Prof. X vs The Joker

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Why not?

Joker's consciousness is made up of his experiences and memories, all of whom Xavier can completely erase or rearrange.

Insanity may be the Joker's shtick, but it's not a power. DC just milks it to make him seem that much more threatening and interesting in a world full of others with actual powers.

A hell-bent Xavier should be more than able to cure the Joker's insanity, assuming there is no actual brain damage.

Xavier ftw, via mindwipe.

Originally posted by Galan007
yeah, that's the principle behind j'onn's TP as well - except it took all he had to make joker sane for just a few moments. trying to do so for any longer would have been impossible, as he put it.

i'm sorry, but where mental prowess is concerned, i refuse to believe xavier is that far above j'onn.

Maybe instead of trying to accept the possibility that Xavier is stronger than J'onn, you should realize how ridiculously simple it is for any experienced to telepath to change someone's memories. And that regardless of how cool people think said character is, his personality is the collective result of various experiences and memories.

Experiences and memories which can freely be manipulated by Xavier. the fact that J'onn did not succeeded was a gross error on the writer's side and a great lack of insight into the mechanics of telepathy. Either that or DC telepathy is completely different.

hokay now this is getting interesting.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Maybe instead of trying to accept the possibility that Xavier is stronger than J'onn, you should realize how ridiculously simple it is for any experienced to telepath to change someone's memories. And that regardless of how cool people think said character is, his personality is the collective result of various experiences and memories.

Experiences and memories which can freely be manipulated by Xavier. the fact that J'onn did not succeeded was a gross error on the writer's side and a great lack of insight into the mechanics of telepathy. Either that or DC telepathy is completely different.

I have no idea what he just said. I mean I ain't no college graduate or anything but....

Originally posted by Galan007
facepalm, no point in continuing.

Get off it asswipe, if you disagree then please try to provide something.

But if your only argument here is that because J'onn used his telepathy like an idiot, Xavier will fail, then don't bother posting.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Get off it asswipe, if you disagree then please try to provide something.

But if your only argument here is that because J'onn used his telepathy like an idiot, Xavier will fail, then don't bother posting.

anyway, you maintain that xavier would be able to make joker sane, despite the fact that j'onn could barely do so for a few moments - this would subsequently make xavier leaps and bounds above j'onn (TP-wise.) furthermore, you maintain that j'onn not being able to keep joker together for any longer than he did, can be credited solely to writer error.

if that is in fact what you believe, then my last post was perfectly reasonable. 🙂

Originally posted by Galan007
anyway, you maintain that xavier would be able to make joker sane, despite the fact that j'onn could barely do so for a few moments - this would subsequently make xavier leaps and bounds above j'onn (TP-wise.) furthermore, you maintain that j'onn not being able to keep joker together for any longer than he did, can be credited solely to writer error.

How did J'onn try to make the Joker sane? how did he try to alter his personality?

I just think that when you compare the Prof with J'onn, it's like compareing two scientists in two different fields of science. Prof. is in the field of repairing minds and J'onn isn't.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
How did J'onn try to make the Joker sane? how did he try to alter his personality?

Originally posted by Galan007
by controling the info reaching his brain. that's why joker started realizing all the evil things he's done over the years. thing is, the hold over joker's mind couldn't be maintained for any longer than it took for him to hand over the rock (seconds.)

Based on this you don't believe it's possible to alter his personality by eliminating memories?

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Based on this you don't believe it's possible to alter his personality by eliminating memories?

Originally posted by Galan007
i don't think xavier would be able to maintain control over joker's mind long enough for him to do that.

There's no talk of control.

He enters, erases the proper memories and exits. Once this has happened the memories won't magically return, they're gone, the joker is permanently altered.

Prof. X apparently can control all the minds of the world if he wanted too.

He's not telepathically controlling the joker, he's altering him. Editing stuff inside his mind. There's no resisting it or willing things back.

Usually what Prof. does is he goes in a mind and helps the patient help himself. The Joker has so many demons and stuff in his head, he'd probably try to find the guy the Joker used to be hidden in his head and help him break out.

Originally posted by PRAYERRUN
Usually what Prof. does is he goes in a mind and helps the patient help himself. The Joker has so many demons and stuff in his head, he'd probably try to find the guy the Joker used to be hidden in his head and help him break out.

If we're factoring in the Xavier's personality then he would most likely fail. Setting the Joker straight would require too much alteration and it would be ethically wrong.

true...except the fact that J'onn was able to control The Joker for that second proves to me that the guy that the Joker used to be is still in there. All Prof has to do is find him.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
There's no talk of control.

He enters, erases the proper memories and exits. Once this has happened the memories won't magically return, they're gone, the joker is permanently altered.

Originally posted by Galan007
it seems [to me at least] that singling out and altering specific memories in the 'thunderstorm' that is joker's mind, would denote some form of mental control. how else could one solely target his thoughts/memories, without gaining hold over them?

Not unless the Joker has sustained some actual, physical injuries to his mind. In which case telepathy would not be able to mend the injuries.