Originally posted by SamZED
Actually he most definitely was, almost always the case with mind controled heroes. Pete was shown resisting it too.
You sure? Cant recall that. Either way it was size of an average tank, bigger than some even.
He was punching Punisher through walls and across parking lots, launching him thousands of feat into the air and trying to smash him with cars....
Originally posted by SamZED
Actually he most definitely was, almost always the case with mind controled heroes. Pete was shown resisting it too.
It was different, he was in a bloody rage...
Originally posted by SamZED
You sure? Cant recall that. Either way it was size of an average tank, bigger than some even.
Yes, it was stated by Paladin. I've shown you this scan before:
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
He was punching Punisher through walls and across parking lots, launching him thousands of feat into the air and trying to smash him with cars....
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
It was different, he was in a bloody rage...
Originally posted by StiltmanFTWI have a terrible memory. That thing is still huge. Ive seen tanks that were smaller than the one Pete smashed. And it wasnt concidered mini.
Yes, it was stated by Paladin. I've shown you this scan before:
Originally posted by SamZED
He launched him into the air because he wanted to get him as far away as possible, to keep him safe. Sure he accidently ended up causing more damage but that was him fighting the mind control. SM can punch someone across a parking lot or through a wall while pulling his punches. I remember an old team up where a mind conttolled and supposedly bloodlusted Pete punched Johnny Storm in the face 3 or 4 times. Didnt even knock him out. Mind controlled heroes never fight all out in comics.
They never fight at at their best, but they don't restrict themselves (especially their strength) either.
HT has a few surprisingly good durability feats, so it's nothing new. Was his flame on? Not that it should matter much...
Originally posted by SamZED
I have a terrible memory.
That's what booze do to us. A blessing and a curse in one.
Originally posted by SamZED
That thing is still huge.
That's what she said! 😆
Originally posted by SamZED
Ive seen tanks that were smaller than the one Pete smashed. And it wasnt concidered mini.
on-panel statement > art 😛
Originally posted by StiltmanFTWOff. And unlike the Punisher fight Pete showed no hint of fighting the mind controle. I seriously doubt Johhny can take 4 all out punches from Pete one after another and remain alive let alone standing. Silver Sable recently beat mindcontrolled Cap. Spider-man took a punch from mindcontrolled Thor who also showed no hints of resisting it, yet Pete said he was subcounciously pulling his punches.
They never fight at at their best, but they don't restrict themselves (especially their strength) either.HT has a few surprisingly good durability feats, so it's nothing new. Was his flame on? Not that it should matter much...
Originally posted by StiltmanFTWmostly a blessing.😄
That's what booze do to us. A blessing and a curse in one.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTWLOL I kind of walked into that one.That's what she said! 😆
Originally posted by StiltmanFTWOne could call Betta Ray Bill a pony. But if it looks like a tank and weights like a tank.. its a tank. Also Paladin is no experts, he's guessing. Did I mention how impressed I am with your ability to find 20 year old scans in minutes?on-panel statement > art 😛
Originally posted by SamZED
Off. And unlike the Punisher fight Pete showed no hint of fighting the mind controle. I seriously doubt Johhny can take 4 all out punches from Pete one after another and remain alive let alone standing. Silver Sable recently beat mindcontrolled Cap. Spider-man took a punch from mindcontrolled Thor who also showed no hints of resisting it, yet Pete said he was subcounciously pulling his punches.
Damn. Who wrote that shit?
Great feat for Sable. When he was drugged, he got his ass beat by Black Widow and Diamondback.
OK, Thor example seems like a valid evidence...
Originally posted by SamZED
One could call Betta Ray Bill a pony. But if it looks like a tank and weights like a tank.. its a tank. Also Paladin is no experts, he's guessing. Did I mention how impressed I am with your ability to find 20 year old scans in minutes?
He was a pony on one Power Pack cover 😂
I'm gifted 😮💨
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
He's right, in comics characters actually tend to hold back when mind-controlled, enraged or not, due to them resisting the effects on some level. At the very least, there formidability drops.
True enough, but the stuff Spidy was doing in that particular example suggest that if he was holding back, it wasn't too much. That said there is a reason we don't put too much stock in mind controlled / brain washed fights, because one fighter is always off their game in those examples.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTWSlott. But no worries, it was stated that Cap's moving slower than usually and purposely givving Sable openings even while under the mind control. He also damaged Spider-man's webshooters with a shield toss iirc. So all in all not a bad showing for Cap. Slott is the man, he'd never let Cap look bad. 😎
Damn. Who wrote that shit?Great feat for Sable. When he was drugged, he got his ass beat by Black Widow and Diamondback.
OK, Thor example seems like a valid evidence...
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW😆 Forgot about that. I liked the issue where they teamed up with Wolverine.
He was a pony on one Power Pack cover 😂I'm gifted 😮💨
Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Yeah because Spidey has horrible showings against guns.
Yeah, totally http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8g3sqmCqy1qbeukyo2_1280.png
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Acid, multiple gun shots, stab wounds, explosions, punches from Captain America (who was trying to put him down), Daredevil (likewise trying to do the same), pretty sure he was set on fire once, blows from Spider-Man, etc.For a "peak street level human", Frank's damage soak may as well be superhuman.
Acid doesn't support being able to take punches without being koed or killed.
Stabs that actually penetrate the body doesn't either.
Spider-man>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>CA and Daredevil in strength. But still impressive. But know that characters operate with variable stats from comic to comic. A strong character can sometimes operate at a few thousand tons and other times in the millions. We should never assume that if a character tanks a punch from an opponent that they are tanking their best power shown (like Gladiator busting the planet, or Surfer busting a planet, etc.)
Spider-man always holds back against humans, otherwise he would splatter their heads killing them.
In this fight, Spider-man would do the same and give Punisher a good chance to win. But a CIS Spidey is another story.
My take on the fight is that Spidey wins mainly because of prep, speed, spidey sense, and reflexes. People are thinking only of Punisher with prep and actually forgetting that Spidey is hella powerful with prep himself. He's super smart for crying out loud.
Originally posted by cdtm
Issue/context?Spidey holds back for a reason.. Because, the one time he didn't, after he saw the results of what he did to Sin Eater, he recoiled in horror and jumped head first through a window.
Page before this one, was with a mind controlled Spidey, and the others who were more knowledgable than I were debating it - was just hoping someone could chime in with a succinct - its BS because XXX or whatever.
@cdtm
Punisher Annual. He was mind-controlled, so he could be subconsciously fighting it, but he was really sick of Frank's murdering spree, felt he had blood on his hands and wanted to kill him.
Castle later criticized him being so susceptible to mind control... it probably didn't take much to make him attack Frank, considering their history and Peter's feeling of guilt.
