when the spectre touches the mortal plane, his properties change.
Huh? If his properties "change" in a way that affects his weight then it would explain superman,wonderwoman and if iirc a gl were able to temporarily lift him. It also explains how his supposed infinite weight was supported by a moon. Aside that i have no idea what u mean
Originally posted by Naija boyHe explains as they struggle to lift him that his body carries the conciousness of reality. It's obviously too heavy for Superman and wondy to hold indefinitely.
Huh? If his properties "change" in a way that affects his weight then it would explain superman,wonderwoman and if iirc a gl were able to temporarily lift him. It also explains how his supposed infinite weight was supported by a moon. Aside that i have no idea what u mean
Originally posted by fangirl101So Spectre weighs more than an infinite amount of weight?
He explains as they struggle to lift him that his body carries the conciousness of reality. It's obviously too heavy for Superman and wondy to hold indefinitely.
But I can safely bet that it was beyond the weight of an infinite book. Which superman supported with another far easier.
Originally posted by fangirl101
He explains as they struggle to lift him that his body carries the conciousness of reality. It's obviously too heavy for Superman and wondy to hold indefinitely.
But I can safely bet that it was beyond the weight of an infinite book. Which superman supported with another far easier.
Really has nothing to do with what im saying. Im calling into question the belief (and frankly quite laughable one) that the spectre's weight was infinite and at that point superman and wonderwoman were supporting the weight of all existence and yet that same weight was supported by a moon. Really taking things that obviously involve unkown metaphysical concepts and trying to use physical terms to quantify them is quite futile.
I think there needs to be a distinction between the capability to do something, and the ability to do something. While it seems the two are the same, and any differences are semantic (they mostly are), there is an important kernel of distinction.
Take two people ....both twins with IQs at the gifted level (nature). However, one (let's call him Tony) is adopted by a couple who put a huge emphasis on education (not just book smarts, but flexibility of thought, theory of knowledge, and a well-rounded approach to life). The other twin (let's call him Johnny) is adopted by a couple who is more or less generally clueless about stuff, do not expose Johnny or provide an environment condusive to learning, and live in a neighborhood that is more or less anathema to the growing mental needs of a young person.
Now, fast forward a couple of years, and look at the two of them. Tony will be a confident individual, who is hyper-smart (again, not just in academics but in everything from proper etiquette to portfolio management), and able to fit into any social situation flawlessly. Johnny, on the other hand, is a misfit, prone to violent aggression and/or self-regression, is definitely not to be categorized under 'smart,' and if he seems 'confident' it is most likely animalistic alpha-agression (similar to what the lead dog in a junkyard would have).
Both had the same innate capabilities due to nature, but ended up with abilities at the opposite ends of the spectrum due to nurture.
This is something that happens a whole lot in real life, and a lot of 'smart' people and 'dumb' people (be it in intelligence, or more importantly in success levels if life ...whether you measure success by the Dollars one has in the bank, or how happy you are with your spouse, or how satisfied you are with your life) owe a lot MORE to nurture and such factors than to innate nature and such factors.
In the physical arena, one can look at the country of my birth ...Kenya. Due to the high altitude, people have a much higher level of oxygen carrying red cells, meaning their hemoglobin levels are high enough to almost classify some as mutants (this is why Kenyans are well associated with marathon runners). However, not every Kenyan is a marathon runner .....even those who live in the Highlands. Most do not even run ....thus, the innate potential is there, but the applied results are simply lacking!
Same thing when you move from East Africa to West Africa, where they have a lot of fast-twitch muscles, which helps them in sprints. This is why Nigerians in Africa, people from Jamaica and the Carribean (who originally came from West Africa), as well as African American sprinters (the vast majority of African Americans, almost all, came from West Africa) have extremely good sprint times. However, that doesn't mean anyone from Jamaica can break records, even though the general populace as a whole has fast twitch muscles!
Going to Clark and comparing him to Kallark, it is evident that Kallark was definitely based on the character of Clark (everything from power sets, to even the freaking name!)
Both have had some really major feats, with Superman easily having more (even if you ignore pre-Crisis feats, there are some post-Crisis Superman feats that are simply sick!) However, Gladiator also has some amazing feats, but he doesn't have enough of them due to the simple fact that he has never been a main character ....he was simply a character Marvel made to have a Superman-esque character in their stable, which every comic book company seems to have done one way or the other. Superman, on the other hand, is a primary character at DC, and obviously has had the full extent of his abilities explored (and more waiting in the wings, like his spittle being able to be used as a high density hyper fast armor destroying projectile ......simply by him spitting at someone)
We've seen how Superman would be if he was evil, if he was Soviet, if he was Nazi, etc etc etc. We've seen how he would be if he had no powers, and if his powers were overloaded.
Gladiator ....well, a character who can be pre-Crisis at one depiction, and in another being pwned by Colossus and Cannonball (with the explanation being 'level of confidence'😉.
Thus, Gladiator SHOULD be capable of the full range of abilities that Superman has ....since he is almost directly (apart from looks) based on Superman (many characters have been based on Clark, but none so much as Kallark ....it is just that he looks different). The capabilities are the same.
But just like Tony and Johnny ....for the purposes of this thread, while the innate capabilities are more than analogous (I'd say more or less equivalent, with variations depending on how extreme Superman is being, with Clark being able to go from a 'very powerful JLA member' all the way to a potential planet destroyer ....and how 'confident' or less confident Kallark is at the moment, with Kallark also being able to go from a 'very powerful team member' to a potential planet destroyer) ......however, Superman has easily shown more diversity of power, and his application has been much better.
But then again, this is what you get when one is a primary character in a major company (basically a flagship, with only Batman being a flagship of equal stature), and the other being a secondary (at best) or tertiary (in most cases) character in a major company with a list of primary characters.
Superman 'wins.'
Originally posted by Enyalus
Infinite pages in a finite space = impossible. I'm supposed to jump to the conclusion of something that's logical when the very concept of it is illogical?
Lulz .... Oh my god this could possibly be the most pot kettle statement I have ever read on this forum.
You do realise you are cuurently debating over agendas that are as quantifiable as Green is better than Blue ?
This guys subjective interpretation is better than this guys subjective intrepretation. 😘
Originally posted by spetznaz
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I agree with a lot oif what you have said, but in the end its entirely down to the context in which the writer is depicting that character, and what this character in question means to the writer. This of course is nearly entirely un quantifiable due to the scenarios subjectivity. However there are factors that can influence the writer; the book the character is likely to be seen, the grandeur of the scenario that character is likely to be up against, and the adversaries the character will face. About five years ago, I would have mentioned the company the character was associated with, through out the early 21 st century.C. was usually depicted on a slightly more powerful level, something that seems to have leveled off due to company inscestuality (I'm looking at you Dan Abnett, Grant Morison, Jeph Loeb etc). When you take this all into consideration, the likely hood is that Superman will always to depicted on a higher level.