Originally posted by cloud102
Val (post zero Hour) was able to tag Barry Allen type speedsters.
Originally posted by Enyalus
Gorgon just tagged a Flash-like speedster when she attempted to blitz him from behind. Obviously, she probably wasn't as fast as Flash, but meh. The standard Quicksilver/Speed Demon/Impulse/standard speedster animation.
Val was quick enough to handle TWO at the same time. HAHAHAHAHAHAAH!
Originally posted by Enyalus
Gorgon just tagged a Flash-like speedster when she attempted to blitz him from behind. Obviously, she probably wasn't as fast as Flash, but meh. The standard Quicksilver/Speed Demon/Impulse/standard speedster animation.
Yo-Yo tops out at 300 MPH.
She has nowhere near the speed of a Speed-force Speedster, a Kryptonian, or a Daxamite, all of which Val has tagged (or beaten), before.
Lets think this through. I'm a little drunk, and I'm not entirely sure myself, so I've just gave myself a shot of whiskey and am leaning back.
Okay. Karate Kid in the Silver age has some insane feats. He's tagged a speed-blitzing Superboy, he's shattered barriers made out of diamond or Promethium, and he's done insane, and sort of unbelievable things, like taking out the Emerald Eye from the Silver Age Fatal Five.
Gorgon, on the other hand, is CONSISTENT. Every time he's done something, it's been more or less around what we'd expect for him: basically taking out the Secret Warriors (which include the high-meta Daisy, the speedster Yo-Yo, the Sorcerer Supreme contender Druid, the descendant of what's-his-name Ghost Rider {Ketch?} and the freaking son of Ares who he just showed off to). And he's fought and beaten Daredevil, Elektra, and Wolverine, and even Fury is afraid of him.
Karate Kid, as insane as some of his feats are, does have some pretty terrible showings. We are talking about Silver Age Val, and everyone was kind of over-the-top in the Silver Age, but, still, even for the standards he did have some insanely low feats: losing to Timberwolf, getting owned by psi-powers in SECONDS, getting beat by Superboy without Superboy even realizing he had attacked (and that happened more than three times, by mind possessing Legion Villains... Universo et all).
The basic point I'm trying to get to is that "classic" Val really only the respect thread of awesome showings- and every other Legionaire had those, where they had impossible feats from their general power levels where they saved the rest of the Legion. Generally, Silver-Age Legion writers tried to keep everyone at the same level, from Superboy to Saturn Girl to Karate Kid, so everyone got those **** YEAH moments, even Matter-Eater-Lad.
So basically, what I'm saying is that just in order to hang with the Legion, Val needs some INSANE skills. He's better than Dragon, or Shiva, or Stick, or Wolverine.... but he's not Superboy level.
He'd win six out of ten times. And there is no one on this forum who has read more silver-age comics then me (at least for the Legion).
Okay. Karate Kid in the Silver age has some insane feats. He's tagged a speed-blitzing Superboy, he's shattered barriers made out of diamond or Promethium, and he's done insane, and sort of unbelievable things, like taking out the Emerald Eye from the Silver Age Fatal Five.
Not only diamond or "unbreakable" force fields, but also Interon. DC's Adimantium. Saturn Girl has stated that it was difficult to get inside Val's head, because of his intense training of the mind.
As for taking down Emerald Empress, he did it with ONE move. He heard her miles away. And she was described as the most deadly assassin during that time.
Silver Age Val would own Gorgon, IMO.
Gorgon stabbed Wolverine through his spine...HIS ADAMANTIUM SPINE.
He can also read his opponents thoughts, which lets him avoid there every move in combat, no matter how fast Val is, Gorgon will see what he wants to do, and counter, dodge, avoid, etc....
He can also move over short distances so fast it's like he teleports, if Logan couldn't track him, then he's fast.
And Smurph, he made an Opera at 6, he proved God's existence at around 13. ^_^
Originally posted by KingD19
Gorgon stabbed Wolverine through his spine...HIS ADAMANTIUM SPINE.He can also read his opponents thoughts, which lets him avoid there every move in combat, no matter how fast Val is, Gorgon will see what he wants to do, and counter, dodge, avoid, etc....
He can also move over short distances so fast it's like he teleports, if Logan couldn't track him, then he's fast.
And Smurph, he made an Opera at 6, he proved God's existence at around 13. ^_^
Val has also developed the ability to read movements. He also has countless martial arts that he has mastered throughout the universe.
Reading movements, and reading your enemies thoughts before they move are two different things. Gorgon could move to the left, but kick to the right, and he has sufficient martial arts abilities to land hits on Val. Gorgon on the other hand, knows what Val will do before he does it, which means there's really nothing he can do.