i'm just glad we've finally seen the vaunted 'scream', even if it left me feeling like it wasn't really worth the wait. and if by 'holding back' you mean he didn't scream right from the start, that's ridiculous. bb NEVER screams. ever. he was in no other way that i could see holding back. vulcan also wasn't able to use enough power to destroy the ship--he thought it was a bomb too. bb immediately used his electron manip (which IS his traditional weapon of choice, and one that has owned people like the hulk, easily) but it was useless against vulcan. vulcan was clearly much stronger than bb, another very impressive feat. you think bb just . . . LET vulcan pound his face to mush? c'mon now. the ONLY thing he held back was his scream, and even THAT (one of the most feared attacks in marvel) opened up right in vulcan's face, didn't end vulcan. i don't get where people are saying it was clear he 'held back' at all, nor, after all the talk and speculation, i was all that impressed with 'the scream'. too much hype maybe . . . 😬
Originally posted by leonidas
i'm just glad we've finally seen the vaunted 'scream', even if it left me feeling like it wasn't really worth the wait. and if by 'holding back' you mean he didn't scream right from the start, that's ridiculous. bb NEVER screams. ever. he was in no other way that i could see holding back. vulcan also wasn't able to use enough power to destroy the ship--he thought it was a bomb too. bb immediately used his electron manip (which IS his traditional weapon of choice, and one that has owned people like the hulk, easily) but it was useless against vulcan. vulcan was clearly much stronger than bb, another very impressive feat. you think bb just . . . LET vulcan pound his face to mush? c'mon now. the ONLY thing he held back was his scream, and even THAT (one of the most feared attacks in marvel) opened up right in vulcan's face, didn't end vulcan. i don't get where people are saying it was clear he 'held back' at all, nor, after all the talk and speculation, i was all that impressed with 'the scream'. too much hype maybe . . . 😬
Finally someone with sense. BB has never used his scream so when he pummels Hulk, Sentry and other characters he mostly uses his energy manipulationa, and a little whisper here and there.
Vulcan takes this. He can take the strongest BB can dish out, and come back as a living crisp and still beat the hell out of him. BB need to scream to put him down for a couple of panels lol
Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
BB's easiest way of winning this fight would be to fight physically.That's Vulcan's foil, I mean, Gladiator put him down physically, Vulcan didn't have a defence when Warlock stopped using magic and just punched him in the face, etc...
You act like Adam Warlock isn't superhumanly strong or anything. Gladiator is stronger than 99% of people in the Marvel Universe bar omnipotents.
Vulcan beat BB down physically while both were amped
Originally posted by Peterlane
You act like Adam Warlock isn't superhumanly strong or anything. Gladiator is stronger than 99% of people in the Marvel Universe bar omnipotents.
Vulcan beat BB down physically while both were amped
I know both of them are superhumanely strong, my point is Vulcan isn't.
And Vulcan didnt't beat BB purely physically, there was energy flying everywhere dfuring their fight...
Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
I know both of them are superhumanely strong, my point is Vulcan isn't.And Vulcan didnt't beat BB purely physically, there was energy flying everywhere dfuring their fight...
Read the fight again on their respective respect threads. Vulcan amped himseld and beat BB physically. It was a combo of both on both sides.
i agree that vulcan seemed to be the stronger of the 2, but i could see why bb would have thought the physical approach would have served him well. the hulk has never come close to doing to bb physically what vulcan did though. obviously he was amping his strength with energy, but still, that was an inpressive physical display.
as for the fight--i think bb would actually win a forum match. gabe was ko'd long enough to give bb a win. i suppose bb could just keep screaming, but i don't know to what extent vulcan could keep returning. it also seems really uinlikely that bb would simply stand there and just keep screaming again and again . . .
I don't see BB's scream as a viable tactic against Vulcan really.
continuous use would only lead to the rapid fatigue of BB and a quicker victory for Vulcan.
as I said previously, Vulcan wasn't showing his durability or even a "healing factor" in taking the scream, he was showing that he is a master of his own energies... enough so that he can reform from it, almost instantly.
whatever pain Vulcan suffers as a result of BB's scream, will diminish as it continues (as you can always adjust to levels of pain), but NO actual damage will be done (as Vulcan's body is just energy).
of course, I'm just commenting on the basis of this fight but, Vulcan did explain the deal to BB.
Originally posted by leonidasThe only sense in which Black Bolt really appeared to hold back was that BB was trying to leave after he had shouted in Vulcan's face.
i'm just glad we've finally seen the vaunted 'scream', even if it left me feeling like it wasn't really worth the wait. and if by 'holding back' you mean he didn't scream right from the start, that's ridiculous. bb NEVER screams. ever. he was in no other way that i could see holding back. vulcan also wasn't able to use enough power to destroy the ship--he thought it was a bomb too. bb immediately used his electron manip (which IS his traditional weapon of choice, and one that has owned people like the hulk, easily) but it was useless against vulcan. vulcan was clearly much stronger than bb, another very impressive feat. you think bb just . . . LET vulcan pound his face to mush? c'mon now. the ONLY thing he held back was his scream, and even THAT (one of the most feared attacks in marvel) opened up right in vulcan's face, didn't end vulcan. i don't get where people are saying it was clear he 'held back' at all, nor, after all the talk and speculation, i was all that impressed with 'the scream'. too much hype maybe . . . 😬
If the circumstances hadn't interrupted, perhaps BB would have taken the time, while Vulcan was out of commision, to use his electron abilities to scatter Vulcan's atoms to the cosmos, or transmute him, or something similar.
As for strength, I don't think it was clear at all that Vulcan was actually stronger. I think he got better hits in in this fight, but I think it was unclear whether Black Bolt's energy strikes and punches were actually inferior, or whether he simply connected with less of them. Black Bolt WAS superior in the beginning of the fight, but Vulcan got the upper hand once he began his spiel about the bomb-ship.
As for the shout being unimpressive, I completely disagree. Vulcan had shrugged off every energy attack thus far, and was basically laughing off Black Bolt's considerably formidable electron manipulation powers. Vulcan was also taking punches that we've seen rock people like Gladiator and Hulk.
In the single shout, Black Bolt released enough energy to overwhelm Vulcan and fry him to a crisp. Considering he overwhelmed an omega-level energy manipulator, and basically the antithesis to Black Bolt's powers, I think it's a very impressive feat.
I think in a forum fight, Black Bolt could hit him with a similar shout, or perhaps something even stronger, and KO Vulcan right away. Even if that wasn't a technical win, Black Bolt could then scatter his atoms, and keep them that way to stop him from reforming.
Anyways, seeing Black Bolt's shout was able to completely decimate an omega level energy manipulator, I think it was a decent showing. Perhaps not everything we had hoped for, but I consider any faults to simply be a very high showing for Vulcan- surely if he could laugh off Black Bolt's other electron manipulations, he could have taken some of the brunt of this blast?
Originally posted by Original Smurph
As for the shout being unimpressive, I completely disagree. Vulcan had shrugged off every energy attack thus far, and was basically laughing off Black Bolt's considerably formidable electron manipulation powers. Vulcan was also taking punches that we've seen rock people like Gladiator and Hulk.In the single shout, Black Bolt released enough energy to overwhelm Vulcan and fry him to a crisp. Considering he overwhelmed an omega-level energy manipulator, and basically the antithesis to Black Bolt's powers, I think it's a very impressive feat.
meh. havoc overwhelmed him as well. so did the eldest. 😬
over the years we've sort of been led to believe it was this . . . massive attack. it didn't even disintegrate vulcan. like i said, i would have found the attack far more impressive were it not for all the hype (i remember the celestials supposedly taking note of it, etc . . .) that has surrounded it for so long.
i also think it was reasonably clear that vulcan was physically dominant in that fight.
Havok had sundipped to reach levels of power that we've never seen from him before or since, I believe. I don't actually know the other instance that you're talking about.
Those feats that gave the voice hype still exist, including the abstract taking notice when he was about to scream. This one feat would just be a low showing, if you feel it's a let down- it's not like Black Bolt's voice doesn't have other low showings. One feat of a shout doesn't define the level of power that his voice emits at max, when we have so many other feats at varying levels. IMO, anyways.
It seemed to me that Vulcan was portrayed much more powerfully recently, and perhaps throughout these latest arcs, than he had been previously. I guess it seems to me that he's starting to realize his Omega potential.
If Vulcan goes on to become a ridiculously powerful energy manipulator, then this wouldn't actually be a low feat. It just seems speculatory to me to label Black Bolt's shout as anything until we see either more feats of it, or more feats of Vulcan.
Either way though, everybody has low feats, so meh. It is what it is.
Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
A lot of the shout would have been absorbed by the T-bomb device wouldn't it? Then expelled as the explosion whem the bomb blew...
Correct. IIRC it was only at 39% before Black Bolt charged it up with his scream. Meaning that a good 61% of that explosion came from Black Bolt's scream